[Fencepost88]

Ok, why isn't that evolution? God changed one person and their spawn were forever altered, they were a new species of man, a mutation.

[Redeemed Papist]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Ok, why isn't that evolution? God changed one person and their spawn were forever altered, they were a new species of man, a mutation.

There you go again. It's not evolution because it's God's will and the work of our great designer rather than the work of random chance by natural selection that Darwin proposed.

You're just attaching misnomers to actual events caused by God and getting all confused.

It's like me saying I drove to work in my aeroplane. I should really be saying car but because I don't know the difference I say the wrong word. Does it really matter? We both know what I really meant because I just explained it to you.

Now try having the remark taken out of context and see how many people think I'm a pilot of a plane who is confused and said drove instead of flew. How will they tell the difference without the more detailed knowledge?

This is why saying silly erroneous things like "God caused evolution and this is my own special meaning for evolution" is so silly.

So stop it; you're making a monkey out of yourself. (Creationist joke there )

[Fencepost88]

So stop it; you're making a monkey out of yourself. (Creationist joke there )

That's pretty funny

See you are doing exactly what you are accusing me of, I said random mutation, not natural selection, they are two completely seperate things, natural selection would be something that occurs long after random mutation. point to an instance when I have used the words natural selection and I will apologise for it.

Now then if God creates a new race of man from the offspring of another race of man is that not mutation, has the human race not evolved?

Mutation: A distinct form resulting from such a change

Evolution: The gradual development of something, esp. from a simple to a more complex form.

Darwins theory of evolution does not define evolution, if you looked into it you'd find there are many different theories of evolution, stop assuming I agree 100% with darwinism and start reading what I'm actually writing.

[Redeemed Papist]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

That's pretty funny

See you are doing exactly what you are accusing me of, I said random mutation, not natural selection, they are two completely seperate things, natural selection would be something that occurs long after random mutation. point to an instance when I have used the words natural selection and I will apologise for it.

Now then if God creates a new race of man from the offspring of another race of man is that not mutation, has the human race not evolved?

Mutation: A distinct form resulting from such a change

Evolution: The gradual development of something, esp. from a simple to a more complex form.

Darwins theory of evolution does not define evolution, if you looked into it you'd find there are many different theories of evolution, stop assuming I agree 100% with darwinism and start reading what I'm actually writing.

I'm assuming you're a bit crazy and determined to shoehorn the Bible into fitting whatever warped pseudo-science makes sense in your brain.

The finer details of your nonsense really don't matter because if God made us in His image then tinkered with us endlessly so we suddenly grew extra bits or less bits or different sized bits just to see if it worked out or not don't you think he'd have told us?

By the way, where did you get your definition of mutation from?

A Mutation occurs when a DNA gene is damaged or changed in such a way as to alter the genetic message carried by that gene.

Your pet scientists think it's the above (whatever that's supposed to mean!)

You seem to think it's more like God is playing at rewriting the X men or something.

Why not stop trying to imagine what it would be like if the world matched the inside of your head, accept the Bible for what it actually is and get out there and live your life like God says you should?



A mutation, yesterday.

[MitzaLizalor]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Aren't there aspects of the theory of evolution covered in the bible?

e.g.,
Adam and Noah - proving that we are all descended from a common ancestor.

Shem, Ham, and Japheth - being the fathers of different nations lends to the evolutionist theory of 'random mutation' being that an entirely new species is created from an offspring having different characteristics from it's parents.

That idea is NOT presented in The Bible. As for "science" the fundamental tenet is that ALL humans are the SAME SPECIES. We are "cross fertile" whatever you're reading is rubbish did you get it from a state school.

[Fencepost88]

Originally Posted by Redeemed Papist

I'm assuming you're a bit crazy and determined to shoehorn the Bible into fitting whatever warped pseudo-science makes sense in your brain.

I'm not trying to make the bible fit into any of my 'warped pseudo-science' I'm merely stating that the basic definitions of evolution and mutation occur in the bible. note basic not scientific.

The finer details of your nonsense really don't matter because if God made us in His image then tinkered with us endlessly so we suddenly grew extra bits or less bits or different sized bits just to see if it worked out or not don't you think he'd have told us?

Genesis 1:14
And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:

although it's not written it is implied that before this the serpent did not move on it's belly (else it's not much of a punishment)

and we've already discussed God creating the different races of man so where hasn't he told us this?

By the way, where did you get your definition of mutation from?



Your pet scientists think it's the above (whatever that's supposed to mean!)

Like I said basic definition.

You seem to think it's more like God is playing at rewriting the X men or something.

Why not stop trying to imagine what it would be like if the world matched the inside of your head, accept the Bible for what it actually is and get out there and live your life like God says you should?

Why are you so sure that the lord hasn't tinkered around with what he has made?

Genesis 18:14
Is any thing too hard for the LORD? At the time appointed I will return unto thee, according to the time of life, and Sarah shall have a son.

admittedly this verse has little to do with evolution but the majority of Genesis 18 is God saying 'so what if sarah was barren and has hit her menopause she can have a child if I so wish.' My conclusion God can re-write nature whenever he pleases, especially evident by the first 8 words 'Is any thing too hard for the LORD?'

Romans 1:20
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

why are you so quick to judge people who make observations about the invisible things of creation. Humans have the capacity to err so I don't believe 100% that darwins theory or any other theory has it correct but to say that it is totally incorrect and every living thing on earth has remained unchanged for 6000 years is to ignore the bible and the changes you can observe with you're own two eyes everyday.

[Fencepost88]

oh and I forgot one more point someone said that Adam and Eve were the first and not the only humans implying we could be descended from other humans, neglecting the obvious that the bible states were all descended from Noah, if we are not all descended from Adam then original sin holds no water Jesus becomes redundant and some of us should still be permitted to live in the garden of eden. Although it is safe to say that's all personal conjecture and God could of course operate on the 'once bitten, twice shy' principle and not allow any man into the garden of eden regardless of whether they are descended from Adam. Might also explain why some people have no understanding of good and evil, naturism and the ilk.

[James Hutchins]

Friend, who is Noah descended from?

Imagine this, a catlick comes into your home on Christmas day, killing your entire family (all grandparents, parents, cousins, siblings and so on) in a massive bloody mess. Only you survive. Does not the family lineage, (ie, the lineage of Adam and Eve) still carry on?

[Fencepost88]

Yes. that was my point.

so you agree that the Bible says we all come from a common ancestor?

further to that as we all don't look the same, changes (or mutations) must have happened along the way. as has been pointed out alot of these changes are explained in the bible, and those that are not have not necessarily been disputed by the bible i.e., evolution is in the bible. maybe not Darwin's theory in it's entirety but the bible says that there has been evolution of at least (so far as I have read) Humans and serpents.

[Bobby-Joe]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Yes. that was my point.

so you agree that the Bible says we all come from a common ancestor?

further to that as we all don't look the same, changes (or mutations) must have happened along the way. as has been pointed out alot of these changes are explained in the bible, and those that are not have not necessarily been disputed by the bible i.e., evolution is in the bible. maybe not Darwin's theory in it's entirety but the bible says that there has been evolution of at least (so far as I have read) Humans and serpents.

Aw come on.

How many freaking times do we have to go over and over the point the Bible holds that "mutations" are curses from God for sin? Serious, we have to do this about every page in these threads because so called "rationalists" like you such lazy, incurious, Anime frapping addicted idiots to be bothered to read an intro to Creationism. I really don't care if you accept the Bible's explanation (which doubtlessly as kind of twit you are, you will now write an easy on your personal fee's fees about it) but it's not to much to ask that you know The Bible says that, you ignoramus.

Really, you are getting to be waste of our time. Move it along or we will shut you up.

[Didymus Much]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Yes. that was my point...

That if you redefine words to mean what you want them to mean instead of meaning what the rest of humanity has agreed are the actual meanings, then anything you say can be "true"?

Well, then, yes.

(Please note in the sentence above I redefined "true" to mean "false". If this causes you any confusion then you're just too stupid to follow the conversation).

[James Hutchins]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Yes. that was my point.

so you agree that the Bible says we all come from a common ancestor?

further to that as we all don't look the same, changes (or mutations) must have happened along the way. as has been pointed out alot of these changes are explained in the bible, and those that are not have not necessarily been disputed by the bible i.e., evolution is in the bible. maybe not Darwin's theory in it's entirety but the bible says that there has been evolution of at least (so far as I have read) Humans and serpents.

Of course, God created all of us. There is only one God so you are correct.

There is no chance of eviloution, Adam and Eve (Noah too) were not apes. Like say 'pie in the sky'. You do not honestly beleive there is a steaming hot pie all sliced up waiting for you in the sky, do you?

[Zechariah Smyth]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

Yes. that was my point.

so you agree that the Bible says we all come from a common ancestor?

further to that as we all don't look the same, changes (or mutations) must have happened along the way. as has been pointed out alot of these changes are explained in the bible, and those that are not have not necessarily been disputed by the bible i.e., evolution is in the bible. maybe not Darwin's theory in it's entirety but the bible says that there has been evolution of at least (so far as I have read) Humans and serpents.

So, my kids all look a little different because they are MUTANTS?



Too much X-Men, son. Waaaaaay too much.

YiC,

Zech

[MitzaLizalor]

Originally Posted by Fencepost88

so you agree that the Bible says we all come from a common ancestor?

Do you think you've achieved something????

We have never disputed what The Bible teaches: that we are all descended from Adam.

For the literacy-challenged “we are all descended from Adam” and “Adam was our common ancestor” both mean the same thing.

[Redeemed Papist]

Mitza,
He thinks that that gives credence to the idea that therefore our common ancestor that God neglected to mention was some fish and then, if you go back far enough, some slime.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Fencepost88]

Originally Posted by James Hutchins

Of course, God created all of us. There is only one God so you are correct.

There is no chance of eviloution, Adam and Eve (Noah too) were not apes. Like say 'pie in the sky'. You do not honestly beleive there is a steaming hot pie all sliced up waiting for you in the sky, do you?

1. I never said they were apes
2. The commonly held opinion of evolution is not that we are descended from apes but that we share a common ancestor with apes.
3. to say there is no chance of something happening is to completely misunderstand the meaning of chance.

Originally Posted by Zechariah Smyth

So, my kids all look a little different because they are MUTANTS?



Too much X-Men, son. Waaaaaay too much.

YiC,

Zech

your kids look a little different because there is variation in their ancestry. i.e., you and your wife are not exact clones of each other, neither were your childrens grandparents and so on. Mutations happened along the way. Being by Gods hand does not change the fact that it was a mutation. If I made a cup of coffee would you deny that alterations were made to the base ingredients just because it might somehow detract from the fact that I made it?

Originally Posted by MitzaLizalor

Do you think you've achieved something????

We have never disputed what The Bible teaches: that we are all descended from Adam.

For the literacy-challenged “we are all descended from Adam” and “Adam was our common ancestor” both mean the same thing.

Ok, someone did earlier, they said that Adam and Eve were the first and not the only humans implying there were other humans we could be descended from.

Originally Posted by Redeemed Papist

Mitza,
He thinks that that gives credence to the idea that therefore our common ancestor that God neglected to mention was some fish and then, if you go back far enough, some slime.
Posted via Mobile Device

I think it gives credence to the idea that we are not God's original design of man, that is all, I am not trying to prove evolution right, I'm just curious as to why you're all so opposed to the idea when it is in the bible.

I think God will neglect to mention what he pleases. Do we have the right to know everything about his creation?

Genesis 1:26
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

notice here how he 'neglects' to mention what his image is. You accuse me of making assumptions when I have not assumed anything, I refuse to make any kind of guess as to what the first man looked like but assuming he was an aryan caucasian is as bad as assuming he was a piece of slime.

And as you seem so kind to remind me of the same points over and over again, I do not believe Darwin's theory of evolution!

[thworral]

Can you not all see that you CAN fit all this in with the Christian bible? All you need to do is see that the bible was NOT meant to be taken literally. They are stories about how to live your life. Disregarding science is ignorant, and anyone who tells you too is the real Satan.

[Didymus Much]

Originally Posted by thworral

...All you need to do is see that the bible was NOT meant to be taken literally...

*sigh* So how do you tell which bits are true and which aren't?

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by thworral

Can you not all see that you CAN fit all this in with the Christian bible? All you need to do is see that the bible was NOT meant to be taken literally. They are stories about how to live your life. Disregarding science is ignorant, and anyone who tells you too is the real Satan.

Please make a thread of your own in the "Introductions" section of the forum, so that we can properly greet you. Tell us about yourself, your church, and how you came to find Jesus.

And if you're here to flame us, better take a look at THIS before making an even bigger ass out of yourself.

[Fencepost88]

Originally Posted by thworral

...the bible was NOT meant to be taken literally. They are stories about how to live your life...

Semantically null. Anything that tells you what to do is meant to be taken literally.