[A Confused Seeker]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

Wait... so can God make a rock he can't lift????

[Wide-Open]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

Wait... so can God make a rock he can't lift????

Yes, of course. But why would He?

[A Confused Seeker]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

But if God CAN make a rock he cant lift, doesnt that mean he cant lift the rock? wouldnt that make him not all-powerful?

Not meant to start a debate im just wondering these questions.

[BelieverInGod]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

But if God CAN make a rock he cant lift, doesnt that mean he cant lift the rock? wouldnt that make him not all-powerful?

Not meant to start a debate im just wondering these questions.

I don't know, have you quit screwing your dog?

From an anonymous source

Can God Make a Rock So Big He Cannot Lift It?


This is one of my favorite questions that comes up from time to time. Indeed, many atheists and skeptics have posed this question in an attempt to stump Christians and somehow disprove the omnipotence (and existence) of God. Maybe you've been there. What is so ironic about a question of this type is that rather than prove any sort of deficiency in the character or nature of God, this question actually shows a lack of clear thinking and logic on the part of the skeptic! In other words, the question itself is flawed and fallacious in several ways and, unfortunately, the person raising the question has not taken the time to truly think this problem through.

Problem #1: this question commits the fallacy known as a loaded question. Imagine if I were to ask you, "Have you stopped beating your spouse yet?" If you answer yes, that means you were beating your spouse but you have since stopped. And if you answer no, that means you're still beating them! Either way you answer the question, you automatically concede that you beat your spouse! This is a no win situation because the question itself starts with a false assumption and is therefore a "loaded" question. Likewise, the question "Can God make a rock so big He cannot life it?" also starts with a false assumption, i.e., that God is not omnipotent. If you answer "Yes" to the question, that means that God is not omnipotent since He can make the rock but isn't powerful enough to lift it. But if you answer "No," that also means that God is not omnipotent since He couldn't make a rock so big He cannot lift it! In other words, the question itself is dishonest, a pseudo-question, since it begs the question by assuming God is not omnipotent.

Problem #2: this question commits a categorical fallacy. The question itself is incoherent and meaningless. Suppose I were to ask you, "What does the color blue smell like?" or "How much does the number seven weigh?" These are category mistakes because colors don't smell and numbers don't weigh anything. They are logical impossibilities. In the same manner, asking the question "Can God make a rock so big He cannot lift it?" is essentially to ask "Can God's power defeat His own power?" This is nonsensical and a category error since the question is being incorrectly applied. Greg Koukl has stated, "The question is nonsense because it treats God as if He were two instead of one. The phrase 'stronger than' can only be used when two subjects are in view...Since God is only one...it makes no sense to ask if He is stronger than Himself."

Problem #3: this question commits a straw man fallacy. The goal of the skeptic who asks this question is to somehow undermine the Christian concept of an omnipotent God. It is thought that if it can be shown there are some things God cannot do, this would prove that God could not be omnipotent and thus could not exist as Christians have traditionally portrayed Him. However, this line of reasoning is attacking a distorted concept of Biblical omnipotence and is therefore guilty of the straw man fallacy.

So what does it mean then that God is omnipotent? Omnipotence doesn't mean that God can do anything. There are actually quite a few things that God cannot do. He cannot make squared circles. He cannot make a one-ended stick. He cannot sin. He cannot improve His morality. So God is limited in a sense. But not one of these "limitations" has to do with power, rather, they are logical contradictions. Also, notice that His "limitations" are not due to any defects in His character or power but rather they are the result of His perfection and rational nature! As Norman Geisler has stated, "He is only 'limited' by His unlimited perfection." To say that God is omnipotent then is to say that God can do anything so long as it is logically possible and consistent with His nature. God's omnipotence does not mean that He can do what is impossible but only that He can do whatever is actually possible.

Conclusion: So what then is the answer? Can God make a rock so big He cannot lift it? My comments above put aside, I still like the way one particular 7-year-old responded: "I can't give you a smart answer to a dumb question."

[Brother Barnabus]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

Asking no-win questions does not make you look intelligent and they will not keep you out of the lake of fire. By the way, have you quit having sex with your little brother?

[A Confused Seeker]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

Hmm. that is a Good anwser. I will surely win the debate with my friend! thank you.

and are the Rude comments neccesary?
Matthew 7:12 "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets."

[Meek and Humble]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

Hmm. that is a Good anwser. I will surely win the debate with my friend! thank you.

and are the Rude comments neccesary?
Matthew 7:12 "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets."

If I was acting as ignorantly as you, I'd sure hope some loving Christians would point it out to me

[I hate]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

At the time of Adam & Eve there was no such thing as death making it difficult for Eve (or Adam) to understand the concept.

ROMANS 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sinne entred into the world, and death by sin: and so death passed vpon all men, for that all haue sinned.
©1611

False logic - as spoken to Eve by the serpent - would give rise to false ideas.

The Bible tells us:

PROVERBS 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right vnto a man; but the end thereof are the wayes of death.
©1611

There is a bit of a problem with your answer. There was no real proof that in the time of Adam and Eve that there were no such thing as death. If it states in Genesis or anything that goes along the time of Adam and Eve, then tell it to me. Or am I misinterpreting your post?

I'm sorry, would you mind explaining to me what that proverb mean? I am not as educated as you are and I do not understand its meaning.

[MuhammadDurka]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

You know Pastor, I often feel that we here at Landover are too compassionate and understanding. Do we bend to far in allowing the vile sinners to spew their diatribes of vomit across these Godly Pages? Do we allow our responses to be driven by these atheists and communists with their grubby grasping at straws? Do we argue too much with them over their schemes and thoughts, which are devoid of all moral guidance?

Mr Current has a lesson for us all here: The Bible says it and the Bible is the Word of God and thus God must exist. I feel we need to maintain that clear Vision of Faith and I believe the Godless Unsaved Trash could then start their march towards Salvation™! Praise!

And yet you do nothing? If god is how the radicals of this site depict him, why has he done nothing? Why has he NEVER done nothing. Why do so many of you on this site quote scripture, yet the majority of you dont agree on its meaning. The bible was written by man, the very man that lies steals rapes sloths, etc. Through free will, as god has obviously allowed if he exsists. If it werent for free will it would ne predrtermined from birth whi was to be saved and who not: thus your whining of sinners is futile. And if free wi exsist, then the writers of the books in the bible, would be able to lie, change, or add anything that they wish with no immediate retribution. And even after, the books in the bible today were organized mainly by constantine after.making christianity the official religio of rome. who knows what he changes.
The bible has a golden rule, love thy neighbor. Yet you all spew bigotry and Hate. Instead of trying to spread the word of god, you persicute others. You find scripture to fit anything that you want it to. You are ignorant in the fact that you denounce secularist scientists yet use half of their science to support your own halfwitted ideas and theories. Yrt you use such technology that you would otherwise denounce as evil. When you make a rebuttal it is out of no logic thought process. Christianity is founded on the word of god, as written by man. I would love to see how you faired in a debate with any real religious leleader, any theologist. One day, you may all wake up. so, i texted this after playing angry birds on my so called gay phone. You can preach that im going to hell, or will die because i said this oe whatever you feel is funny, but in all honesty none of your threats ever come true. I hope this site becomes a target of a large ddos attack from anon.

[MitzaLizalor]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

I don't normally buy into these Complex Question fallacies but might just add one point: the large rock idiocy is usually proposed by skeptics/rationalists of divers kinds, whose imagined universe is described by physicists, and who don't seem to understand anything about logical fallacy - thereby ceasing to be "rational" and POOF! they don't exist so why bother?

_______________________

There is the LOCAL universe. Location is defined as co-ordinates in 4 dimensions - for the purposes of relocating rocks, anyway - left/right, fore/aft, up/down + time

EXAMPLE: please meet me
at the intersection of Fifth Avenue and West 34th Street
on the 102nd floor
at 4 o'clock

But from the perspective of the relativistic universe (in physics) - where space and/or time have no meaning - or from the perspective of God (in reality) who is omnipresent, the distinction between one location and another doesn't exist.

This is the NON-LOCAL UNIVERSE where moving objects between locations is nonsensical.

FROM THEIR OWN (supposed) POINT OF VIEW (which they don't seem to understand) the skeptic/rationalist's argument is gibberish.

Why waste time on such prating blatherskites?

(but it is helpful to appreciate the nature of their foolishness, and information posted to that end is beneficial lest we be persuaded by the leaven of false doctrine and turned aside from The Truth)

Galatians 5:9

[The unHoly one]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

GOD IS NOT REAL! GROW UP AND WALK OUTSIDE! YOU PATHETIC PEOPLE!

[MitzaLizalor]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

GOD IS NOT REAL! GROW UP AND WALK OUTSIDE! YOU PATHETIC PEOPLE!

and straight away we have an example of someone locked into the limitations - very limitations - of The Local Universe sic. reading a thread he cannot possibly understand..

We reject the false claims of science, but do understand that God is limitless - even as He is co-extensive the universe He has created! We can't enclose that Creation within our understanding (whatever definitions one uses) because we are just a small part of it, but God sends His light of understanding into the darkness of "pure reason" even so.

John 1:5 And the light shineth in darknesse, and the darknesse comprehended it not.
©1611

HALLELUJAH !

[MitzaLizalor]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

There is a bit of a problem with your answer. There was no real proof that in the time of Adam and Eve that there were no such thing as death. If it states in Genesis or anything that goes along the time of Adam and Eve, then tell it to me. Or am I misinterpreting your post?

I'm sorry, would you mind explaining to me what that proverb mean? I am not as educated as you are and I do not understand its meaning.

..just read Romans 5, then.

[WhySoSerious]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

@I Hate:
If I recall correctly, Satan aka the serpent, hated God for banishing him to Hell (after the Heaven war). So he wanted revenge on God and all that he created. Humans at the time were... naive, and were an easy target for Satan's lies.
That's why the serpent tricked Eve.

[Bible Student]

Re: PROOF God is REAL!

@I Hate:
If I recall correctly,

You don't. Besides you have to learn stuff first in order to recall it.

Satan aka the serpent,

Can you find Satan mentioned anywhere in the book of Genesis? He isn't there. There is no correlation in Genesis between Satan and the Serpent.

hated God for banishing him to Hell (after the Heaven war). So he wanted revenge on God and all that he created.

Nothing about that in Genesis either.
Humans at the time were... naive, and were an easy target for Satan's lies.

There were no humans at the time of your so-called Heaven war. So they could not be any kind of target for Satan, easy nor hard.

That's why the serpent tricked Eve.

Could you explain what that trick was? Did you notice that God said the Serpent would have seed, aka children? Isn't Satan a spirit or "Heaven war veteran"? How could he have children?

Satan is no where mentioned in Genesis.