[WilliamJenningsBryan]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

Nope. The original "myth" was that Callisto was a goddess of the hunt in her own right. Later, like a lot of gods and goddesses she became known as less, simply a nymph under Artemis, who was seduced or raped by Zeus, had his child, and both were turned into bears and placed in the sky as Ursa Minor and Ursa Major.

No religion is false. Every religion is real to those who believe. Though Wicca is a modernized Christianized version of Paganism. Scientology is not a religion, and I'm not sure what all it en-tales.

Callisto was never a "goddess of the hunt, but a follower of Artemis (Diana) who took a vow of virginity in order to become a nymph of Artemis. Your writing is unclear here, but to set the record straight it was Callisto, NOT Artemis, that was lured into Zeus' embrace. When Artemis discovered some months later that Callisto was knocked up she expelled her and turned her into a bear. Some versions of the myth suggest that it was Juno that turned Callisto into a bear.

Callisto's son was named Arcas, who was hidden by Zeus in an area that was later to become known as Arcadia.

Of course all of this is myth - that is, none of it is true. If you think so we have a word for that condition - delusional. Sometimes artists will create a work derived from these myths, and in this case there is an Edwardian musical comedy known as "The Arcadians" with music by Lionel Monckton and Howard Talbot (1909).

It just so happens that the music derived from this "Callisto" myth was played aboard the Titanic, which if we are able to draw any conclusions about Jesus' view on these myths it just might be to avoid them.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

No, I certainly do not. But if you cannot prove someone has been arrested for prostitution, or do not have them on film soliciting someone, how can you assume
they are a prostitute? You cannot prove they are. It's an unfounded accusation
based on what you WANT to believe. And you have no right to make
unfounded accusations.

And can you prove that any of these women participate in lewd intercourse? Can you
prove every single one of those women, and the hundreds I have not posted, are not virgins or were not virgins until married? Can you prove they have anything but
missionary intercourse with their legal husbands? Are you peaking through our windows
every night with a camera? If so, please, send the images, send the video, send the proof.

Otherwise, stop accusing people of things when you know nothing about them.

And no, that is not a textbook description of a Goth girl. A Goth girl is any girl
who listens to Goth Rock.

Really? A former Goth? What years were you in the scene? Which Goth clubs did you go to?
Which Goth bands did you listen to? And how does you claiming to have been a meth using
Goth prove that all Goths use meth or any other drug? You are talking to a woman who has been involved in the Goth scene for 12+ years. A woman involved in the Baltimore, Philly,
and D.C. Goth scene. A woman who has been to multiple Goth clubs, goes to Goth concerts,
Goth house parties, etc., and has yet to see ONE single Goth take ONE single drug. You are talking to a woman who is personally friends with the current managers of a Goth club, two of the former managers, the owner of another club that hosts a Goth night, as well as multiple DJs, Goth models, photographers, and is a personal friend of the vocalist of Baltimore's Goth Rock band The Drowning Season. I think it's safe to say,
based on my own experiences, what IS and is NOT done within the Goth subculture today. As can anyone else, like Derek, who is currently involved in the Goth scene.

No, I am not a liar, and just because you may or may not have been involved in the scene at one time, in one area, does not give you the right to accuse me of being a liar. If you say the entire Goth scene is involved in drugs, then YOU must be lying. Have you attended every Goth club or night in the entire world? Have you attended every Goth concert in the world? Do you have any physical or visual evidence of any of your claims? You claim you know Goths who have died from crystal meth use? Show me their death certificate. Show me the news articles.

I have never in my entire life used crystal meth nor will I.

I have told you I am 105 lbs. I am 5'1. There is no way someone who is 5'1 and 105 lbs is fat. Not to mention that my picture was one of the ones I linked, and no I will not tell you which one it is. Take a guess. Considering they were all skinny, it really doesn't matter. 90 lbs? Really? Anything under 100 lbs would be underweight for my height and build. No adult who is over 5' should be below 95 lbs at most.

I have self control, and it would actually be very hard for me to even get fat eating normal proportions, unless I baked all my own bakery products all the time, considering I'm highly allergic to nuts and honey. And you know what, I don't even know how to bake. I jog almost every day, do crunches, single leg circles, ride a bike, dance, etc., I have no extra 15 lbs. I have no extra weight at all.

According to you, the only thing Jesus can help me with is learning to be racist, intolerant, rude, uncivil, insulting, hating, manipulative, ignorant, illogical, and backwards.

I am still waiting for PROOF to ANY of your claims.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Originally Posted by WilliamJenningsBryan

Callisto was never a "goddess of the hunt, but a follower of Artemis (Diana) who took a vow of virginity in order to become a nymph of Artemis. Your writing is unclear here, but to set the record straight it was Callisto, NOT Artemis, that was lured into Zeus' embrace. When Artemis discovered some months later that Callisto was knocked up she expelled her and turned her into a bear. Some versions of the myth suggest that it was Juno that turned Callisto into a bear.

Callisto's son was named Arcas, who was hidden by Zeus in an area that was later to become known as Arcadia.

Of course all of this is myth - that is, none of it is true. If you think so we have a word for that condition - delusional. Sometimes artists will create a work derived from these myths, and in this case there is an Edwardian musical comedy known as "The Arcadians" with music by Lionel Monckton and Howard Talbot (1909).

It just so happens that the music derived from this "Callisto" myth was played aboard the Titanic, which if we are able to draw any conclusions about Jesus' view on these myths it just might be to avoid them.

Actually, she was a goddess of the hunt, though I cannot find the article I read years ago.

And yes, it is a myth. Does that mean it is not true? No. It means it is something that has yet to be, or cannot be proven. The bible is a book of myth. Any story believed by any religion is a myth to outsiders of that religion. You cannot prove one is more true than the other.

[Roberta]

Statutory rape laws are based on the premise that until a person reaches a certain age, that individual is legally incapable of consenting to sexual intercourse. Thus, the law assumes, even if he or she willingly engages in sexual intercourse, the sex is not consensual.

In most states the age of consent is sixteen.

The original purpose of statutory rape laws was to protect young, unwed females from males who might impregnate them and not take responsibility by providing support for the child. In the past, the solution to such problems was often a "shotgun wedding", a forced marriage called for by the parents of the girl in question. This rationale aims to preserve the marriageability of the girl and to prevent unwanted teenage pregnancy.

A child born out of wedlock is legally a bastard. Hope your nino is not a product of miscegenation.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Originally Posted by Roberta

Statutory rape laws are based on the premise that until a person reaches a certain age, that individual is legally incapable of consenting to sexual intercourse. Thus, the law assumes, even if he or she willingly engages in sexual intercourse, the sex is not consensual.

In most states the age of consent is sixteen.

The original purpose of statutory rape laws was to protect young, unwed females from males who might impregnate them and not take responsibility by providing support for the child. In the past, the solution to such problems was often a "shotgun wedding", a forced marriage called for by the parents of the girl in question. This rationale aims to preserve the marriageability of the girl and to prevent unwanted teenage pregnancy.

A child born out of wedlock is legally a bastard. Hope your nino is not a product of miscegenation.

Not that it is actually relevant but

First of all, can you read? Can you do math? I'm 23. My son is 4.

Second, according to Christianity and the Christian god, a betrothed couple is considered as good as already married. Therefore, betrothed is not "out of wedlock."

What does this have to do with the Goth scene anyway? Oh wait, I know. Your cannot prove your claims, so you all just insult people and innocent children. You think if you make people angry, they will not realize you haven't proven anything? Or that they will start insulting you, cussing, and threatening, so that you can say they are not civilized and that they're just proving the Goth scene is hateful and violence? Sorry dear, but you won't get me to threaten you. Nor do I hate you. I just feel sorry for you all.

[Faith_Machine]

So fatty's skeptical about my goth credentials. Sigh.

First job at a "goth" club was in 1986, at The Underground, AKA Lipps. Also went to Death Guild, Jezebel's Joint, was on permanent guest list for Bondage A Go-Go, went to Camera Obscura, House of Usher, House of Voodoo, Shrine of Lilith, blah, blah, blah.

None of which matters. When I think of all the casual sex I had with goth girls during those years, I just cringe. I'm lucky I didn't get the AIDS, or worse yet, father an interracial child out of wedlock.

You ask me what goth bands I listened to? Well that's a funny question, because any true goth would know that goths listen to industrial, EDM, electronica, and synth pop. Why didn't you ask me what industrial, EDM, electronica, and synth pop bands I was into?

[Faith_Machine]

And yes, weighing 105 pounds when you're only 5"1 tall is disturbingly fat.

Stop arguing with us about trivial matters and accept Jesus Christ as your personal savior. If He can get me off the drugs, He can cure your food addiction!

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Originally Posted by Faith_Machine

So fatty's skeptical about my goth credentials. Sigh.

First job at a "goth" club was in 1986, at The Underground, AKA Lipps. Also went to Death Guild, Jezebel's Joint, was on permanent guest list for Bondage A Go-Go, went to Camera Obscura, House of Usher, House of Voodoo, Shrine of Lilith, blah, blah, blah.

None of which matters. When I think of all the casual sex I had with goth girls during those years, I just cringe. I'm lucky I didn't get the AIDS, or worse yet, father an interracial child out of wedlock.

You ask me what goth bands I listened to? Well that's a funny question, because any true goth would know that goths listen to industrial, EDM, electronica, and synth pop. Why didn't you ask me what industrial, EDM, electronica, and synth pop bands I was into?

As I said earlier to someone else, the scene in the late 70s and 80s was different. This is now 2013. As I said before, I'm sure there was drugs in the scene back then, there were drugs in most music scenes back then. Things change, which just shows that the scene itself is not necessarily bad.

It's not a funny question. Any true Goth knows a Goth is a fan of Goth Rock, that Goth is a genre itself. Industrial, Synthpop, etc., are separate genres of music, and while they were/are often played at Goth clubs, that doesn't make them Goth. They don't have the same sound. And any true Goth knows that saying "Goths listen to Goth Rock" does not mean they ONLY listen to Goth Rock. Of course, a fan of Goth Rock can obviously listen to other genres, but since a Goth is a fan of Goth Rock, one of the genres they listen/like to has to be Goth. The only question needed to be asked to determine if a person is or was Goth, is what Goth bands do you/did you listen to. Why would I ask what Industrial bands you listen to? Listening to Industrial doesn't make you Goth, listening to Goth does.

[Faith_Machine]

I'm not talking about the 1970s or 1980s. There was no such thing as a goth scene in those days. We called them "death rockers" back then.

And every club I listed (other than Lipps/Underground) is a club that was around in the late 1990s through the 2000s.

Furthermore, it is the modern, current goth scene which is drowning in meth, not the historical, ancient goth scene which you've invented in your head.

You would know this if you were a real goth, and not some poseur.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Why have you not been helped for your anorexia yet? You are deeply disturbed and need the help of both a doctor and a psychologist, if you believe that at 5'1 105 lbs, with a 23" waist, is fat. Either that or you just can't accept the fact that you are wrong, or you think you can get me to starve myself to lose weight, and die of anorexia. Sorry, but I know I'm far from fat, I know the dangers of both anorexia and bulimia. You cannot undermine my self confidence. I'd say nice try, but it wasn't even that.

I'm still waiting for proof that the Goth scene today is invested with drugs and prostitutes.

[Irinka the repentant jewess]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

Not that it is actually relevant but

First of all, can you read? Can you do math? I'm 23. My son is 4.

Second, according to Christianity and the Christian god, a betrothed couple is considered as good as already married. Therefore, betrothed is not "out of wedlock."

What does this have to do with the Goth scene anyway? Oh wait, I know. Your cannot prove your claims, so you all just insult people and innocent children. You think if you make people angry, they will not realize you haven't proven anything? Or that they will start insulting you, cussing, and threatening, so that you can say they are not civilized and that they're just proving the Goth scene is hateful and violence? Sorry dear, but you won't get me to threaten you. Nor do I hate you. I just feel sorry for you all.

Hi, welcome to the forum. There appears to be heated discussion about -well, all kinds of things, from the Goth scene to marriage and child-bearing. I admire your calm demeanor and your lack of anger. Would you do me a favor, though, and look beyond the words and the sarcasm in your head and the apparent negativity, and try to capture the heart of the matter? The heart of the matter is that which is really important to all of the participants of this conversation. You and me included. What is most important and of most consequence is the fact that God - the only true God of the universe - cares deeply about you, and about each one of His creations, whether they like the Goth music or prefer classical. He did His part: He died, was buried and rose again (1 Corinthians 15:3-4), - for anyone who would care to accept His gift.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Originally Posted by Faith_Machine

I'm not talking about the 1970s or 1980s. There was no such thing as a goth scene in those days. We called them "death rockers" back then.

And every club I listed (other than Lipps/Underground) is a club that was around in the late 1990s through the 2000s.

Furthermore, it is the modern, current goth scene which is drowning in meth, not the historical, ancient goth scene which you've invented in your head.

You would know this if you were a real goth, and not some poseur.

You just said 1986. And only the American scene called them deathrockers. In Europe, and in some places in America, it was known as Goth or Positive Punk. And considering it is the same scene that is known as Goth today, it's still the Goth scene. Not to mention that, according to the owners, who are the same people who owned the club in the 1970s, Club Orpheus was considered to be a Goth club in the 1980s. And if it wasn't a Goth scene, how can you say "I know the Goth scene is full of drugs because I was in it in 1986 and we all did drugs"?

Really? The Goth scene didn't do drugs back then? Wasn't Rozz Williams on drugs?

Honestly, how can someone who listens to Goth Rock be a poseur? Not possible.

And where were all these clubs located, by the way?

And yeah, I'm TOTALLY, lying about the Baltimore, Philly, and D.C. scene. We TOTALLY all have sex on the dance floor, accept money for it, and pass around needles or crack pipes.

[Faith_Machine]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

I'm still waiting for proof that the Goth scene today is invested with drugs and prostitutes.

First of all, I already used scripture to prove to you that a woman doesn't have to work as a prostitute to be considered a whore in God's eyes. All that is necessary is for her to use sex to corrupt men, and that is what goth girls do.

You ask for proof? My own experience is all the proof I need, little lady. I could go into great detail about all the times alabaster-skinned, corseted, fishnet wearing, busty goth girls snorted crystal meth off the shaft of my penis, but I fear you would only become sexually aroused if you heard the details.

The bottom line is my personal, anecdotal experience is rock solid proof.

CASE CLOSED.


Now then, can we PLEASE stop talking about your stupid goth nonsense and put the focus back on the life and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth?

[Faith_Machine]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

And where were all these clubs located, by the way?

The mere fact that you have to ask is all the proof I need that you are not a real goth.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

Originally Posted by Irinka the repentant jewess

Hi, welcome to the forum. There appears to be heated discussion about -well, all kinds of things, from the Goth scene to marriage and child-bearing. I admire your calm demeanor and your lack of anger. Would you do me a favor, though, and look beyond the words and the sarcasm in your head and the apparent negativity, and try to capture the heart of the matter? The heart of the matter is that which is really important to all of the participants of this conversation. You and me included. What is most important and of most consequence is the fact that God - the only true God of the universe - cares deeply about you, and about each one of His creations, whether they like the Goth music or prefer classical. He did His part: He died, was buried and rose again (1 Corinthians 15:3-4), - for anyone who would care to accept His gift.

No, that is NOT what is most important. What is most important is the slander against ALL Goths, and the hatred and violence towards them promoted by this site and Godhatesgoths.com based on unfounded information no one here will bother to prove.

I do not care about your god. I care about the Goth scene and what happens to it because of people like the ones here.

[Irinka the repentant jewess]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

You just said 1986. And only the American scene called them deathrockers. In Europe, and in some places in America, it was known as Goth or Positive Punk. And considering it is the same scene that is known as Goth today, it's still the Goth scene. Not to mention that, according to the owners, who are the same people who owned the club in the 1970s, Club Orpheus was considered to be a Goth club in the 1980s. And if it wasn't a Goth scene, how can you say "I know the Goth scene is full of drugs because I was in it in 1986 and we all did drugs"?

Really? The Goth scene didn't do drugs back then? Wasn't Rozz Williams on drugs?

Honestly, how can someone who listens to Goth Rock be a poseur? Not possible.

And where were all these clubs located, by the way?

And yeah, I'm TOTALLY, lying about the Baltimore, Philly, and D.C. scene. We TOTALLY all have sex on the dance floor, accept money for it, and pass around needles or crack pipes.

What I can't get a handle on is why there is such a heated debate about something so trivial and inconsequential as the Goth clubs of the 1980s and of today? Isn't there anything more pressing at hand? I mean, seriously! 2 Timothy 3:16.

[fatuglywhoreofravensrock]

And when have you proven Goth girls use sex to corrupt men? Have I used sex to turn my
betrothed into a Goth? Is he now running around doing all the things YOU claim Goths do
because of his involvement with me? Please explain how Goth girls use sex to corrupt men, and prove it.

I'm not asking you to prove it to me. I'm asking you people to prove it to the people you are telling Goth is evil to. It might be all the proof you need, but it proves nothing to anyone else, unless you give them physical evidence, does it? You can also go into great detail spouting fiction.

No, we cannot stop talking about my so-called "Goth nonsense" until you stop blaming the entire Goth subculture for what SOME Goths may have done, and what SOME people who were NOT Goth have done. Until this site and Godhatesgoths.com stops promoting violence and hatred against the Goth subculture, or anyone thought to be a part of it.

No, that does not prove I am not a Goth. A person can listen Goth Rock and not know
the name of a single Goth club. Nor does someone need to keep track of every Goth club that was ever important in the scene while listening to the music. Besides the fact that you are missing the point. You worked at/went to clubs within one area. How does San Francisco encompass the entire Goth subculture, which stretches over the globe today, as a whole? Oh wait. It doesn't.

[Faith_Machine]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

No, that is NOT what is most important. What is most important is the slander against ALL Goths, and the hatred and violence towards them promoted by this site and Godhatesgoths.com based on unfounded information no one here will bother to prove.

I do not care about your god. I care about the Goth scene and what happens to it because of people like the ones here.

When you're burning in Hell for all eternity, will you try to comfort yourself with the knowledge that you took a stand for Hot Topic customers everywhere?

[Irinka the repentant jewess]

Originally Posted by fatwhoreofravensrock

No, that is NOT what is most important. What is most important is the slander against ALL Goths, and the hatred and violence towards them promoted by this site and Godhatesgoths.com based on unfounded information no one here will bother to prove.

I do not care about your god. I care about the Goth scene and what happens to it because of people like the ones here.

Listen to yourself. Read what you wrote and think about it in terms of eternity. There are many people suffering due to numerous causes and this site is not one of them, and it would be naive and misguided to think that it is. The world's problems are ever so much deeper and more horrifying than what is happening to the Goth scene! And the only solution lies within ourselves. Nothing will change for the better until people choose to turn their hearts to the Truth. Psalm 119:160. Do you notice, I include a quote from Scripture in my every post? I do that in the hopes that you might find it within yourself to look beyond your self and see something greater and much more important. Please, at least, give it a thought. I am praying for you.

[Didymus Much]

Originally Posted by Faith_Machine

When you're burning in Hell for all eternity, will you try to comfort yourself with the knowledge that you took a stand for Hot Topic customers everywhere?

Oh, puh-leeze.






Anyways, to OP: why are you looking for validation from these people?