[Nobar King]

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

The only one man who ever walked on this earth that was perfect was the savior himself.

Some closer than others.

[Just Chris]

Very true some of us are closer than others at being perfect but then again we all talented in something and we will better at some things then other people,but their will always be someone who can do it better then you. For example I'm very good with farm work. Throughout most of my life I worked on many farm's such as watermelon, corn, tobacco, cantaloupe and so many others. I also good with construction work I have many farmer's repair their tank houses. These works have taught me how to use many power tools. While I would be a good farmer I know those who have done it longer will be better then me.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

Ma'am we are not horrible parents for supporting the choices are children will make in the future and we have no right to try to force them to be a certain way. We would be awful parents if we forced our children to be a certain way because we steal their free will that God gave us all.

Not if you called it "Training Up."

Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.
Proverbs 22:6

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

When you force someone to be something they don't want to be you are disobeying God because he gave us the will to choose our own paths.

Not if you are obeying God's command to do so.

And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.
Luke 14:23

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

So you would horribly to make someone be Christian.

Just like millions of American parents "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Christian faith? Or "horribly raise their children exclusively in the Muslim faith? Or "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Jewish faith? Or "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Mormon, Hindu, Buddhist, pagan faiths? Are you suggesting it's horrible to raise a child in any religious faith because they are have not yet developed the cognitive and social skills to understand and consent to such instruction that suggests reality operates a certain way despite any evidence to the contrary, and that by the time they do reach this intellectual milestone, they've been conditioned to ignore certain elements of reality in favor of protecting and promoting a belief system imposed on them since infancy? How can you call yourself a Christian if this is your belief?

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

Also I would be denying them their constitutional right to freedom of religion and that would break the promise I made to defend the constitutional rights of the people of the United States Of America.

Only if you have replaced all of Congress and legislate the establishment of religion, or prohibit people from exercising their religions. But as we see, parents are exempt from such accusations, as the training up of children to believe exclusively in one religious teaching over another is neither an obstruction to constitutional rights, nor against any law. Indeed, most children are trained to embrace and adopt and protect and eventually promote the religious beliefs of the parents who raised them. It's called religious instruction, and churches offer Sunday Schools all across the nation to help parents do just such a thing. Furthermore, these churches, with their Sunday Schools, private schools, after school programs, etc, are subsidized by the American taxpayers to the tune of some $80 billion per year so they can do so efficiently without taking away from the pastor's hard earned salary. In this way, the congregation can focus on more important and necessary fundraisers.

[Daisy Mae Johnson]

Originally Posted by Mary Etheldreda

Not if you called it "Training Up."

Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.
Proverbs 22:6

Not if you are obeying God's command to do so.

And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.
Luke 14:23

Just like millions of American parents "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Christian faith? Or "horribly raise their children exclusively in the Muslim faith? Or "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Jewish faith? Or "horribly" raise their children exclusively in the Mormon, Hindu, Buddhist, pagan faiths? Are you suggesting it's horrible to raise a child in any religious faith because they are have not yet developed the cognitive and social skills to understand and consent to such instruction that suggests reality operates a certain way despite any evidence to the contrary, and that by the time they do reach this intellectual milestone, they've been conditioned to ignore certain elements of reality in favor of protecting and promoting a belief system imposed on them since infancy? How can you call yourself a Christian if this is your belief?



Only if you have replaced all of Congress and legislate the establishment of religion, or prohibit people from exercising their religions. But as we see, parents are exempt from such accusations, as the training up of children to believe exclusively in one religious teaching over another is neither an obstruction to constitutional rights, nor against any law. Indeed, most children are trained to embrace and adopt and protect and eventually promote the religious beliefs of the parents who raised them. It's called religious instruction, and churches offer Sunday Schools all across the nation to help parents do just such a thing. Furthermore, these churches, with their Sunday Schools, private schools, after school programs, etc, are subsidized by the American taxpayers to the tune of some $80 billion per year so they can do so efficiently without taking away from the pastor's hard earned salary. In this way, the congregation can focus on more important and necessary fundraisers.

[Just Chris]

Look I never said it was horrible to raise your children to be that. Me and my wife read the bible to our children and we ask them what think. We ask if they think its true. Their have been some parts they agree with and some parts they question. We take them to church if they want to go. Their have been some Sundays they didn't and their have been some they did. We are hoping they will choose Christianity but as they get older their views may change and if they do that is fine with and my wife. We will love and accept no matter what religion they choose or if they have a lack of religion. We are raising them to be independent and let them make their own choices. I will not force them to be Christian I want them to make that choice on their own.

[Just Chris]

Their is a big difference in raising them to be a certain way and forcing them. For example I'm raising my children to be Christian but I will still love them no matter what they choose to believe. If I were to force them t o be Christian I would raise them to be Christian if they changed their beliefs then I would throw them out of the house or threaten them in some way like many Christians do when their children do not accept Jesus. Those kind of Christians that hate children because they choose a different faith are the ones that horrible parents. I hope you see where I am coming from now.

[Dr Laurence Niles]

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

. For example I'm raising my children to be Christian but I will still love them no matter what they choose to believe

Whoa there, young man. You'd still love them after they spat in the baby Jesus' crying face?

Jesus HATES those who do not believe in Him and wants them dead, dead, DEAD!

2nd Chronicles 15:13 "That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman."
Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Revelation 21:8 "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death."
John 15:6 "If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."
John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
Psalm 7:12 "If he turn not, he will whet his sword; he hath bent his bow, and made it ready

You would do well to think on what it means to be a Christian. The Bible(KJV1611) gives us a detailed road map of the route to the love of the Lord.

YIC

[Just Chris]

They are my children and I am their father it is my job to love them no matter what.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

Look I never said it was horrible to raise your children to be that.

Yes you did. You called it "horrible," and even "awful" to raise your children in one religion exclusive to others. You said to do so was to "force" them. You said it was "stealing" their free will.

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

Me and my wife read the bible to our children and we ask them what think.

That's silly. You should ask them what God thinks.

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

We ask if they think its true.

Since when do personal beliefs affect reality?

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

We are hoping they will choose Christianity but as they get older their views may change and if they do that is fine with and my wife.

Why? You don't care about their eternal salvation, so why do you want them to choose Christianity, and a false version at that?

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

We will love and accept no matter what religion they choose or if they have a lack of religion.

Another admission of blatantly ignoring Jesus (1 Corinthians 5:13; 2 Thessalonians 3:14).

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

Those kind of Christians that hate children because they choose a different faith are the ones that horrible parents. I hope you see where I am coming from now.

Yes. Your argument is that those who read and heed the Holy Bible are horrible people. In short, you're suggesting the Christian faith is a bad influence on people, and particularly dangerous to children. And yet you raise your children to believe in Jesus, and call yourself a Christian.

Originally Posted by Chris-the-Knuckle-Head

They are my children and I am their father it is my job to love them no matter what.

No it's not. It is your job to be obedient unto Christ. In fact, it is your prime duty in life (Ecclesiastes 12:13). As a father, this translates to raising your children to accept the faith of Christ, even if it pains them to learn (Deuteronomy 6:6-7; Psalm 78:4; Proverbs 23:14; Proverbs 23:13).