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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-12-2010, 09:52 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by InlovewithGOD8191 View Post
Actually, if we had a 3rd arm, we would work 50% faster, not a third. If we had 3 arms and went down to 2, then we would work 33% slower.

Also- There haven't always been as many people in the world as there are today. Your prediction of the numbers of bodies that need to decompose is ridiculously high. And in the scheme of things and how old the earth is, people decompose to nothing pretty quickly.
Mathematics is not exactly a strong point among the majority of those here. I recommend you go to their introduction forum and tell them what you are really here for.

I will watch for it, and make notes as that progresses.



“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.” Charles Darwin The Descent of Man (1871)
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-26-2010, 07:26 PM

Hello there, I'm a student studying Environmental Science. Hope I can help clear up some misconceptions about what evolution is, how it works and what it means. Please follow the arguments carefully, and if you wish to rebut my logic, please do so with logic and evidence. Please note, the Bible is not factual evidence, as it is only proved true by circular logic (god exists so the bible is true, and if the bible is true then god exists).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby-Joe View Post
[INDENT]
Account for the missing land sharks
If we evolved from fish, why haven’t sharks, who according to your theory predate us, evolved into land animals and are hunting us?
This question deals with adaptation, how a species changes to fit in with it's environment, in this case adaptation of fish to be able to survive out of water. The question is also suggesting that this adaptation is in response to pressure from predators (sharks) in the water, whereas there were few predators on land.
Both sharks (cartilaginous fish) and bony fish were around in the Devonian era (416 - 320 MYA) as has been proven by dating their fossils. Random mutation, very small changes in the genotype of an individual, cause phenotype variation within each species of fish: Some would have larger fins, some smaller, some stronger, some a slightly different colour. If a particular mutation provided an advantage over other individuals, the organism that had that mutation would be more likely to have more offspring (the evolutionary definition of fitness), and the proportion of individuals with this gene in the gene-pool would increase. That's evolution! They mighthave looked a little bit like this...


Why the sharks did not also evolve is explained by the fact that there is no evolutionary pressure for them to do so. There were several million species in the oceans at the time, and very very few of them had this random mutation which started them on the path to living on land. The sharks, who have a highly conserved genotype, would not have evolved onto land as well, because they were already perfectly adapted to life in the oceans, and there were still plenty of species that they could predate upon in the oceans. If sharks had begun a mutation that would help them on land, it would probably also have hindered them in the water (or hindered them generally, in using up energy). Any individual that did this would have a DISadvantage compared to others in its gene-pool, and the mutation would quickly disappear.

In short, it was win-win for the fish, but a pay-off for sharks which really wasn't worth it for them.

Quote:

Explain floods on Mars with out the Great Flood of the Bible
If Noah’s flood didn’t happen then how do explain the evidence of a great flood on Mars?
This has nothing to do with evolution...and doesn't make much sense. Are you trying to claim that flooding on mars proves that god caused a flood on earth?

Quote:

Account for fools
If evolution is survival of the fittest then how do explain the continued survival of unsuccessful groups of stupid humans?
In Evolutionary biology, the fitness of a genotype is the average ratio of population increase, in years or generations. E.g. assuming asexual reproduction, if an individual has 3 offspring who survive to maturity, the ratio is 3:1. The fitness of the genotype is therefore 3/generation.

Saying that some groups of humans are "unsuccessful" & "stupid" is, frankly, quite racist. But for the sake of open debate, I shall respond. The truth is, neither of these things is essential prerequisite to be evolutionarily 'fit', all that matters is how well you reproduce and survive.

Quote:

Explain why human's aren't perfect
If we are evolving why don’t we have third arms now?
As well as having genes which decide what colour eyes we have, what kind of enzymes we have in our digestion, our instincts etc; there are also some genes called HOX genes. These are extremely highly conserved genes which, in simple terms, define how our bodies are put together (two arms, two legs, two eyes). Consider the centipede, it's body is made up of: a head, a tail, and lots of segments in the middle that are very similar. In fact, each section is built using the same piece of DNA, so they would come out the same. The HOX genes however, are the ones which provide the overview to put the head at one end, make 35 or so sections in the middle, and a tail at the end.

Can you see where I'm going here...?

Our own HOX genes, which I remind you have been conserved since the Devonian Era fish, give us a quadrupedal bauplan (body structure), and although our evolution has changed many other features since then, the basic structure has stayed the same. If one of the HOX genes for our arms did replicate, we would probably end up with two sets of collarbones, shoulderblades and arms.

Consider also, what would happen if someone was born with 3 arms. Would it increase their fitness (as defined above)? I would suggest it would give them some really bad medical problems.

Third point: Evolution doesn't always tend towards the 'perfect' organism. It tends towards the local optimal so as to maximize the fitness of the species with respect to environment and ecology. This often gives good results, but perfection is... something else altogether.

Sorry GTG... Back later for more.

Peace be with you.

Asha28
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-26-2010, 08:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Can you see where I'm going here...?
No. That was too complicated and too much to read. Could you just answer the questions that the evolutionists can't answer, preferably in a list using the numbered bullet-points?


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-26-2010, 09:06 PM

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Originally Posted by Nobar King View Post
No. That was too complicated and too much to read. Could you just answer the questions that the evolutionists can't answer, preferably in a list using the numbered bullet-points?
Evolution is a complex idea, and the refutations of it need to be responded to with a water-tight argument. I have done so and have not strayed off-topic. I have responded to the questions individually, and placed them under the questions in quotes.
Please do your best to follow and refute, or stand down. If you need further explaination of things you do not understand in my argument, please be specific and point them out.

There are none so blind as those that will not see.
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-26-2010, 10:42 PM

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Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Evolution is a complex idea, and the refutations of it need to be responded to with a water-tight argument. I have done so and have not strayed off-topic. I have responded to the questions individually, and placed them under the questions in quotes.
Please do your best to follow and refute, or stand down. If you need further explaination of things you do not understand in my argument, please be specific and point them out.

There are none so blind as those that will not see.
The problem, Asha, is that you need to speak American. what is "refutations" mean? and what is "explaination" trying to explain.

oh, and your little quote about blind people.. every Christian knows that blindness is a side effect of homerism.

But, if you must quote the bible (or attempt to), please use the only real bible. I'll fix your quote:

Jeremiah 5:21

Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not

You, my heathen friend, are the only one here who is blind.


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 01:40 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
(god exists so the bible is true, and if the bible is true then god exists).




Asha28

Yes, Yes, that is a true statement! You don't need all the rest of those lies if you just understand that simple statement.
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 02:00 AM

Quote:
Account for fools
If evolution is survival of the fittest then how do explain the continued survival of unsuccessful groups of stupid humans?
I can explain this one in "evolutionary" terms. Safeway. It's too easy for people to find food these days without getting their hands dirty. Take away Food stores and the liebrals will all starve to death trying to figure out where tofurkeys grow and whether or not it's ethical to pick a carrot.

So here it is, one of us dumb Christian women teaching you the answers to your own questions.


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 07:46 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by grey goose View Post
The problem, Asha, is that you need to speak American. what is "refutations" mean? and what is "explaination" trying to explain.

oh, and your little quote about blind people.. every Christian knows that blindness is a side effect of homerism.

But, if you must quote the bible (or attempt to), please use the only real bible. I'll fix your quote:

Jeremiah 5:21

Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not

You, my heathen friend, are the only one here who is blind.
Hello Goose,

A Refutation is a counter-argument, something that someone says to present evidence counter to what was previously said.

I'm afraid I speak English rather than American, so it's all aubergines, pavements and colours with me. Let me know if you're having difficulties with anything, and I shall provide dictionary references and, if applicable, American English translations.

I was quoting Swift actually, of 'Gulliver's Travels' fame. Though I'm sure he was inspired by this Bible quote. I was relating to the fact that Nobar King was agreeing with the claim that these points cannot be explained by the theory of evolution, and yet when presented with explanations, refused to read them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aristotle View Post
Yes, Yes, that is a true statement! You don't need all the rest of those lies if you just understand that simple statement.
I was referring to the fact that this is a circular argument with each statement supporting the other, and therefore not a logical proof. Circular arguments generally go like this:

"If A is true, then B is true"
"If B is true, then A is true"
"Therefore both must be true"

However, the flip-side of the first statement is "If B is false, then A is false"
the flip-side of the second is "If A is false, then B is false"
Using the same logic, we can say that both are false, so there must be a flaw in the logic.

In actuality, the first two statements imply only that either A and B are true, or A & B are false.

?

Don't worry, I'm not trying to claim that god does not exist. Just that this argument is a bad one to use for the existence (or non-existence) of god.

Peace be with you

Asha28
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 08:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I was referring to the fact that this is a circular argument with each statement supporting the other, and therefore not a logical proof. Circular arguments generally go like this:

"If A is true, then B is true"
"If B is true, then A is true"
"Therefore both must be true"

However, the flip-side of the first statement is "If B is false, then A is false"
the flip-side of the second is "If A is false, then B is false"
Using the same logic, we can say that both are false, so there must be a flaw in the logic.

In actuality, the first two statements imply only that either A and B are true, or A & B are false.
Perhaps you should ask your school for some more logic lessons, because what they've been teaching you makes no sense whatsoever.

A = God exists
B = God wrote the Bible
C = The Bible exists

C is provably true, therefor B must also be true, which means A must be true as well.


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 10:10 PM

Right, back for a little bit more. As ever, please ask questions or point out flaws in my argument if you see any.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby-Joe View Post
[INDENT]
Explain infant murder
If we are evolved to nature our young then how do you secular humanist explain your groups pathological desire to kill yours with abortions?
I'll come back to this one, It involves bits of psychology and memetic evolution (not my strong suit).

Quote:

Why no bodies?
If humanity was roughly a million people living at one time. If the human race is 150,000 years old like you maintain that means there have been 150,000,000,000 who lived before the current era. If each corpse takes up 3 by 6 feet then that means the remains of human ancestors cover 1350 billion square feet of the earth! Why are we not buried under the remains of 150 billion people?
I'm not sure about your numbers, but it's not all that important to the argument. Several people have addressed this already and I can but agree with them, and provide a little more detail.

Firstly, have you ever seen a dead body a few months after a person has died (or indeed an animal's body). The body starts to decompose though a variety of biological processes. The major two of these are micro-organisms (bacteria) that can be observed under a microscope, and the larvae of the Calliphoridae family (think maggots). These break down the matter of the body over a period of years, time-dependent upon conditions, into simpler compounds. This eventually leeches into the soil. If you are looking for you ancestors, you need only scoop up a handful of earth.

You can see this decomposition process in action if, like me, you have a vegetable garden with a compost heap (though I hope you use kitchen scrapings rather than human remains).

Quote:

W(h)ere do angels and demons fit into the Evolutionist tree of life?
Please explain the earliest common ancestor with all animals, angles and demons. What is their ancestry and transitional form?

W(h)ere are ancestors and fossilizes remains of the dragon, satyr and unicorn?

Explain talking snake in the garden threw evolution.
Please tell me when serpents lost the power of speech and the process with which it happened. Please include any fossil of impaired speech snakes.
You are entirely correct in this respect: Evolution cannot explain the ancestry of angels or demons; or indeed dragons, satyrs, unicorns or talking snakes. It would also be very difficult for it to explain the evolutionary forces which would result in such creatures. But on the other hand it does not need to, because there is no observable, reproducible evidence for these. If they do exist, it would indeed be a puzzle as to where they came from.
Note: I am not saying that God does not exist! Simply that there is no evidence that he exists or that the word of the Bible is true.

On a related note, our modern idea of unicorns (with a single spiraling horn) was largely influenced by narwhal horns. Medieval scholars postulated that the horn came from a unicorn because they had never seen a narwhal.


Quote:

Explain the Loch Ness Monster threw evolution.
I find it hard to believe that a whole species can sustain itself from so few individuals as observed in Loch Ness. Sounds like a hole in your theory to me
I never realized that Christians believe in the Loch Ness monster... Is this common, despite it not being mentioned in the Bible?? To be honest, evidence of the Loch Ness monster is not very strong: No photos, no mass sightings, no ecological evidence, no sonar pattern (yes this has been tried before). Once there is good evidence for the existence of Nessie, and a rough idea of how many there are, please come and ask again.

Please respond politely, as I have tried to do my best in laying out my arguments concisely, clearly and non-judgmentally.

Peace be with you

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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 10:14 PM

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Originally Posted by A Follower View Post
Perhaps you should ask your school for some more logic lessons, because what they've been teaching you makes no sense whatsoever.

A = God exists
B = God wrote the Bible
C = The Bible exists

C is provably true, therefor B must also be true, which means A must be true as well.
No, the existence of the Bible (a book) does not logically imply that it is either true, or the word of God.

Your logic breaks in the statement "C is provably true, therefor B must also be true"

I have indeed studied logic, as part of a mathematics masters degree.

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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 10:39 PM

Sorry, that came out a bit wide.
I don't know how to resize images...
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 10:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I'll come back to this one, It involves bits of psychology and memetic evolution (not my strong suit).
Wow, that was unexpected, an atheist who doesn't have any answers to life's questions


Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I'm not sure about your numbers, but it's not all that important to the argument. Several people have addressed this already and I can but agree with them, and provide a little more detail.

Firstly, have you ever seen a dead body a few months after a person has died (or indeed an animal's body). The body starts to decompose though a variety of biological processes. The major two of these are micro-organisms (bacteria) that can be observed under a microscope, and the larvae of the Calliphoridae family (think maggots). These break down the matter of the body over a period of years, time-dependent upon conditions, into simpler compounds. This eventually leeches into the soil. If you are looking for you ancestors, you need only scoop up a handful of earth.

You can see this decomposition process in action if, like me, you have a vegetable garden with a compost heap (though I hope you use kitchen scrapings rather than human remains).
If that were true, how come dinosaur remains don't decompose, but have been preserved for all the thousands of years since the flood? The lack of human remains can only be explained by the fact that they are either cast into Hell or ascend to Heaven.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
You are entirely correct in this respect: Evolution cannot explain the ancestry of angels or demons; or indeed dragons, satyrs, unicorns or talking snakes. It would also be very difficult for it to explain the evolutionary forces which would result in such creatures. But on the other hand it does not need to, because there is no observable, reproducible evidence for these. If they do exist, it would indeed be a puzzle as to where they came from.
Of course there is reproducible evidence for these. The KJV Bible can be printed as often as required, reproduction in action!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Note: I am not saying that God does not exist! Simply that there is no evidence that he exists or that the word of the Bible is true.

On a related note, our modern idea of unicorns (with a single spiraling horn) was largely influenced by narwhal horns. Medieval scholars postulated that the horn came from a unicorn because they had never seen a narwhal.
Don't you evilutionists believe fish suddenly popped out legs and lungs and started walking on land? Are you saying here that evilution is wrong because narwals with their horns never made the switch to living on land? I so wish Darwin had thought things through before he wrote his unholy book, it just isn't fun pointing out all the contradictions in the atheist dogma.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I never realized that Christians believe in the Loch Ness monster... Is this common, despite it not being mentioned in the Bible?? To be honest, evidence of the Loch Ness monster is not very strong: No photos, no mass sightings,



Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
no ecological evidence,
According to many, even scientists, there is hardly any food left in Loch Ness, clear ecological evidence that a big monster has eaten all the large fish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
no sonar pattern (yes this has been tried before).
Even aircraft designed by men have stealth, a creature designed by the far more intelligent God is that more likely to have stealth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Once there is good evidence for the existence of Nessie, and a rough idea of how many there are, please come and ask again.
Once scientists start accepting real evidence like photographs, video and eyewitness accounts instead of peer reviewing everything there will be no more need to ask again. Peer review is the tin foil hat scientists use to keep Godly evidence out of their journals. The anonymity allows them to decline any paper with True Christian™ facts and only accept papers written by fellow heathens.


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-27-2010, 11:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I have indeed studied logic, as part of a mathematics masters degree.
That is nice. Did you fail at that course?

Quote:
No, the existence of the Bible (a book) does not logically imply that it is either true, or the word of God.
Actually it does and I will explain that to you in terms even you can understand.

We humble people have limited capabilities. If you really read the entire Bible you will notice it is so perfect, so extremely consistent, so crystal clear, that no ordinary person could ever have written it. So the sheer quality of the book proves that it is written by someone with capabilities far beyond that of a human being.

Since the Holy Bible clearly could not have been written by a mere mortal and also clearly states to be the word of God: 2 Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness" logic dictates there can be only one conclusion. God exists!

I think your problem is that you did not actually read the entire Holy Bible. Your opinion of the Holy Bible is based on hearsay. If you actually paid some attention during that fancy education of yours you would have learned that you have to research the facts before you draw your conclusion. The facts here being the contents of the Holy Bible.

Well what is it going to be? Ignorance or enlightenment?


Freedom means voting for Donald Trump!
To most "Christians" The Bible is like a license agreement. They just scroll to the bottom and click "I agree". All those "Christians" will burn in Hell!
James 2:10 "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 01:18 AM

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Originally Posted by A Follower View Post
Wow, that was unexpected, an atheist who doesn't have any answers to life's questions
I was taught that people who say they know everything, usually know very little. The more you learn, the more you find out that you don't know, and (hopefully) the more humble you become.

Quote:
If that were true, how come dinosaur remains don't decompose, but have been preserved for all the thousands of years since the flood? The lack of human remains can only be explained by the fact that they are either cast into Hell or ascend to Heaven.
As I said, the speed at which decomposition occurs is dependent upon certain conditions: that's why people keep food in a fridge, to slow the rotting process. Usually a human decomposes quite quickly, but some remains have been found from Egyptian times (5000-2000ish years ago).

Is it the view of the Christians in this forum that the actual body of those who die go up to heaven? In which case the original question of why we aren't up to our necks in corpses is invalid) or...
Do people here believe that people's bodies remain on Earth? In which case we can get back to the previous line of debate.

Your point about dinosaurs is an excellent one, but fails to recognize the distinction between remains and fossils. Remains are the matter that made up the organism when it was alive, and all organisms have remains that usually decompose over time. Fossils, however, are not formed of animal (or plant) remains, but are formed of rock in the shape of these organism. In fact, as well as fossils of bones and shells, there are fossils of footprints, demonstrating that it is not the matter, but the form which is preserved.


Quote:
Of course there is reproducible evidence for these. The KJV Bible can be printed as often as required, reproduction in action!
A glib comment. Reproducible means something slightly different in this case though. It means that you can make repeated primary observations of a phenomenon. I.e, you make an observation, you tell me your observation, I challenge it, you tell me where I can make a primary observation (from physical evidence).

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Don't you evilutionists believe fish suddenly popped out legs and lungs and started walking on land? Are you saying here that evilution is wrong because narwals with their horns never made the switch to living on land? I so wish Darwin had thought things through before he wrote his unholy book, it just isn't fun pointing out all the contradictions in the atheist dogma.
Although it is quite the rage in this forum, I would request that you use the term Evolution and Biologist. I haven't been calling people names, and you need not stoop to that level.

No, I'm not saying legs evolved suddenly, please see my first post.

No, I'm not saying evolution is wrong, I'm saying that narwhal horns were mistakenly identified as unicorn horns.

Quote:


Haahahahaah, nice Google search. OK, I'll bite. The first and third are a model in a museum, depicting the Loch Ness monster as Plesiosaur. The second is known as the 'Surgeon's Photograph' by Robert Kenneth Wilson and has been debunked as a hoax. More details later if you want them.


Quote:
According to many, even scientists, there is hardly any food left in Loch Ness, clear ecological evidence that a big monster has eaten all the large fish.
You have, quite rightly, recognized that there is little food source for such a large animal. This is actually ecological evidence AGAINST the existence of Nessie, because the habitat is not suitable to support such a large animal.

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Even aircraft designed by men have stealth, a creature designed by the far more intelligent God is that more likely to have stealth.
Ummm...

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Once scientists start accepting real evidence like photographs, video and eyewitness accounts instead of peer reviewing everything there will be no more need to ask again. Peer review is the tin foil hat scientists use to keep Godly evidence out of their journals. The anonymity allows them to decline any paper with True Christian™ facts and only accept papers written by fellow heathens.
Peer review is a process by which experts in the same field of research review, and sometimes test, the theories of other scientists. It is not based on faith, but scriptures are not accepted as evidence for the reason I have outlined in my first post.

Peace be with you

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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 01:27 AM

Asha28, what a bunch of hooey! You've wasted irreplaceable Internet ink with your blasphemies.
God Created the Heavens and the Earth. He created all living beings. We do not need to hear your 'excuses' why things are the way they are. You cannot even prove any of it.
All living beings cam from the sea.... then they walked and became chimps and then man. Ridiculous! No proof has ever been supplied confirming any of this.
We have the Bible. Specifically the KJV1611. Even other so called religions more or less agree with us. God created it all in about a week. We have His written word. You have the wack job in a wheel chair, Hawkins. Why do you think he is such a cripple? God has been making his life a living hell before he dies and goes to hell. Then he will be able to use his legs and voice, to kick and scream as the devil thrusts his barbed talleywacker deep inside his rectum as the brimstone melts his flesh.
I bet the devil will get to you next.


Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?
Numbers 21:6 And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died.
Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
Matthew 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 01:44 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
I was taught that people who say they know everything, usually know very little. The more you learn, the more you find out that you don't know, and (hopefully) the more humble you become.
So you are saying that when I read the Bible 20 times I know less about what is in it than when I read it 10 times? You are turning logic on its head, reality doesn't work that way, the more you learn, the more you know. What you intended to say was that the more you learn about science, the more obvious the unexplainable gaps in that false religion become.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
As I said, the speed at which decomposition occurs is dependent upon certain conditions: that's why people keep food in a fridge, to slow the rotting process. Usually a human decomposes quite quickly, but some remains have been found from Egyptian times (5000-2000ish years ago).

Is it the view of the Christians in this forum that the actual body of those who die go up to heaven? In which case the original question of why we aren't up to our necks in corpses is invalid) or...
Do people here believe that people's bodies remain on Earth? In which case we can get back to the previous line of debate.

Your point about dinosaurs is an excellent one, but fails to recognize the distinction between remains and fossils. Remains are the matter that made up the organism when it was alive, and all organisms have remains that usually decompose over time. Fossils, however, are not formed of animal (or plant) remains, but are formed of rock in the shape of these organism. In fact, as well as fossils of bones and shells, there are fossils of footprints, demonstrating that it is not the matter, but the form which is preserved.
So you believe in transmutation? I thought you scientists had given up that believe hundreds of years ago. Only God can turn living matter into something inorganic, like He did to Lot's wife.
Genesis 19:26
But his wife looked back from behind him, and she became a pillar of salt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
A glib comment. Reproducible means something slightly different in this case though. It means that you can make repeated primary observations of a phenomenon. I.e, you make an observation, you tell me your observation, I challenge it, you tell me where I can make a primary observation (from physical evidence).
My apologies for misunderstanding you. You can make your primary observation in the KJV 1611, and you can repeat that as often as you want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Although it is quite the rage in this forum, I would request that you use the term Evolution and Biologist. I haven't been calling people names, and you need not stoop to that level.
My typo (the keys are right next to each other) is insulting, but your claims that God and the Bible aren't logical, you belittling the foundation of my life, you saying that God is a liar is not on that low level??? Oh right, I forget, when you do it it's not insulting. More of your upside down logic

But don't worry about it, I expect to be persecuted for my beliefs, God warned us:
Matthew 5:10
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
No, I'm not saying legs evolved suddenly, please see my first post.

No, I'm not saying evolution is wrong, I'm saying that narwhal horns were mistakenly identified as unicorn horns.

Haahahahaah, nice Google search. OK, I'll bite. The first and third are a model in a museum, depicting the Loch Ness monster as Plesiosaur. The second is known as the 'Surgeon's Photograph' by Robert Kenneth Wilson and has been debunked as a hoax. More details later if you want them.

You have, quite rightly, recognized that there is little food source for such a large animal. This is actually ecological evidence AGAINST the existence of Nessie, because the habitat is not suitable to support such a large animal.
My plate is empty 99% of the time, only if, by sheer luck, you happen to observe my plate right at the start of a meal would you see enough food on it to support me. Is that also ecological evidence AGAINST my existence? And all the photo's of me are hoaxes, even if they've been taken by scientists and doctors, like the photos of the Loch Ness monster? Again your logic seems to be working directly opposite to the reality God has created on our world.

If you're serious about debating please try to find some logic classes at a good Christian college, instead of whatever university you're at now. Schools like yours are only interested in extracting as much in tuition fees as possible, they will make God's Truth as incomprehensible as possible, so you'll be forced to attend many more years before you understand while paying a lot of money to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asha28 View Post
Ummm...

Peer review is a process by which experts in the same field of research review, and sometimes test, the theories of other scientists. It is not based on faith, but scriptures are not accepted as evidence for the reason I have outlined in my first post.
Here in the United States people accused of a crime have the right to a trial with a jury of peers. What do you think would happen if a nigra rapist got a jury filled with "experts in the same field", i.e. 12 more nigra rapists? No criminal would be convicted, they'd all agree that what they do isn't against God's Law or secular law. To make it work the peers cannot be fellow criminals, they should be upstanding members of the community who can judge independently and righteously.

Scientific peer reviewers are like nigra rapists, they will never admit that what they do goes against God, it's a cult that will always show a united front to the outside world, they will agree with each other no matter how ridiculous the statements they make are.

What science need is independent review. Do you think members of the community would have agreed with Newton when he invented gravity, would they voluntarily submit to being pinned down on earth for the rest of their lives? Of course not. Only fellow scientists would think a law of gravity would be funny to inflict upon the populace. Praise God He divinely inspired the Christian and Real American® Wright brothers in finding a hole in Newton's theory so we could get some measure of our freedom back.


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And if ye shall despise my statutes, or if your soul abhor my judgments, so that ye will not do all my commandments, but that ye break my covenant: I also will do this unto you; I will even appoint over you terror, consumption, and the burning ague, that shall consume the eyes, and cause sorrow of heart: and ye shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it.
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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 06:16 PM

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Originally Posted by A Follower View Post
So you are saying that when I read the Bible 20 times I know less about what is in it than when I read it 10 times? You are turning logic on its head, reality doesn't work that way, the more you learn, the more you know. What you intended to say was that the more you learn about science, the more obvious the unexplainable gaps in that false religion become.
Your example is true, if you read 1 text 20 times, you will have more insight into that text than if you read it 10 times. As far as understand, Christians view the Bible as a self-contained, comprehensive, and infallible source of knowledge, and therefore possible knowledge is finite and it is possible to learn all of it.
There is the view that there is knowledge outside the Bible also. For example the pies I see people awarded medals for in this forum: I'm sure the recipe came from a recipe book. When someone starts to learn to cook, they only have limited knowledge about cooking, but as they learn to cook more recipes, they realize that there even more recipes that they could learn, that they never knew existed before.
Hope this helps you understand what I mean when I say "The more I learn, the more I realize I do not know."

Science is not a religion. Religion and faith springs from the phrase "I believe...".
E.g "I believe in God, the Father almighty, Creator of heaven and earth",
or "I believe in reincarnation",
or "I believe in aliens".
Science springs from the phrase "I do not believe". Instead, science relies upon observable, reproducible, primary evidence. This only requires you to trust what you (or others) can see, hear, smell, touch, and taste.

Quote:
So you believe in transmutation? I thought you scientists had given up that believe hundreds of years ago. Only God can turn living matter into something inorganic, like He did to Lot's wife.
Genesis 19:26
But his wife looked back from behind him, and she became a pillar of salt.
What do you mean by inorganic/organic? The definition can change depending on who you ask.
Decomposition is the transformation of organic matter from the remains of an animal or plant, into organic compounds in the soil (a bit like compost)

Quote:
My apologies for misunderstanding you. You can make your primary observation in the KJV 1611, and you can repeat that as often as you want.
Primary observations (or evidence) is seeing a phenomenon with your own eyes (or other senses, or analytical techniques). E.g. Watching a starfish feed upon a clam.

Secondary evidence is a recording of somebody else's observation. E.g. Reading a book about starfish diet, written by a starfish expert. The quality of secondary evidence is variable, and if many people have made independent primary observations that agree with each other the secondary evidence is thought to be well supported.

Quote:
My plate is empty 99% of the time, only if, by sheer luck, you happen to observe my plate right at the start of a meal would you see enough food on it to support me. Is that also ecological evidence AGAINST my existence? And all the photo's of me are hoaxes, even if they've been taken by scientists and doctors, like the photos of the Loch Ness monster? Again your logic seems to be working directly opposite to the reality God has created on our world.
Your analogy with the plate is flawed for the following reason. If you assume that the Loch Ness monster does not leave the Loch, then it is incapable of predating upon prey outside. You however are perfectly capable of getting more food from your cupboard, the market, or your garden.

Quote:
Here in the United States people accused of a crime have the right to a trial with a jury of peers. What do you think would happen if a nigra rapist got a jury filled with "experts in the same field", i.e. 12 more nigra rapists? No criminal would be convicted, they'd all agree that what they do isn't against God's Law or secular law. To make it work the peers cannot be fellow criminals, they should be upstanding members of the community who can judge independently and righteously.

Scientific peer reviewers are like nigra rapists, they will never admit that what they do goes against God, it's a cult that will always show a united front to the outside world, they will agree with each other no matter how ridiculous the statements they make are.
Interesting analogy, but peer review is not based upon the beliefs or opinions of your peers, but whether or not they can reproduce your results, or find logical arguments in your text. It's mainly a way of pointing out mistakes, so they can be corrected (with further study of course).

Although not explicit, I sense a certain amount of racism in this thread, and in the forum in general. 'True Christian Caucasian'?? Is this part of your faith? Please inform me if I am jumping to conclusions and I shall retract.

Quote:
Do you think members of the community would have agreed with Newton when he invented gravity... Only fellow scientists would think a law of gravity would be funny to inflict upon the populace.
Newton did not invent gravity, nor did he inflict it upon the populace, he simply came up with the explanation of why things fall (as they have been doing for some time), and this idea became Newtonian physics. Newton's ideas have since been proved to be incomplete, and have been supplemented by general relativity and quantum mechanics.

Quote:
Praise God He divinely inspired the Christian and Real American® Wright brothers in finding a hole in Newton's theory so we could get some measure of our freedom back.
Aeroplanes function according to the laws of gravity, they just have a larger force which keep them in the air. Defying gravity is easy with a larger force (like your leg muscles).

Shall we get back on topic...?

PBWY

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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 06:17 PM

If evolution is real, why are people not one thousand feet tall and have scaly skin. Dino's were the only mammals to walk the Earth for about two years before humans. My personal philosophy is that he used the Dinos to move big rocks, like the egyptians, and left them here as a tool for us to build massive structures after he trained them.

If evolution were real, dinos would have evolved into humans (logically) and we'd have dino traits.

If creation isnt real, why do we look like God???? He created us in his image, therefore i guess you could say we "evolved" from God.

Read Genesis friend, and thanks for showing my fellow brothers so much respect as we try to explain the Bible to you, and to save you.

Genesis 1: 27

So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


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Default Re: Questions that evolutionist can’t answer - 02-28-2010, 06:24 PM

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Originally Posted by A Follower View Post
My typo (the keys are right next to each other) is insulting, but your claims that God and the Bible aren't logical, you belittling the foundation of my life, you saying that God is a liar is not on that low level??? Oh right, I forget, when you do it it's not insulting. More of your upside down logic
I'm sorry you feel this way, but we must make a distinction between philosophical differences and personal attacks.
I am explaining myself as best I can without causing offence. I think some people on this board are deliberately going out of their way to cause offence, even when it is not directly related to the point under discussion.
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