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Creation Science The origins of life and the earth from a creationist (Biblical) perspective.

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  #81  
Old 02-05-2008, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by sinner View Post
Only fools, Atheists, Cathewlics, Democrats, Communists, Muslims and colored Negros would believe that the Earth is round! Ha ha ha...such heressy! Why, if the Earth were round, then Christopher Columbus' ships would have fallen off the edge when they got there during the voyages of discovery in the name of our lord. Silly people, next thing you know, they'll be claiming that man has landed on the moon...
How would you fall off of the edge if it was round, but not if it was flat?

As for the Bermuda Triangle being the edge of the Earth; For starters its a triangle, whereas the Bible cleary states "four corners of the Earth". Last time I checked, a triangle only had 3 corners.
Secondly, plenty of ships and aeroplanes have been through it without any problems. The disappearances there are just myths.
Lastly, if you look at an atlas, you will see that the triangle is between the American continents and Europe + Africa, right in the Atlantic ocean. How can the Earth be a quadrilateral if all of its edges are in that position? To make that work, it would have to resemble a bowling ball, but instead of the three little finger holes, there's just one triangular gap. Either way, it is still spherical, or at least close to it.
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Old 02-05-2008, 07:23 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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How would you fall off of the edge if it was round, but not if it was flat?
Faith! That's how! Faith! Something you seem to be lacking...

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Originally Posted by Sacha-DG
As for the Bermuda Triangle being the edge of the Earth; For starters its a triangle, whereas the Bible cleary states "four corners of the Earth". Last time I checked, a triangle only had 3 corners.
So, now you're doubting the Bible and the word of the Lord. No doubt you need to be taught a lesson! You are a heathen and do not deserve God's love although He is so great that He loves you anyway. But you better repent of your evil ways or you will burn in hell for all eternity...and more.

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  #83  
Old 02-05-2008, 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by StarrKingGrad View Post
I can't explain it, since my degree is in theology, not physics. I asked a physicist in my congregation to give me a two to three sentence summary, and here's what he said (like most physicists, he took more than three sentences, but that's true of theologians as well, so I won't complain):

In physics, we understand the world around us in terms of mathematical models. For example, we can write an equation that tells us how much energy is required to stop a car of a certain weight going at a certain speed, and we can use this to design brakes for automobiles....................In summary, it may truly be that we live in a holographic universe, and we cannot abandon the hypothesis out of hand, but it would not be accurate to say that our universe has been proved to be holographic. One dominant lesson from physics in the last 100 years or so is that the way universe really works is usually far stranger than we imagine, and, any way you look at it, the holographic principle is strange.
So if i read that correctly, the holographic principle states that we are all made of information, not energy and matter. very interesting, and makes me think of the Matrix. But sense we do consist of matter, and everything we are surrounded by is made of matter, doesn't that mean that the earth cannot be flat, because it is made of matter? but then again these are all based on assumptions and maybe I'm just interpreting the explanation wrong.
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Old 02-06-2008, 12:25 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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So if i read that correctly, the holographic principle states that we are all made of information, not energy and matter. very interesting, and makes me think of the Matrix. But sense we do consist of matter, and everything we are surrounded by is made of matter, doesn't that mean that the earth cannot be flat, because it is made of matter? but then again these are all based on assumptions and maybe I'm just interpreting the explanation wrong.
I asked my expert to clarify. He says that the holographic principle doesn't require that the universe be made only of information, but that the best theoretical reason supporting the holographic principle is that the information content of a black hole seems to be two dimensional. While it seems like a strange concept [personal note: it is a strange concept!], he says that Einstein's view that the force of gravity is really just the bending of space by matter is equally strange, but relativity seems to be true based on every experiment done to test it.

He also reiterated that there has been no experimental test of the holographic principle, so it is an intriguing hypothesis, not a statement of fact. The good doc suggested that you might want to listen to an introductory lecture on the subject by one of his colleagues at Laurence Berkeley Laboratory, Raphael Bousso, available here.

He added that although the entire universe may be flat, in the sense that it might be possible to describe our 3D universe using two dimensions of information, that does not mean that the Earth is flat as experienced by us. Finally, he says that he doesn't recommend reading the Bible as if it were a physics textbook.
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  #85  
Old 02-06-2008, 12:57 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Faith! That's how! Faith! Something you seem to be lacking...
Can you explain how we use faith in technological advancements please? After all, that is what science is all about. What is the point in knowing anything if we can't put to good use?


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So, now you're doubting the Bible and the word of the Lord.
No, I'm not. I'm merely stating that what followers of the Bible are saying and what the Bible actually says do not follow from one another. They are contradictory.
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  #86  
Old 02-06-2008, 01:04 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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No, I'm not. I'm merely stating that what followers of the Bible are saying and what the Bible actually says do not follow from one another. They are contradictory.
Where do we contradict the Bible?
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  #87  
Old 02-06-2008, 01:07 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Where do we contradict the Bible?
Again, the Bible says the Earth has four corners, whereas a few pages back, someone said that the Bermuda Triangle was the edge of the Earth. This simply does not follow.
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Old 02-06-2008, 01:21 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Again, the Bible says the Earth has four corners, whereas a few pages back, someone said that the Bermuda Triangle was the edge of the Earth. This simply does not follow.
You need to remember that not every poster on these forums is an actual Bible-Believing Born Again True Christian™. Unless they have the TC™ title, you can't assume what they're saying is Landover doctrine.
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  #89  
Old 02-06-2008, 08:42 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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What do you think explains all of the Bermuda Triangle disappearances? I'm sure it's been seen, but if you get close enough to see it, you'll get sucked over the edge by the falling water and atmosphere. So nobody who has seen it has lived to tell the tale.
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  #90  
Old 02-07-2008, 05:45 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Looks like a true christian to me.
Sacha, I thought that you of all people would have understood the use of irony. I was not seriously suggesting that the Bermuda Triangle is the edge of the Earth. Disappearances in the Bermuda Triangle are obviously the work of the Devil, not of God. God wouldn't put the edge of the earth in the middle of the Atlantic (Revelation 7:1 discusses the four corners of the Earth, not a hole in the middle). Anyway, God punishes us for sin, not for exploring His creation.

God has obviously made it impossible for us even to see, much less actually sail off, the edge of the Earth. That doesn't mean that the edge doesn't exist, however.

I think that a lot of nonbelievers think that the Bible was written by a bunch of tribal savages who simply got it all wrong because they were stuck in their own small territory and didn't see the big picture. In this view, the Bible says the Earth was flat just because the writers of the Bible didn't know any better.

The problem with that view is that it is totally wrong. For example, in Matthew 4:8, the Apostle tells us that Satan took Jesus to a high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world. Matthew was a well educated man who knew Greek philosophy and mathematics. He obviously knew that the Greeks thought the Earth to be spherical. He must have been at the top of mountains himself and able to see what appears to be the curvature of the Earth. He was not some yokel off the proverbial turnip truck.

So why did Matthew write about the mountain from which Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the Earth? He must have known that many people (e.g., you) would find this concept laughable. The answer is that he understood that there was a deeper truth that Jesus could see with his eyes, but which the rest of us can only see through our faith. It's kind of like Hell, I don't want or need to see it to know that it is real.

Before you laugh at us over this, just remember that (as you can see earlier in this thread), the scientists are actually considering the notion that we are all really just made of information. I don't see how a literally flat Earth is in any way less believable than that.
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  #91  
Old 02-07-2008, 08:37 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Sionisx2 View Post
Hey uh.. you guys should know that I have unfalsifiable proof the earth is round. My Uncle, Jeffrey Williams, (Kyle M. Williams typing to you now) was on the space shuttle Atlantis back in 2000. He actually showed me pictures taken from just inside the shuttle (you could see the rim of the port hole) of the earth, they were orbiting when it was taken. (really nice pictures too! )
All your Uncle's pictures show is that the Earth is a disc.

Augustine might have been a depraved Mary worshiper, but he had this much right:
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But as to the fable that there are Antipodes, that is to say, men on the opposite side of the earth, where the sun rises when it sets to us, men who walk with their feet opposite ours, that is on no ground credible. And, indeed, it is not affirmed that this has been learned by historical knowledge, but by scientific conjecture, on the ground that the earth is suspended within the concavity of the sky, and that it has as much room on the one side of it as on the other: hence they say that the part which is beneath must also be inhabited. But they do not remark that, although it be supposed or scientifically demonstrated that the world is of a round and spherical form, yet it does not follow that the other side of the earth is bare of water; nor even, though it be bare, does it immediately follow that it is peopled.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:43 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

Well if you can find a mountain peak from which the whole world can be seen, I would gladly agree with you.
The peak of most mountains are below the level of the clouds, and those which are not would be far to small to see even close to that far. Even from an aeroplane, which flies much higher than the peak of any mountain, you cannot see the whole Earth.
Remember in Matthew's time that Australia and America had not yet been discovered by anyone other than the natives (Even though they didn't technically 'discover' it.). If Jesus had gone up onto this mountain and seen America and Australia, why did he not tell his disciples? Why would he want to keep this a secret?
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:48 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Well if you can find a mountain peak from which the whole world can be seen, I would gladly agree with you.
The peak of most mountains are below the level of the clouds, and those which are not would be far to small to see even close to that far. Even from an aeroplane, which flies much higher than the peak of any mountain, you cannot see the whole Earth.
Remember in Matthew's time that Australia and America had not yet been discovered by anyone other than the natives (Even though they didn't technically 'discover' it.). If Jesus had gone up onto this mountain and seen America and Australia, why did he not tell his disciples? Why would he want to keep this a secret?
I've mentioned this before; gravity bends light. Gravity is pulling the light rays down to the earth so that's why you can only see twenty miles.
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:00 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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I've mentioned this before; gravity bends light. Gravity is pulling the light rays down to the earth so that's why you can only see twenty miles.
Then how could Jesus have seen the whole world?
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:03 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Sacha-DG View Post
Then how could Jesus have seen the whole world?
Because He's God. He can do anything He wants.

Why don't you try reading the Bible, then you might not ask such stupid questions....
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:16 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Sacha-DG View Post
Then how could Jesus have seen the whole world?
You're the one arguing for a (snicker) round Earth. Now if the Earth was (snort) "round" how could Jesus see it all? Well, explain it.
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  #97  
Old 02-08-2008, 12:36 AM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Bobby-Joe View Post
You're the one arguing for a (snicker) round Earth. Now if the Earth was (snort) "round" how could Jesus see it all? Well, explain it.
That's my point. He didn't see it all. Otherwise, surely he would have told us about America, Australia and all the faraway lands we never knew about until someone actually went and found them.

And I have yet to be answered as to where the edge of the Earth is. I should like to go there one day.
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  #98  
Old 02-08-2008, 05:29 PM
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Ahimaaz Smith Ahimaaz Smith is offline
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Sacha-DG View Post
The peak of most mountains are below the level of the clouds
What if it's a sunny day?

Quote:
Even from an aeroplane, which flies much higher than the peak of any mountain
Really? Airplanes fly that high? Who would have thought that? Now that you have explained this, I have seen the light, and am abandoning my faith in God.

Note to Sacha: That was irony.

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Remember in Matthew's time that Australia and America had not yet been discovered by anyone other than the natives
Wow, another revelation! I always thought the ancient Egyptians lived in Alexandria, Virginia. Now that I know they lived in Alexandria, Egypt, it all makes so much more sense. Thank you for sharing this pearl of important but often overlooked geohistorical wisdom.

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If Jesus had gone up onto this mountain and seen America and Australia, why did he not tell his disciples? Why would he want to keep this a secret?
What in Heaven's name would the Apostles have done with that information? Jesus didn't tell them about America for the same reason he didn't tell them about X-rays--they lacked the technology to do anything about it, and Jesus had more pressing issues to discuss in his limited time on Earth.

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Well if you can find a mountain peak from which the whole world can be seen, I would gladly agree with you.
There are of hundreds of mountains on the Moon from which the entire Earth can be seen. They're even higher up than airplanes. Glad to see you now agree that the Earth is flat.
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  #99  
Old 02-08-2008, 08:47 PM
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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There are of hundreds of mountains on the Moon from which the entire Earth can be seen. They're even higher up than airplanes. Glad to see you now agree that the Earth is flat.
Alright fair enough, allow me to rephrase: Show me a mountain peak from which every kingdom of the Earth can be seen. If you were to look down upon the Earth from the Moon, you would see half of the Earth.
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  #100  
Old 02-09-2008, 12:02 AM
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Ahimaaz Smith Ahimaaz Smith is offline
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Default Re: Flat Earth? Hell Yes!

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Originally Posted by Sacha-DG View Post
Alright fair enough, allow me to rephrase: Show me a mountain peak from which every kingdom of the Earth can be seen. If you were to look down upon the Earth from the Moon, you would see half of the Earth.
A. You don't know that, since you've never been there.

B. Even the scientists say that you would if you stayed up there for 28 days. Matthew didn't say how long they took.

Although you are completely wrong about the shape of the Earth, at least you ask reasonably intelligent questions. So, please keep asking away until we have resolved all of your doubts on this issue.
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