[Joshua Brooks]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

If God foresaw what you would do before matter existed then created you, you cannot act outside the light of which he foresaw you acting.

That may be true if God was a man limited to the subjective perceptive capabilities of a human being. However, God is beyond your limited comprehension and is not limited by your ability(or lack thereof) to understand what is beyond your 5 senses.

The Holy Spirit has touched me and by doing so has touched the Landover Baptist Creation Science Department. It so happens that the Lord commands the wind, the water, the sun, the rocks, the plants and the animals. But He saw fit to give humans free will so that we could genuinely praise Him and flatter Him profusely. In the Holy Bible KJV 1611 God has laid out how we should (or would) act if he did not give us free will. Our will, that is, everything we think, do, say, desire, hate, etc. is not the will of God, but the will of man. Therefore, it is evil.

Look where the the will of man has gotten us? Secularism, the democratic, independent, U.S tax payers, green, communist and libertarian parties, homosexuality, thievery, Canada, murder, wars, famine, nigra, Denmark, chinks, dot heads, San Fransisco, sand nigs, unamerican languages, rape, blue states, Australia and the list goes on.

There would be no sin without free will. So don't tell us there is no free will.

[Ezekiel Bathfire]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

"You make the mistake of applying frail human logic to The Lord of Hosts, The Almighty, The Holy Trinity. Would you like to apply the same logic to the miracle of walking on water, the curing of the leper? The feeding of the 5000? Thus denying Christ's Godliness!"

Wow this is a hard one! Your example is of God overcoming the laws of nature, whereas my example shows that free will necessitates man undermining God's omnipotence. (for any idiots who don't follow: If God foresaw what you would do before matter existed, then created things, how could you possibly act outside the light of which he foresaw you acting without undermining God's omnipotence?)

Look, I have no great objection to your posting idiocies if you follow them with a wacko smilie, otherwise it sounds as if you believe what you say instead of accepting that I was correct.

Your argument is flawed and you know it. It is your application of logic that varies between the cases of Miracles and of Freewill. If you are willing to accept in faith that Miracles can occur and you do not understand them but God does, why are you not willing to use your own argument about Freewill and just accept that God knows the answer and you do not?

The physical anomalies of Miracles are as physical as the anomalies of Time. Assume for one moment that we are born with an infinite number of possibilities on how we should order our lives and that one of the ways will lead to the Eternal City and the rest lead to the Pits of Torment.

Despite the ways being infinite, God knows them all. He knows all possible Futures. At each stage you use Freewill to step left or right at every junction. He sees your progress and can see the myriad paths leading out in front of you. Come Judgment Day, He judges accordingly.

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

Oh what do you know, Calvinists preaching predestination:

Your first link doesn't work.

Who said anything about predestination? Of course everything is foreordained. What does that have to do with free will? The concepts of free will and predestination are completely orthogonal.

We already established that the kind of free will that man has is free will as defined by God in the Bible, not your egghead philosopher's definition.

You denigrated it as "a slaves will". Who are you to judge God?

The other so called objections have been destroyed masterfully by Theologians such as Bahnsen.

Wait just a minute. I thought YOU were educated to be a skilled debater. Is the extent of your debate skills to link to a book written by a hellbound Presbyterian with the word "Predestination" on the cover, and to namedrop another hellbound Presbyterian theologian?

I've answered every single one of your objections in spades, and that is all you've got?

I suppose the answer to your earlier question should have been no, because I haven't read very much written by "frozen chosen" hyper-Calvinists. I have only read works by real Calvinists, like John Calvin. Ever heard of him?

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Hyper-Calvinist]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

"You make the mistake of applying frail human logic to The Lord of Hosts, The Almighty, The Holy Trinity. Would you like to apply the same logic to the miracle of walking on water, the curing of the leper? The feeding of the 5000? Thus denying Christ's Godliness!"

Wow this is a hard one! Your example is of God overcoming the laws of nature, whereas my example shows that free will necessitates man undermining God's omnipotence. (for any idiots who don't follow: If God foresaw what you would do before matter existed, then created things, how could you possibly act outside the light of which he foresaw you acting without undermining God's omnipotence?)

[Hyper-Calvinist]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

Oh what do you know, Calvinists preaching predestination: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-

http://www.monergismbooks.com/Predes...n-p-16366.html

The other so called objections have been destroyed masterfully by Theologians such as Bahnsen.

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

Your just jealous that we Calvinists actually fight for God. We actually get educated and learn how to destroy atheists in debate whereas you cowards just sit around thumping your bible, praying for God to flush the world down the toilet. Pessimilenialists

The only one being destroyed in debate is you.

You are not a Calvinist. You are a hyper-Calvinist, which is a heresy.

It seems that the way you pseudo-Calvinists are "educated" to "debate" is to baldly ignore any and all challenges to your statements and just call names. You'll have to excuse me if I'm underwhelmed.

I prefer the company of real Calvinists over your kind. You "frozen-chosen" hyper-Calvinists are a bunch of Hellbound heretics, no better than the equally hellbound Arminians.

If people have no free will at all, if we're all just mindless automatons, then why would you even debate with atheists? If they are "destined" to be saved, you wouldn't have to preach to them. You could just read the phone book to them and they'd get saved.

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Hyper-Calvinist]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

Your just jealous that we Calvinists actually fight for God. We actually get educated and learn how to destroy atheists in debate whereas you cowards just sit around thumping your bible, praying for God to flush the world down the toilet. Pessimilenialists

[Capt. Aaron Portway]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

"Take your Predestination clap-trap to a Protestant Reform Church where there are other misinformed false Christian sinners like yourself! You can all agree with each other and talk about what idiots we True Christian™ Independent Baptists are. And then when each of you blasphemers dies, you can be dumbfounded as you begin eternity with Satan!"

Jealous Credo Baptist

You're not funny, you're a hellbound sinner, and you're probably a faggot kid toucher to boot! Does your boyfriend complain when you come home with your "thing" tasting like 8-year-olds bottoms?

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

Jealous Credo Baptist

According to Acts 8:36-87, what is the one requirement for baptism?

I notice that you had no response to my post, where I put all of your "objections" to rest.

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Hyper-Calvinist]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

"Take your Predestination clap-trap to a Protestant Reform Church where there are other misinformed false Christian sinners like yourself! You can all agree with each other and talk about what idiots we True Christian™ Independent Baptists are. And then when each of you blasphemers dies, you can be dumbfounded as you begin eternity with Satan!"

Jealous Credo Baptist

[Capt. Aaron Portway]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

If God foresaw what you would do before matter existed then created you, you cannot act outside the light of which he foresaw you acting.

"If free will didn't exist would we have as many sinners in the world as we do going to hell with you? No you filthy scumbag, if there was no free will and the Lord chose our destiny we would not have demons like you walking on this earth."

God let evil roam about to make the triumph over it more nice! You of all people should know that.

"We CHOOSE to love Jesus Christ and accept that he made the ultimate sacrifice to cleanse us of our sin. The Good Lord™ then sets us aside from the rest of you sinners for himself. You probably use this as an excuse to fornicate and do other ungodly things, don't you? Are you a witch too, communist? Do you hate America, and freedom?"

No, I don't do those things. And NOONE chooses God (Romans 3:10-11). This is GOD'S painting, not yours Mr. Arminian.

"And this reference to God painting. Hitler was a painter are you comparing him and God?"
No
"I wouldn't go so far as to call myself a Calvinist, but I like a whole lot of what John Calvin had to say. Calvinists do not deny that man has free will. That's a "hyper-Calvinist" thing."
A slaves will. You haven't read into Calvinism much have you? Were free in so far as we do what we DESIRE. That doesn't mean we have libertarian free will.

As for the rest of you Arminian fools, Paul came to similar objections. Read Romans 9.

Was the point of your posts to bore me to tears? If it was, you succeeded in spades sir!

Take your Predestination clap-trap to a Protestant Reform Church where there are other misinformed false Christian sinners like yourself! You can all agree with each other and talk about what idiots we True Christian™ Independent Baptists are. And then when each of you blasphemers dies, you can be dumbfounded as you begin eternity with Satan!

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

You haven't read into Calvinism much have you?

Other than John Calvin's complete commentary, the Geneva Bible with John Calvin's annotations in the margins, about a third of Charles H. Spurgeon's sermons, and several other works by Calvinist authors, no I haven't.

I guess I don't know a single thing about Calvinism.

Were free in so far as we do what we DESIRE. That doesn't mean we have libertarian free will.

Correct. We have free will as defined by God in the Bible, not some egghead philosopher's definition of free will.

As for the rest of you Arminian fools, Paul came to similar objections. Read Romans 9.

There are no Arminians here. We aren't hellbound Methodists or Pentecostals. There's also no hyper-Calvinist Presbyterians here, other than you.

Chapter 9 is my favorite part of Romans. Chapter 3 would be my second.

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Hyper-Calvinist]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

"And this reference to God painting. Hitler was a painter are you comparing him and God?"
No
"I wouldn't go so far as to call myself a Calvinist, but I like a whole lot of what John Calvin had to say. Calvinists do not deny that man has free will. That's a "hyper-Calvinist" thing."
A slaves will. You haven't read into Calvinism much have you? Were free in so far as we do what we DESIRE. That doesn't mean we have libertarian free will.

As for the rest of you Arminian fools, Paul came to similar objections. Read Romans 9.

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: It is impossible for free will to exist.

...and therefore subatomic particles also have free will.
It's simple mathematics:

http://www.sciencenews.org/view/gene...e_free_will%3F

That's all a bunch of navel-gazing nonsense. No one has ever observed a subatomic particle, yet they talk about them as if their existence is proven fact. I'm not claiming they don't exist, but I'm not going to accept them simply on some egghead's say-so with no proof to back it up.

Even if subatomic particles do exist, they don't have souls, so they can't have free will. Only humans, angels, and demons have souls, so only humans, angels, and demons have free will.

Free will is the capacity for sin. If you can explain to me how a hypothetical subatomic particle could possibly sin, then I might be willing to consider the possibility that IF they exist, then maybe they also have free will.

According to your world-view, if a sub-atomic particle is capable of sin, do they go to Hell if they decay without accepting Jesus as their Savior?

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[nuncio]

People have free will.

...and therefore subatomic particles also have free will.
It's simple mathematics:

http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/35391/title/Math_Trek__Do_subatomic_particles_have_free_will%3F

Contrary to what non-Christian Albert Einstein said,
God DOES play dice with the universe.