[Catholic - Not Christian]

Re: I am Catholic.

Nowhere do these Bible verses support the papist idea of transubstation where the priest serving the bread and wine transforms it into the blood and body of Christ.

As I said, I don't intend to convince you to see the Bible my way. Rather only to understand Catholic interpretations. We interpret these passages as literal.

To me, the directions Christ gives are quite simple:

1. Take this and it eat it. (Thus, we take this and eat it)

2. This is my body. (Thus, this is his body)

3. Do THIS in memory of me. (Thus, we do THIS in memory of Him)

Note that Jesus did not say: This is LIKE my body, REPRESENTS my body, or is a SYMBOL of my body. IS my body. So, I believe that this IS His body, because well, that's what he said...

Why do we interpret this literally? GOOD QUESTION!! and i'll be delighted to answer!

The problem here is that he said "do this", and just before he said "Take and eat, this is my body" (Matthew 26:26) This to me means basically that this is his body. Because that's what he says. In fact, it is the same in Matthew, Mark, and Luke. (I can explain John if you'd like but I'm sure you know where the bread of life colloquy is found)

Nowhere does it explain or refer or even suggest that Jesus did not change the bread into his body. Thus, when Jesus says to "do this" he means to "do this", to change bread into his body, just as he did.

Why he would say "Take and eat, this is my body." If he didn't want us to take and eat because this is his body?

However, the most concrete answer I can give lies elsewhere in the Bible. Surely you will agree that back in the time of Christ, if you were to talk SYMBOLICALLY about eating a man's flesh and drinking his blood, it meant to physically assault that man. Please see:

Psalms 27:2; Isaiah 49:26; Micah 3:3; 2 Samuel 23:15-17; Revelation 17:6, 16

Do you really think Christ intended for us all to beat him to a pulp? And more specifically, at the last supper, do you think wanted all his apostles to attack him? Confused? I would be. Your interpretation doesn't even make sense.

I'll explain further with John 6:50-69, which states,
{This is the bread that comes down from heaven so that one may eat it and not die. I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world." The Jews quarreled among themselves, saying, "How can this man give us (his) flesh to eat?" Jesus said to them, "Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him. Just as the living Father sent me and I have life because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on me will have life because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven. Unlike your ancestors who ate and still died, whoever eats this bread will live forever." These things he said while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum. Then many of his disciples who were listening said, "This saying is hard; who can accept it?" Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, "Does this shock you? What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before? It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life." {See note} But there are some of you who do not believe." Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him. And he said, "For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father." As a result of this, many (of) his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him. Jesus then said to the Twelve, "Do you also want to leave?" Simon Peter answered him, "Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God."}
Note 1: - Verse 62-63 states "Does this shock you? What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before? It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life."

What Our Lord says here is not intended a Maldonatus thought, to increase the scandal, but to rectify what was simply a cannibalistic interpretation of what he has just said. The Ascension will perhaps surprise the recalcitrants more, but it will eliminate the chief difficulty about eating the flesh of One who in celestial glory takes his place where he was from eternity.

Note 2: - Notice that the close followers of Our Lord, the "disciples" LEFT HIM because this was a hard saying. Then Our Lord asks Peter if he will leave him too. Peter representing the 12 apostles says: "Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. WE HAVE COME TO BELIEVE (John 6:69)". My personal note to my separated brethren: Come join us and BELIEVE!

Would you say we are "missing out" by not accepting the Quran as well?

Now, now. I understand that you don't see the book of Wisdom as inspired scripture. Did you read the other verses at all? Or did you see Wisdom and stop and shout "Blashphemy!"? Please, you will find ample evidence for the intercession of Saints without this quote from Wisdom. Let's stay on subject.

There is nothing wrong with having other people pray for you. But, the Bible makes it clear that only through Christ should we pray and not to saints or Mary.

1st Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Is this quote from First Timothy supposed to convince me not to pray to Saints? By praying to a Saint, they are no more acting as mediator than I would should you ask me to pray for you. Perhaps I misunderstand however, and you could explain further.

But where does it explain which sins are "mortal" and which are "venial"? That is a papist invention.

Lol. This is not the point. We are not discussing the papacy here. PLEASE, stay on subject. We are dicussing how I seek forgivness for a "deadly" sin if I cannot simply pray and ask God forgiveness? I think I must go to a priest. What do YOU think?

However, out of curiosity, what do YOU think these deadly sins are?

Only Christ can forgive, not priests.

Hmm, that's not what the Bible says. Why do you deny it? Ill post the verses again:

Church is the extension of Christ's incarnation, and that extension takes place through the sacraments" (Scott Hahn , Swear to God, Page 22)

Jesus continues his example of priestly forgiveness in the Old Testament. Leviticus 4:13-21 - "priests shall make atonement for them, and they will be forgiven"
Leviticus 5:14-26 - (Sin offering brought to the Old Testament priests, who make atonement for sinners' forgiveness.)
See also: - Leviticus 4:27-25, Leviticus 5:5, Numbers 5:8

Of course one must repent of their sins to accept Christ, but nowhere is any authority given to the Catholic Church to hold a monopoly on this.

Hmm, well that's not what the Bible says either! What about the verses I gave you? When Jesus said, "If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone’s sins, they are retained." What exactly did he mean if he was NOT saying that if they forgive anyone's sins, they are forgiven? I'll post these again too:

Jesus gives his power to forgive sins to His priests

Matthew 16:19 - (Jesus gives the apostles the power to bind and loose sins)
Matthew 18:18 - whatever you bind and loose on earth, so it is in heaven
John 20:22 - If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone’s sins, they are retained.
John 20:23 - After saying this he breathed on them and said: Receive the Holy Spirit. (recall Genesis 2:7)

2 Corinthians 5:17-20 - "God ... has reconciled us to himself ... given us the ministry of reconciliation"
James 5:14-15 - "presbyters of the church ... pray over him ... he will be forgiven" (prayer of presbyters forgives sin)
See also: - Luke 22:29-30, James 5:16

We know Jesus forgives everything, except for blasphemy of the Holy Ghost.

Mark 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Agreed

What you are confusing here is what Jesus granted his apostles and what the Catholic church has erroneously tried to claim. It is obvious the Catholic Church is not the church that Jesus Christ built, but rather a perversion.

So you say that only the Apostles alone had the power to forgive sins and that Jesus did not intend for that power to be passed on through Apostolic Succession?

Why would he do this? Do you think he's just rewarding them for good behavior or something? "John, you have been a good Apostle. Here, have the power to forgive sins!"

Uh, I don't think so... I believe that Jesus would have intended for his forgiveness to last for all time. Not the duration of the apostles' lives.

If I have misinterpreted your post, please correct me.

Even if you claim direct apostle succession from Peter, read a bit further into Matthew 16 to see what Jesus has to say about Peter...

23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

Ok so what are you saying here? Here's what I see in this passage:

Satan was working in Peter here, tempting him to think of the flesh. And Peter gave in and exclaimed his fear to Jesus. And Jesus rebuked him saying not to cling to the flesh for we are of the spirit.

This is however, no reason not to believe that Peter was the first pope and founded the Church. Everyone gives into temptation for we are all human and all sin. Even Peter.

But pretending for a moment that I should not follow Peter as you claim, then why do you have the letters of Peter in your Bible? If he is Satan, as you say, why is his word inspired scripture?

I pray for you all,

Catholic - Christian

[Ezekiel Bathfire]

Re: I am Catholic.

[...]Maybe even throw in some genuine Christian Love?

and where will you get that from being as you are not Christian?

John 6:50-69
Matthew 26:26 - "Take and eat, this is my body."
Mark 14:22, 24 - "This is my body ... This is my blood of the covenant."
Luke 22:19-20 - "This is my body, which will be given for you ... new covenant in my blood"

1 Corinthians 10:16 - (In the Eucharist, we participate in the Body and Blood of Christ)
1 Corinthians 11:24 - "This is my body that is for you. Do this in remembrance of me."

Does it not occur to you that you have been misled? Does it never strike you that when Jesus said, “Do this in remembrance of me.”, that is what He meant?
Imagine Mrs. Bathfire makes a pie – she presents the pie and says, “Ezekiel, when I am with Jesus in heaven, every now and again, eat a pie, and think of me as you do it. The crust is my resilience, the fruit is my love.” Obviously, it is symbolic – not real!!!

If you are a sinner who defiles everything that God has made holy, do you honestly think that praying to some dead guys who is only "saints because your church declared them as such, is going to make any difference?

[a list of irrelevancies deleted]

You have still not explained how you know who is in heaven and why you think man made saints are guaranteed a place there. Can you tell me how anyone on earth knows God’s judgment?

Yes. I believe in the power of prayer. So tell me why I would NOT ask someone to pray for me. Have you never done such?

You are as slippery as an eel and as mendacious as the Father of Lies! The questions are,

“(i)Why do you need a dead person to pray FOR you,
(ii) why is some dead bint more important than you in the Eyes of God The Father?”
(iii) “ Have you read, Ecclesiastes 9:5-6 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any [thing] that is done under the sun.

I’ve lost interest in your warped beliefs that deny all that God teaches and serve only the ends of the vicar of Rome and his satanic minions.

PS don't come here trying to alter our firm and Godly approach to the errant posters, (i) you are a guest, (ii) We cannot be guilt-tripped as we, unlike Catlix, have not been brainwashed!

[Rev. Jim Osborne]

Re: I am Catholic.

John 6:50-69
Matthew 26:26 - "Take and eat, this is my body."
Mark 14:22, 24 - "This is my body ... This is my blood of the covenant."
Luke 22:19-20 - "This is my body, which will be given for you ... new covenant in my blood"

1 Corinthians 10:16 - (In the Eucharist, we participate in the Body and Blood of Christ)
1 Corinthians 11:24 - "This is my body that is for you. Do this in remembrance of me."

If you need more lemme know

Nowhere do these Bible verses support the papist idea of transubstation where the priest serving the bread and wine transforms it into the blood and body of Christ.

Wisdom 3:1-6 - the souls of the just are in the hand of God
Mark 12:26-27 - he is the God of the living, not of the dead
Mark 9:4 - Jesus seen conversing with Elijah and Moses
Luke 16:19-30 - departed rich man intercedes for brothers
Luke 23:43 - To the thief on the Cross: "this day you will be with me in paradise"
Hebrews 12:1 - we are surrounded by a cloud of witnesses
Revelation 6:9-11 - martyrs under the altar want earthly vindication
Revelation 20:4 - saw the souls of those that had been beheaded

If you consider the book of Wisdom as "extra" then I'm sorry cuz you're missing out However, even if you don't this should be enough as far as scriptural references go.

Would you say we are "missing out" by not accepting the Quran as well?

Tobit 12:12 - angel presents Tobit and Sarah's prayer to God
Romans 15:30 - join me by your prayers to God on my behalf
Ephesians 4:3 - pray for us
Ephesians 6:18-19 - Never get tired of staying awake to pray for all God's holy people, and pray for me to be given an opportunity to open my mouth and fearlessly make known the mystery of the gospel
2 Thessalonians 1:11 - we always pray for you
2 Thessalonians 3:1 - finally, brothers, pray for us
Revelation 5:8 - angel offers prayers of the holy ones to God

There is nothing wrong with having other people pray for you. But, the Bible makes it clear that only through Christ should we pray and not to saints or Mary.

1st Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

1 John 5:16-17 - Distinction made between deadly sins and one that are not deadly.


Some sins cannot be prayed for. These deadly or "mortal" sins can only be forgiven through the sacrement of reconciliation initiated by Christ.

But where does it explain which sins are "mortal" and which are "venial"? That is a papist invention.

Church is the extension of Christ's incarnation, and that extension takes place through the sacraments" (Scott Hahn , Swear to God, Page 22)

Jesus continues his example of priestly forgiveness in the Old Testament.

Leviticus 4:13-21 - "priests shall make atonement for them, and they will be forgiven"
Leviticus 5:14-26 - (Sin offering brought to the Old Testament priests, who make atonement for sinners' forgiveness.)
See also: - Leviticus 4:27-25, Leviticus 5:5, Numbers 5:8

Only Christ can forgive, not priests.

Confession is not a private affair in the Bible.

Leviticus 5:14-26 - (Public confession with animal sacrifice)
Numbers 5:6-7 - "man ... commits a fault ... he shall confess the wrong he has done"
Matthew 3:6 - "baptized by him ... as they acknowledged their sins"
Acts 19:18 - "believers came forward and openly acknowledged their former practices"
James 5:16 - "confess your sin to one another ... that you may be healed."
See also: - Leviticus 26:39-42, Psalms 32:3-5, Proverbs 28:13, Mark 1:5

Of course one must repent of their sins to accept Christ, but nowhere is any authority given to the Catholic Church to hold a monopoly on this.

Jesus has power to forgive sins.

Matthew 9:1-8 - (Healing of paralytic - "which is easier to say your sins are forgiven or ...") Son of Man has the authority to forgive sins
Mark 2:10 - (Jesus says the Son of Man has authority to forgive sins on earth)
Luke 7:48 - "He said to her, 'Your sins are forgiven.'"
1 John 5:16 - there is sin that is not deadly
See also: - Acts 2:38, 1 Johns 1:9

We know Jesus forgives everything, except for blasphemy of the Holy Ghost.

Mark 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Jesus gives his power to forgive sins to His priests

Matthew 16:19 - (Jesus gives the apostles the power to bind and loose sins)
Matthew 18:18 - whatever you bind and loose on earth, so it is in heaven
John 20:22 - If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone’s sins, they are retained.
John 20:23 - After saying this he breathed on them and said: Receive the Holy Spirit. (recall Genesis 2:7)

2 Corinthians 5:17-20 - "God ... has reconciled us to himself ... given us the ministry of reconciliation"
James 5:14-15 - "presbyters of the church ... pray over him ... he will be forgiven" (prayer of presbyters forgives sin)
See also: - Luke 22:29-30, James 5:16

What you are confusing here is what Jesus granted his apostles and what the Catholic church has erroneously tried to claim. It is obvious the Catholic Church is not the church that Jesus Christ built, but rather a perversion. Even if you claim direct apostle succession from Peter, read a bit further into Matthew 16 to see what Jesus has to say about Peter...

23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

[Catholic - Not Christian]

Re: I am Catholic.

Sigh,

Well seeing as I have been "infracted" for quoting my bible (The Apocrypha, as many would like to call it), I offer a public apology for anyone who may have been offended. However, lets not have this discussion go to as to which Bible version is correct, for we all believe that we hold the single inspired book of Scripture. Rather, let us openly discuss our views of scripture, for they are very similiar and you will find sufficient evidence my earlier post to support my beliefs even without the quotations from Wisdom and Tobit. And if you don't, I would like to hear about it

[Catholic - Not Christian]

Re: I am Catholic.

Oh great! Another catlick troll on these True Christian™ forums.

Why not head on over to the The introduction forum, so you can properly introduce yourself, papist dog?

Well I may be new here, but this doesn't sound much like a Christian post to me... Perhaps we can discuss this with some maturity? Maybe even throw in some genuine Christian Love?

Now, before I begin, please note that I am only answering some questions. It is not my intention to change anyone's beliefs.

We do not hate Jesus. We love Jesus. The communion we participate in is in imitation of the last Supper. It is Christ's true presence in the bread and wine. The "whatness" of the bread and wine remain the same while the presence (or, soul) of the bread and wine are replaced with the true presence of Christ. This allows us to participate fully in Communion with Him. There is no hate, all love.

Please provide a scripture reference to validate this ritual

John 6:50-69
Matthew 26:26 - "Take and eat, this is my body."
Mark 14:22, 24 - "This is my body ... This is my blood of the covenant."
Luke 22:19-20 - "This is my body, which will be given for you ... new covenant in my blood"

1 Corinthians 10:16 - (In the Eucharist, we participate in the Body and Blood of Christ)
1 Corinthians 11:24 - "This is my body that is for you. Do this in remembrance of me."

If you need more lemme know

If you are a sinner who defiles everything that God has made holy, do you honestly think that praying to some dead guyswho is only "saints because your church declared them as such, is going to make any difference?

Wisdom 3:1-6 - the souls of the just are in the hand of God
Mark 12:26-27 - he is the God of the living, not of the dead
Mark 9:4 - Jesus seen conversing with Elijah and Moses
Luke 16:19-30 - departed rich man intercedes for brothers
Luke 23:43 - To the thief on the Cross: "this day you will be with me in paradise"
Hebrews 12:1 - we are surrounded by a cloud of witnesses
Revelation 6:9-11 - martyrs under the altar want earthly vindication
Revelation 20:4 - saw the souls of those that had been beheaded

If you consider the book of Wisdom as "extra" then I'm sorry cuz you're missing out However, even if you don't this should be enough as far as scriptural references go.

Yes. I believe in the power of prayer. So tell me why I would NOT ask someone to pray for me. Have you never done such?

Tobit 12:12 - angel presents Tobit and Sarah's prayer to God
Romans 15:30 - join me by your prayers to God on my behalf
Ephesians 4:3 - pray for us
Ephesians 6:18-19 - Never get tired of staying awake to pray for all God's holy people, and pray for me to be given an opportunity to open my mouth and fearlessly make known the mystery of the gospel
2 Thessalonians 1:11 - we always pray for you
2 Thessalonians 3:1 - finally, brothers, pray for us
Revelation 5:8 - angel offers prayers of the holy ones to God

Why would you have to speak with Jesus in a confessional booth through a priest? Are you sure you're not just pulling at stuff out of you know where? Real Christians just pray. What's your problem with simply praying to Christ? Please provide scripture reference validating this "avatar" doctrine you're spewing

1 John 5:16-17 - Distinction made between deadly sins and one that are not deadly.


Some sins cannot be prayed for. These deadly or "mortal" sins can only be forgiven through the sacrement of reconciliation initiated by Christ.

Church is the extension of Christ's incarnation, and that extension takes place through the sacraments" (Scott Hahn , Swear to God, Page 22)

Jesus continues his example of priestly forgiveness in the Old Testament.

Leviticus 4:13-21 - "priests shall make atonement for them, and they will be forgiven"
Leviticus 5:14-26 - (Sin offering brought to the Old Testament priests, who make atonement for sinners' forgiveness.)
See also: - Leviticus 4:27-25, Leviticus 5:5, Numbers 5:8

Confession is not a private affair in the Bible.

Leviticus 5:14-26 - (Public confession with animal sacrifice)
Numbers 5:6-7 - "man ... commits a fault ... he shall confess the wrong he has done"
Matthew 3:6 - "baptized by him ... as they acknowledged their sins"
Acts 19:18 - "believers came forward and openly acknowledged their former practices"
James 5:16 - "confess your sin to one another ... that you may be healed."
See also: - Leviticus 26:39-42, Psalms 32:3-5, Proverbs 28:13, Mark 1:5

Jesus has power to forgive sins.

Matthew 9:1-8 - (Healing of paralytic - "which is easier to say your sins are forgiven or ...") Son of Man has the authority to forgive sins
Mark 2:10 - (Jesus says the Son of Man has authority to forgive sins on earth)
Luke 7:48 - "He said to her, 'Your sins are forgiven.'"
1 John 5:16 - there is sin that is not deadly
See also: - Acts 2:38, 1 Johns 1:9

Jesus gives his power to forgive sins to His priests

Matthew 16:19 - (Jesus gives the apostles the power to bind and loose sins)
Matthew 18:18 - whatever you bind and loose on earth, so it is in heaven
John 20:22 - If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone’s sins, they are retained.
John 20:23 - After saying this he breathed on them and said: Receive the Holy Spirit. (recall Genesis 2:7)

2 Corinthians 5:17-20 - "God ... has reconciled us to himself ... given us the ministry of reconciliation"
James 5:14-15 - "presbyters of the church ... pray over him ... he will be forgiven" (prayer of presbyters forgives sin)
See also: - Luke 22:29-30, James 5:16

Speak for yourself. I am without sin.

A bold claim. No humility here... Tell me how do know this? And how do you achieve it? I sin everyday

I understand that as a Catholic you have never read the Holy Bible KJV1611, much as own one, but True Christians have been tried and tested and made white.

I am in possesion of a King James "Authorized" Bible and performed direct comparisions with my New Amercian Catholic Bible. Please try not to assume things about Catholics...

Alright. So if this didn't answer your questions fully or you have more feel free. But I ask that you don't just nit pick the verses I gave you, say selecting one and telling me it doesn't apply because I'd rather this not wind up a verse slinging contest But if you would like me to explain a verse to you I would be most happy to

[Oakland "Reb" Griner]

Re: I am Catholic.

I am just a tad curious, when you said;


When you enter a confessional, you are not speaking with a Priest, you are speaking with Christ. Christ's true presence is there in the Priest, they are vessels of Christ. We do not believe that Priest's forgive sins. Only God can and does forgive us for our sins. It is Jesus we are speaking to in the confessional, not the man present in the Priest.


Is the priest still a vessel of Christ if he is also simultaneously a vessel for 3 alter boys semen ??

And if the priest in that condition is not a vessel of Christ, then what becomes of the confessions he hears ??

[Remy Lebeau]

Re: I am Catholic.

We do not hate Jesus. We love Jesus. The communion we participate in is in imitation of the last Supper. It is Christ's true presence in the bread and wine. The "whatness" of the bread and wine remain the same while the presence (or, soul) of the bread and wine are replaced with the true presence of Christ. This allows us to participate fully in Communion with Him. There is no hate, all love.

Please provide a scripture reference to validate this ritual.

We do not pray to Mary (or any one else besides the Father, Son, and Spirit). We as Mary to pray for us. Only God can answer prayers, so only to God do we pray. We ask Mary and the Saints to pray for our sins, to pray for our continued growth with Christ. It is called intercession.

If you are a sinner who defiles everything that God has made holy, do you honestly think that praying to some dead guyswho is only "saints because your church declared them as such, is going to make any difference?

When you enter a confessional, you are not speaking with a Priest, you are speaking with Christ. Christ's true presence is there in the Priest, they are vessels of Christ. We do not believe that Priest's forgive sins. Only God can and does forgive us for our sins. It is Jesus we are speaking to in the confessional, not the man present in the Priest.

Why would you have to speak with Jesus in a confessional booth through a priest? Are you sure you're not just pulling at stuff out of you know where? Real Christians just pray. What's your problem with simply praying to Christ? Please provide scripture reference validating this "avatar" doctrine you're spewing.

Do you believe that you can continue to sin and still go to Heaven as long as your priest forgives you, or do you believe that you have to stop sinning and repent in order to be saved?

You must repent and be sincerely sorry for your sins to be assumed into Heaven. You must, with your whole heart, accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Once again, the Priest does not forgive you, God forgives you. Everyone on Earth is a sinner[...]

Speak for yourself. I am without sin.

[1 John 3:9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I understand that as a Catholic you have never read the Holy Bible KJV1611, much as own one, but True Christians have been tried and tested and made white.

God is the only being who may condemn anyone to Hell or life them up to Heaven. No human has the authority, right, or knowledge to decide who is and who is not going to Hell. Love God, pursue truth and live a life dedicated to the image of Christ.

Of course I have the knowledge to state rather or not you are going to burn in Hell for all eternity. Jesus tells us in the Bible who is is going to condemn to everlasting torture. I'm going to suggest you read the Bible for yourself even though I know my words fall on deaf ears. A Catholic who has read or is willing to read the Bible is as rare as an eye-talian girl who hasn't known her brother intimately.

[Levi Jones]

Re: I am Catholic.

Oh great! Another catlick troll on these True Christian™ forums.

Why not head on over to the The introduction forum, so you can properly introduce yourself, papist dog?

[LOLwutISthis?]

Re: I am Catholic.

I feel as though there is a lot of misrepresentation on this site. I would like to clear up a few of these questions.

Why do you hate Jesus and pretend that a cracker you eat turns into His flesh so you can flush it down the toilet?

We do not hate Jesus. We love Jesus. The communion we participate in is in imitation of the last Supper. It is Christ's true presence in the bread and wine. The "whatness" of the bread and wine remain the same while the presence (or, soul) of the bread and wine are replaced with the true presence of Christ. This allows us to participate fully in Communion with Him. There is no hate, all love.

Why do you pray to His mother, when she's just a dead person?

We do not pray to Mary (or any one else besides the Father, Son, and Spirit). We as Mary to pray for us. Only God can answer prayers, so only to God do we pray. We ask Mary and the Saints to pray for our sins, to pray for our continued growth with Christ. It is called intercession.

Why do you ask priests to forgive your sins, when they are mere men who have no authority to do so?

When you enter a confessional, you are not speaking with a Priest, you are speaking with Christ. Christ's true presence is there in the Priest, they are vessels of Christ. We do not believe that Priest's forgive sins. Only God can and does forgive us for our sins. It is Jesus we are speaking to in the confessional, not the man present in the Priest.

Do you believe that you can continue to sin and still go to Heaven as long as your priest forgives you, or do you believe that you have to stop sinning and repent in order to be saved?

You must repent and be sincerely sorry for your sins to be assumed into Heaven. You must, with your whole heart, accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Once again, the Priest does not forgive you, God forgives you. Everyone on Earth is a sinner, as long as you are seeking truth and moving towards Christ with a repentant heart and sincere desire you are heading in the right direction.

God is the only being who may condemn anyone to Hell or life them up to Heaven. No human has the authority, right, or knowledge to decide who is and who is not going to Hell. Love God, pursue truth and live a life dedicated to the image of Christ.

[David Goldman]

Re: I am Catholic.

I am Catholic.

Will I go to Hell for it?

What a delightfully thought provoking question! On one hand, one could say that you are going to Hell precisely because you are Catholic. On the other hand, one could say you are a Catholic going to Hell, and being Catholic is just one of the many nails in the coffin.

I guess the only way to truly answer your question is to list all of your past sins and all the sins that you anticipate, and rank them. No doubt being Catholic is right near the top, but you might be able to make a good case for some worse sins. Murder, rape, and voting democrat could be worse, depending upon the circumstance surround them.

Anyway, you'll have an eternity of torment to ponder the question, so no worries if we can't figure it out here.

[Oakland "Reb" Griner]

Re: I am Catholic.

Do keep in mind under Catholic mythology their false saints must be martyred by the thing they patronize.

Which means St Polycarp had terminal diarrhea inflicted upon him.

My goodness gracious !!


So nix on the underwear and shingles, but okey dokey on the buggered goat one ??

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: I am Catholic.

Thank you for bringing up St. Polycarp of Smyrna. I am not particularly well versed in Catholic drivel, arcana, and rooty toot tooty.

Am I to infer there are also Saints assigned to stained underwear, mossy cedar shingles, and buggered goats ??

Do keep in mind under Catholic mythology their false saints must be martyred by the thing they patronize.

Which means St Polycarp had terminal diarrhea inflicted upon him.

[Oakland "Reb" Griner]

Re: I am Catholic.

Thank you for bringing up St. Polycarp of Smyrna. I am not particularly well versed in Catholic drivel, arcana, and rooty toot tooty.

Am I to infer there are also Saints assigned to stained underwear, mossy cedar shingles, and buggered goats ??

[WWJDnow]

Re: I am Catholic.

Will I go to Hell for it?

Of course not. Being a Catholic isn't a sufficient reason for you to go to Hell. However, if you practice Catholicism, then yes, you will go to Hell. Catholics bow down to statues and pray to dead people, both of which are quite specifically prohibited by the Bible:

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them.... Exodus 20:4-5

...there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.... 1 Timothy 2:5

Sometimes I think that Catholicism is just one huge joke. I mean, for Heaven's sake, you guys have a patron saint for diarrhea (St. Polycarp of Smyrna). Can you even imagine what it would be like to be bombarded every day for thousands of years by bowel complaints from hundreds of thousands of people? Talk about needing the patience of a saint.

Do yourself a favor. Take the picture of the Pope off your wall, then buy a Bible and read it. Learn for yourself the things that God said that your so-called priests don't want you to know.

[Oakland "Reb" Griner]

Re: I am Catholic.

As I mentioned before, being Roman Catholic is just an insuperable barrier to Salvation.

And even if one allowed their Catholicism to lapse, Salvation would still be problematic. The 'taint' lingers.

My best advice for any Catholic (even the Pope!) would be to do whatever it takes to get excommunicated, and please, do something drastic, to induce the Catholic hierarchy to use the Bell, Book, and Candle form of excommunication.


A caution: Do not do something that Landover Baptist would find damnable. Just the Catholics.