Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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It is not in my intention to "google my way to salvation", but rather I am trying to reach an understanding in accordance to the bible. For me, salvation comes within the understanding of the bible. The full text of the scripture is as follows: "And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God". But still, my question stands. I am hoping you could explain to me how it is in agreement to this thread. Thank you for helping me out. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Please be honest: this is where the rubber meets the road. YiC, Zech |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
What I do understand so far, is that Jesus took pity on the poor and blessed them with the kingdom of God (specially his disciples as they were the ones that Jesus was addressing).
Also, I am quite sure that there is also passage during the last supper of Jesus ans his disciples, when Jesus said something to Judas before Judas leaves in order to betray Jesus. The disciples that was with Jesus during this event, assumed that Judas left because either Jesus had commanded him to buy supplies or give money to the poor. The point is that Jesus' disciples had expectations that Jesus commanded Judas to give money to the poor, showing that they believe Jesus have compassion for the poor or at least pity. I am not a bible expert so I cannot quote the exact texts on command or tell which exact scripture was it from. But because you had been pointing out my reliance on google to find texts I had read before but not memorized, I did not search for the said text. But if you want, I can find it and post it here. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
About the contradictory thing, no, I do not believe the Bible would contradict itself. I have great respect for it and I believe it is the guide to truth.
On that point, I have yet to read a Bible qoute on this thread that points out that the God condemns or hates the poor. In fact I just remembered a law in ancient Israel I have read once. It tells about the way farmers should gather their crops (i am not sure of the plant mentioned). I believe it mentions about how farmers should not go back and get the missed (or fallen) grains to gather them so poor people (again not sure without researching, but i think its widows?) can take them so they have something to eat. If you want, I can take my time to do research. But I am quite sure you remember about it. Again, I do not claim myself any expert on anything, just somebody who wants to learn. I just read a lot and had gathered my own understanding of the bible. Its just I want guidance in understanding it, because as a human being i am bound to make mistakes or misunderstand God's word. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
My concern about this is the way long time members of this forum view the poor. I believe that the bible and God takes pity and even blesses the poor with His kingdom. The behavior of most of the members here are not in accordance or in the footsteps of Jesus. I have seen them post how the poor are vermin and vile beings, and that God will kill them in his own time.
I am searching for the truth and therefore, I need to know if I am in the wrong viewpoint or I have yet to find the Truth in another place. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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First off, if you know grammer, then you can say it like a conversation "And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples," This means God raised His eyes at Hie disciples. Typically thing means indignant. "and said, " I hope this is pretty clear "Blessed be ye poor" Here is saying you are fortunate to have poor people "for yours is the kingdom of God". Your homes are mine. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
If you would read the Bible instead of fixating, you might of found this:
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In the Scripture you quote, Jesus is speaking specifically to His disciples. He is not saying, "Blessed are ALL THE poor". No, He's saying, "Blessed are YOU poor". In other words, "You, disciples, who gave up your possessions to follow me, are blessed even though you lack earthly wealth, because you will inherit the kingdom of God". It doesn't mean, "All poor people go to Heaven"! |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Show me a poor person who hasn't died and I will accept your point. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Also, may I qoute with its correct context Proverbs 14:20-21 Quote:
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Proverbs 14:20
The poor is hated even of his own neighbour: but the rich hath many friends. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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And let me just say, thanks for James Hutchins for pointing out this bible text for me. I am no expert so I do not know everything and his bible qoute earlier helped me find it. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
21 He that despiseth his neighbour sinneth:
But he that hath mercy on the poor, happy is he. Two messages here both plain and simple. 1)Do not despise your neighbour. This simply means you have to live next ti them. Until you can make them move, do not give them cause to harass you. The second part is just as simple. 2)It means have mercy (feel sorry for) the poor as they are too stupid to know any better. Again, do not 'read into it', the Bible is plain, simple and direct. |
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Also, examining other translations, the word used in the original Proverbs can be translated to mercy (KJV). But it does not stop to being mercyful. In other translation Quote:
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God can read all of our hearts, and so he judges accordingly. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Anothe bible verse I found while reading the Proverbs 14:31,
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
I just discovered a very good functio of biblegateway.com that allows me to search a term and show me all of verses it was mentioned on.
Here are a few I found when I researched the word "poor". Please read them all as they are instructions from GOD. Please take note that all the texts are not in complete context as everyone can read the whole context on their own. Exodus 23:11, Leviticus 19:10, Leviticus 23:22 - As what I have mentioned earlier about the farming methids of the israelites. Leviticus 14:21, Leviticus 14:21, Leviticus 27:8 - It shows how the poor are given consideration in serving God, showing they are all in equal footing with rich man in front of God and letting them to worship and sacrifice what they can afford. Deuteronomy 15:7, Deuteronomy 15:11 - How the poor are given help, not just ignored. 1 Samuel 2:8 = The priveledge of the poor. The list goes on and it would be too exhaustive to list them all. Do a search of all verses if you are interested to learn more. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
I like it how people here are ignoring comments, especially ones that are riddled with Bible texts if they are posted by non-longtime members of this forum.
Brother Percy, i also learned humility when I have read 1 Samuel 2:8. I hope you enjoy the same lesson I have learned. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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You are confusing the issue here. Yes, compassion should be shown to the poor. Just we TRUE Christians™ know the best way to help the poor is teach them to ask for jobs and not welfare checks. Some times it takes tough love to deliver these messages. We want the poor to self-deport themselves from poverty. The question this thread raises is about the greedy poor? Those poor people who want to steal the food from the table of hard working American executives. The poor who think they should be given welfare, foodstamps, unemployment, health care and steaks because they live in this great country and that CEO trashed the company they work for. That friend is just theft. We both agree theft is wrong friend? |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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I do understand that there are poor people that are simply lazy and are sinners. But, not all poor are sinners and not all of them are lazy. But the hate and generalization of all the poor I have witnessed in this thread is simply against the Bible, as shown in those verses I have mentioned. Quote:
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Again, 1 Samuel 2:8 shows that the poor and rich are equal in front of God as He set them on thrones among princes. |
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God doesn't love everyone. Just potentially. |
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And I believe I also mentioned my agreement that the poor who are simply lazy and sinners are not saved. Nowhere did I mention random hobos especially lazy ones that are saved. The whole point of my posts are about the generalization(both sinners and non-sinners) and the hate centered towards the poor, which is in contempt of the scriptures I have posted earlier. |
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Poor people do not try hard. That is why they are poor. I work six days a week, 16 hours a day, every day since I was a child. My field workers work just 12 hours a day, six days a week. The lesson here is you must put out the effort if you want the just rewards that God will provide the righteous.:innocent: |
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As I have repeated again and again, my point is that this forum generalized all poor people into lazy and sinners and hated by God for being poor and such generalization and hate comments about them are against the scriptures I quoted. I had to disagree with you on the note that poor people do not try hard. Some poor families juggle 2-4 jobs and still at loss how to make thing meet. Perhaps they did not have the chance for any sort of education, but they follow God's word. According to the generalization of this thread, since they are poor, they are vermin and will not receive God's favor. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
If you want to debate people, THIS is the place to go.
Please make a thread of your own in the "Introductions" section of the forum, so that we can properly greet you. Tell us about yourself, your church, and how you came to find Jesus. And if you're here to flame us, better take a look at THIS before making an even bigger ass out of yourself. :rtfm: |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Are you sure that every single one of the people (more than 200) that work for you have sinned against you by not earning their honest day's pay? Could it be that perhaps you caught 100 people who have abused their privileges and the other 100 is innocent of your allegation? If that would be true, you are damning the whole for the misdemeanor don by the few. Thus labeling them all as lazy would be incorrect.
Let us just say that all of your workers and lazy and you are correct in labeling them as such, this does not make it true for all poor people. Have you considered Christians that are under pressure by dictatorship government and they had disallowed Christian worship in that nation. And part of the dictator's punishment for them is strip them all of their belongings, including food, change of clothes and shelter. They are now considered poor, hungry and homeless. Had you seen them on the street begging for food because they can't work because they haven't eaten for days, would you stop and give them something to eat even if you don't know that they are Christians themselves? Another hypothetical situation: He had known no other life than begging since he was a child. But suddenly, he comes to know about Jesus Christ and he wanted to change. He cannot find work because he have no decent clothes and no place would be willing to hire a beggar. He stays poor and dirty. Would you welcome him as a brother if he comes into your midst claiming he is a Christian despite being poor and dirty and homeless? One more hypothetical situation and the last: If a soldier fighting for a righteous cause got hurt in battle. He cannot find or do work because of his disability. Neither he have a brothers nor sisters nor parents he can turn to for help. He has to feed 3 children and he is at his ends wit how to make end things meet. Thus he is considered poor. How would you help him? Quote:
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
We have surveillance cameras on all the fields as well as RFID neck collars. The system tracks movement and records a ID number anytime a person is not moving at least 2mph. So yes, we know when these people slack off. My family has to sped all their free time herding these layabouts. All of them are in debt to JHP, LLC and will likely never fully repay the debt. I have to eventually absorb the loss. You now it feels like every one of them dies here? I take a straight financial loss and then have to transport the body to potters field. All because these heathens refuse to give themselves to Jesus.
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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I'll never understand why all these heathens do is drink the cheap rot gut from the Plantation store and complain. As most here know, a new employee is issued a pair of pants, a shirt, a pair of boot, a pair of gloves and a paperback copy of the KJV Bible. I sell these items to these 'people' at cost plus. I offer a place with a roof over their heads to sleep and spend their free time in. There are cots do rent as well as gently used blankets. Yet still, they spend more than they earn. The field bosses never tell me the workers discuss the Bible or how grateful they are. All these workers do is hiss in low tones. I will say, a few times I have driven by the chicken coops, I have heard exclamations of "Praise Jesus" and "Halp me Lordie, Halp me!!!" or "Dios Mio Jesus!!" so I guess a little bit of God is getting into them. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Christ said it is easier for a camel to go through an eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven.
The Bible contains more than 300 verses on the poor, social justice, and God's deep concern for both. Prov. 29:7. The righteous is concerned for the rights of the poor; the wicked does not understand such concern. Luke 6:20-21. Blessed are you who are poor, for yours in the kingdom of God. Blessed are you who hunger now, for you shall be satisfied. Blessed are you who weep now, for you shall laugh. James 2:5. Did not God choose the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him? Luke 12:33. "Sell your possessions and give to charity; make yourselves purses which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near, nor moth destroys." Prov. 19:17. He who is gracious to a poor man lends to the LORD, and He will repay him for his good deed. Luke 12:44. "Sell your possessions and give alms; make yourselves purses which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near, nor moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also." And you call yourselves "true Christians" PAH!! |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
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Explain. |
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If we did not care, this thread would not exist. Your words hurt friend, they cut at my heart. |
Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Interestingly enough, Ayn Rand, author of Atlas Shrugged and among the most famous Americans to ever argue in support of greed, was a self-described atheist.
While I agree with the sentiments expressed by the individual who started this thread, since they are pretty much word-for-word Ayn Rand, I thought I should point out this strange fact. As a longtime fan of Rand's work, I sometimes feel as though her work begs the question of whether it is possible for a person to be a messenger of the Lord here on earth without that person even knowing it. Anyone with an opinion on that question (I don't know the answer - although her work makes a compelling case for the possibility), your insights are much appreciated. |
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Re: Selfishness makes America GREAT, except for the GREEDY poor!
Ayn Rand was a WOMAN????????????:fear2:
Has anyone ever flipped her over and checked? |
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