[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

So why follow it at all if by your own admission a large part of it is crap?

I wouldn't say that it's all crap, but it simply isn't for me.

[Zechariah Smyth]

Re: Introducing the curious one

I wouldn't say that it's all crap, but it simply isn't for me.

Why? Because you realize deep down that it's nonsense?

Please be honest.

[see_the_light]

Re: Introducing the curious one

My interpretation on that part is not as literal actually. When paired with "An ye harm none" it is a guideline that says that you should do best to be a good person to others. And I would not see that my will and judgement is over Gods. I can choose what I say and do (as I am a mere mortal), but God is the one who in the end has the last word about right and wrong in the case.

Lets take your pairing.

So, if you, most rightly, affirm that GOD has the last word on right or wrong, and doing the best is doing right, and your will is to do right (that by the way is also GOS's will for you and everyone) then "ye will" is but a vain boasting, as it end in doing GOD's will.

Indeed it is hard, if not impossible to not harm anything or anyone, but one can always do their best. And I would not let murderers, etc., roam free.

Of course you wouldn't! So I must ask you to restrict it properly to "harm not unfairly"

Another part of the teachings is that "What you send forth comes back to thee, so always mind the law of three". Which means that what you send out (by doing or saying something) comes back to you three times better/worse depending on your acts nature. So if you do something that is wrong it comes back around sooner or later.

And those wiccas are selling the truth short.

Genesis 4:15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.

Genesis 26:12 Then Isaac sowed in that land, and received in the same year an hundredfold: and the LORD blessed him.


Nehemiah 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Psalms 79:12 And render unto our neighbours sevenfold into their bosom their reproach, wherewith they have reproached thee, O Lord.

As a matter of fact MOST of the times sin is re-payed on this world sevenfold and righteousness ten fold, hundred fold and manifold.

The LORD is a most generous GOD.

PRAISE THE LORD!

[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

Why? Because you realize deep down that it's nonsense?

Please be honest.

I don't see it as nonsense since for some people it is the opposite. It is their way to express their faith and helps understand things about human life, nature and the meaning of it all. It is just not how I see the world and it's works. And though I do believe that there is a greater power ruling the world, but I have never been able to understand the ways of magic and such.

[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

Lets take your pairing.

So, if you, most rightly, affirm that GOD has the last word on right or wrong, and doing the best is doing right, and your will is to do right (that by the way is also GOS's will for you and everyone) then "ye will" is but a vain boasting, as it end in doing GOD's will.

I'd say that is more to remind you that it is YOU that have to do good. Sitting around doing nothing doesn't exactly count as good, since it's just doing... nothing.

Of course you wouldn't! So I must ask you to restrict it properly to "harm not unfairly"

It is them that have brought the harm upon themself and hence they have also deserved it.

As a matter of fact MOST of the times sin is re-payed on this world sevenfold and righteousness ten fold, hundred fold and manifold.

That I can most definitely agree with

[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: Introducing the curious one

and helps understand things about human life, nature and the meaning of it all

Interesting. In your opinion, since you are more familiar with this "faith" than I, what discoveries into human life and nature were brought forth from paganism? What did this pagan "religion" reveal that we never knew before?

[Zechariah Smyth]

Re: Introducing the curious one

I don't see it as nonsense since for some people it is the opposite. It is their way to express their faith and helps understand things about human life, nature and the meaning of it all. It is just not how I see the world and it's works. And though I do believe that there is a greater power ruling the world, but I have never been able to understand the ways of magic and such.

I didn't ask what other people thought:I asked what YOU thought.

When you say you "have never been able to understand the ways of magic" do you feel that it is because of a lack of faith on your part, or because deep down you know it's a load of nonsense?

[see_the_light]

Re: Introducing the curious one

I don't see it as nonsense since for some people it is the opposite. It is their way to express their faith and helps understand things about human life, nature and the meaning of it all. It is just not how I see the world and it's works. And though I do believe that there is a greater power ruling the world, but I have never been able to understand the ways of magic and such.

EXCELLENT!You do believe in GOD and when presented with satan's lie you say rightly " not how I see the world and it's works" nor understand its hook "the ways of magic and such"

As for stating that "it's their way of expressing their faith" I must reprimand you. False belief is no excuse, billions deny JESUS, and GOD is not amused.

Alas many are called and few are chosen, it is GOD's plan and we must help those few.

PRAISE THE LORD!

[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

I didn't ask what other people thought:I asked what YOU thought.

When you say you "have never been able to understand the ways of magic" do you feel that it is because of a lack of faith on your part, or because deep down you know it's a load of nonsense?

Thank you for making the question clearer! It would have been a lack of faith on my part. And I think I can achieve the same things that others need magic to for focusing on the issue or goal, by my own will. Since in the end magic won't help you one bit to achieve anything if you don't do anything and I am strong minded enough to keep focus on my own.

[see_the_light]

Re: Introducing the curious one

I'd say that is more to remind you that it is YOU that have to do good. Sitting around doing nothing doesn't exactly count as good, since it's just doing... nothing.





It is them that have brought the harm upon themself and hence they have also deserved it.




That I can most definitely agree with

Exactly! YOU have to do what GOD commands, the sinners have brought the rightful wrath of GOD upon themselves and you agree that GOD is generous on his retribution.

How I wished that we'd find such wisdom in such a small exchange.

May I take the occasion to extend my warmest welcome to this forum?

I am sure that JESUS personaly led you to us for your salvation.

PRAISE THE LORD!

[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

Interesting. In your opinion, since you are more familiar with this "faith" than I, what discoveries into human life and nature were brought forth from paganism? What did this pagan "religion" reveal that we never knew before?

In the end the answers most likely don't differ, since the questions are essentially the same. It is more of how paganism explains e.g. the meaning of life or what happens after death that differs.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: Introducing the curious one

In the end the answers most likely don't differ, since the questions are essentially the same. It is more of how paganism explains e.g. the meaning of life or what happens after death that differs.

You said this "religion" helps people understand things about human life and nature. I'm asking how. How is human life understood? Is there some discovery of the magic potential in humans? Does it make a difference what race or gender one is? Is one born with magic, or does one pick it up? What about the natural world? We know about the cellular structure, you can see the cellular structure of an onion very easily under a simple microscope. What information about nature has paganism offered the world? What do we know today that we didn't know some 50 years ago when paganism was invented?

[Luaera]

Re: Introducing the curious one

You said this "religion" helps people understand things about human life and nature. I'm asking how. How is human life understood? Is there some discovery of the magic potential in humans? Does it make a difference what race or gender one is? Is one born with magic, or does one pick it up? What about the natural world? We know about the cellular structure, you can see the cellular structure of an onion very easily under a simple microscope. What information about nature has paganism offered the world? What do we know today that we didn't know some 50 years ago when paganism was invented?

Magic potential is not something defined by race, gender, age or anything. What is called magic is your own potential to will things to happen. In practices it is more of a way to put your full heart and soul into a matter that you wish to accomplish (getting better grades in school e.g.).

And I meant questions like "What is life? Why are we here? What happens after death?". Christianity has had those answers figured out for a while, when comparing e.g. wicca that was born during 40's-60's. For example most wiccans believe that when you die you go to a place called Summerland (according to some branches of it) and there wait for your soul to be reborn.

I have not read up on all aspects of Wicca, but have a general idea about the most central beliefs.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: Introducing the curious one

Thank you for taking the time to help me understand.

If you don't mind, I'm still curious and would like to know more. You say,

What is called magic is your own potential to will things to happen.

If it's your own potential to will things to happen then how is that magical, and not simply your own ability to make things happen?

And I meant questions like "What is life? Why are we here? What happens after death?".

So this "religion" doesn't actually answer questions about human life or nature, as you earlier said. Perhaps you were simply repeating what you'd been told, but upon deeper reflection, you discover this claim fails to deliver.

For example most wiccans believe that when you die you go to a place called Summerland (according to some branches of it) and there wait for your soul to be reborn.

When my children were very small, they believed that when they prayed holding their hands with palms together and fingers pointed upward would act like a prayer version of a light-saber. They imagined that their prayers were shot up to Heaven through their fingertips. It's a cute idea, but foolishness they outgrew. In other words dear, just because someone believes something (even strongly), it doesn't mean it's anything more than the fantasy of an immature dreamer.

I have not read up on all aspects of Wicca, but have a general idea about the most central beliefs.

Which are what? You've already exposed "magic" for being a vague and imprecise way of saying people can do what they put their minds to. You've already pointed out the silly belief of the afterlife based on naught but lovely fantasies. What more can you share?

[FreeFromBrains]

Re: Introducing the curious one

Magic potential is not something defined by race, gender, age or anything. What is called magic is your own potential to will things to happen. In practices it is more of a way to put your full heart and soul into a matter that you wish to accomplish (getting better grades in school e.g.).

And I meant questions like "What is life? Why are we here? What happens after death?". Christianity has had those answers figured out for a while, when comparing e.g. wicca that was born during 40's-60's. For example most wiccans believe that when you die you go to a place called Summerland (according to some branches of it) and there wait for your soul to be reborn.

I have not read up on all aspects of Wicca, but have a general idea about the most central beliefs.

So are you saying magic is simply people working a bit harder at things?