[Rev. Dr. Davidson]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

No one knows about the Golden Rule or the Ten Commandments?

Does "love thy neighbour" mean anything?

Nowhere in the ten commangdments does it say, "Love thy neighbor." And just what is this golden rule? Are you here trying to get people to worship the golden calf? I thought the "golden rule" was a phrase coined by LIE-berals. PErhaps it's time to pick up a book and read it? I suggest starting with the KJV1611 bible.

[maverickxeo]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

No one knows about the Golden Rule or the Ten Commandments?

Does "love thy neighbour" mean anything?

[OnYourKnees]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

My apologies, I was looking at 1 Thessalonians!!

But, I still have a responce for it. Once again, this is a context issue. John is talking about the antiChrist here and the end times. The antichrist will spread so many lies that appear good, that the people will put their faith in the antichrist and forsake God. When this happens, God will then allow them to succumb to their delussions. God is not lieing to anyone here. John is just saying that he will allow these sinful people to believe the lies of the anti Christ.

No, that's not what it says. It says God will send them strong delusion. This is an active role, not passive.

It does not say, "God will allow them to create their own strong delusion", nor does it say, "Antichrist will spread strong delusion," but "God will send". And not just a mild delusion for the particularly stupid people, but "strong delusion, that they should believe a lie." That means that God will intentionally mislead people with a "strong delusion", such that most, if not all, people cannot resist.

Sorry, you can't change interpret the Bible to support your beliefs. You must take it as it's given.

[The Revelator]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

I cant help but feel some of these questions are traps....but I'll do my best to answer them.

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The evil spirit actually came to God and asked God if he could lie to them. Once again, God was using it as a form of punishment. God did not lie to anyone. Its not like someone asked God if he sent the spirit down and God said no. God was using the spirit as punishment, and no one but the spirit lied.

----
God made the covenant with Israel, giving them THE CHOICE to either keep it or break it. If they would have kept God's command sin their heart, Israel would've still been around. So yes, God knew.

---
Just because God knows whats going to happen doesnt mean he should tamper with free will and stop people from making their choices.

Let me use an example of my own.

Lets say time travel became possible and police could go to the future and see who murdered someone so they could arrest that person in the present b4 they committed the crime. Now how would you feel if you were arrested for the murder of someone you have not murdered yet. Obviously you know you would have done it, but you never even did anything yet...

It's like the same thing with God, he knows what we will do, but no matter how stupid it is, our free will allows us to make the choice on our own.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

God was doing it as punishment to the people. He allowed the lieing spirit to lie to them, because Ahab was tired of hearing negative things about him. God did not lie.

So you're saying that if you allow someone else to lie, you yourself bear no responsibility? If, for instance, a friend had promised to fix someone else's computer, and then went to band practise instead, but then lied and said they'd been called into work, and you knew they were lying but just let it happen instead of actually doing anything about it, would you share any responsibility for that lie?

On the contrary, it was the Israelites that didn't live up to their side of the deal. This goes back to the whole concept of free will. The Israelites made a covenant with God, they broke it, and god is punishing them for it. Jeremiah calls it deceit when it really isnt.

But you agree that God made the covenant with the Israelites knowing they'd break it, yes?

It's another free will thing. We both have different interpretations of what it's saying.

My apologies, I was looking at 1 Thessalonians!!

But, I still have a responce for it. Once again, this is a context issue. John is talking about the antiChrist here and the end times. The antichrist will spread so many lies that appear good, that the people will put their faith in the antichrist and forsake God. When this happens, God will then allow them to succumb to their delussions. God is not lieing to anyone here. John is just saying that he will allow these sinful people to believe the lies of the anti Christ.

Again, do you agree that, if you have the power to stop something, and yet you choose not to, you bear no responsibility for it whatsoever? Think carefully here.

[The Revelator]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

So, if you know someone is going to commit deceit, and you're in a position to stop them, but you allow them to carry on, do you bear any moral responsibility for their deceit or don't you?

God was doing it as punishment to the people. He allowed the lieing spirit to lie to them, because Ahab was tired of hearing negative things about him. God did not lie.

So you're saying that God isn't actually lying, He just makes a bargain knowing that, because He created the Israelites to be weak and sinful, He won't have to live up to His side of the deal?

On the contrary, it was the Israelites that didn't live up to their side of the deal. This goes back to the whole concept of free will. The Israelites made a covenant with God, they broke it, and god is punishing them for it. Jeremiah calls it deceit when it really isnt.

Hmm... this verse still seems to be suggesting that if a false prophet has mistaken ideas, then God will indeed destroy Him, but He will also have given him those ideas in the first place. This makes sense - after all, God is the master of the universe, so if He didn't want to destroy people for believing mistaken things, He could stop them believing them easily enough. However, as He says here, He chooses to deceive them instead.

It's another free will thing. We both have different interpretations of what it's saying.

Are you looking at the same 2 Thessalonians 2:11 that I am?
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie

My apologies, I was looking at 1 Thessalonians!!

But, I still have a responce for it. Once again, this is a context issue. John is talking about the antiChrist here and the end times. The antichrist will spread so many lies that appear good, that the people will put their faith in the antichrist and forsake God. When this happens, God will then allow them to succumb to their delussions. God is not lieing to anyone here. John is just saying that he will allow these sinful people to believe the lies of the anti Christ.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

Wow, I thought I heard it all. Of course you must have some proof to back this up.

Now Brother Temperance, let me go through each verse with you...

1. 1 kings 22:23. This verse is taken out of context, if you read the surrounding verses, you will find out it is an evil spirit which is asking God if he can deceive the people, God granted him permission, and the lying spirit went out and filled the prophets. God allowed the evil spirit to do so because of Ahabs hardened heart.

2. 2 Choronicles 18:22.This is the same exact passage as 1 Kings 22:23....

So, if you know someone is going to commit deceit, and you're in a position to stop them, but you allow them to carry on, do you bear any moral responsibility for their deceit or don't you?

3. Jeremiah 4:10. Jeremiah is saying this to the Lord. He is asking why is Israel going to be destroyed since God has promised them peace LONG AGO. If you start at chapter 4, you will hear that the people have turned their backs on God, he called for them to repent, but they did not, so now he is punishing them for what they've done. God never lied to the Israelites. As long as they served God, they would live in peace. But when they started to sin, God had to punish them. There was no lie here.

4. Jeremiah 20:7. this is Jeremiah complaining to God. The land is about to be taken over because of their sin and Jeremiah is basically saying "It's not fair!" In no way has God truly deceived him here.

So you're saying that God isn't actually lying, He just makes a bargain knowing that, because He created the Israelites to be weak and sinful, He won't have to live up to His side of the deal?

5. Ezekiel 14:9. This, once again, needs to be viewed in context. It is saying. If a man worships idols or has sin in the camp, God will not reveal to him the truth. God will put up a barrier and any prophet that speaks falsly God will destroy. If you read through this carefully, you will find that God does not od any lieing here.

Hmm... this verse still seems to be suggesting that if a false prophet has mistaken ideas, then God will indeed destroy Him, but He will also have given him those ideas in the first place. This makes sense - after all, God is the master of the universe, so if He didn't want to destroy people for believing mistaken things, He could stop them believing them easily enough. However, as He says here, He chooses to deceive them instead.

6. 2 Thessalonians 2:11. Umm...did you do a typo here? There is no reference at all to lieing in this verse, I dont know where you got that info from, but you might want to recheck it because this verse doesnt say anything about lieing.

Are you looking at the same 2 Thessalonians 2:11 that I am?
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

God will delude people and make them believe a lie. If that isn't relevant to a discussion of lying, I don't know what is.

You see....God doesnt lie! you know why. Because God can't sin! It is not in his character, he is free of inuquities.

Of course God can't sin and He is free of iniquities. However, this doesn't change the fact that He seems to deceive people quite a bit. I imagine that, being God, He can probably lie to people without committing a sin, the same way He can kill millions of people without sinning.

[The Revelator]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

and the TRUE version of the Bible was dictated by God in 1611, IN ENGLISH.

Wow, I thought I heard it all. Of course you must have some proof to back this up.

Now Brother Temperance, let me go through each verse with you...

1. 1 kings 22:23. This verse is taken out of context, if you read the surrounding verses, you will find out it is an evil spirit which is asking God if he can deceive the people, God granted him permission, and the lying spirit went out and filled the prophets. God allowed the evil spirit to do so because of Ahabs hardened heart.

2. 2 Choronicles 18:22.This is the same exact passage as 1 Kings 22:23....

3. Jeremiah 4:10. Jeremiah is saying this to the Lord. He is asking why is Israel going to be destroyed since God has promised them peace LONG AGO. If you start at chapter 4, you will hear that the people have turned their backs on God, he called for them to repent, but they did not, so now he is punishing them for what they've done. God never lied to the Israelites. As long as they served God, they would live in peace. But when they started to sin, God had to punish them. There was no lie here.

4. Jeremiah 20:7. this is Jeremiah complaining to God. The land is about to be taken over because of their sin and Jeremiah is basically saying "It's not fair!" In no way has God truly deceived him here.

5. Ezekiel 14:9. This, once again, needs to be viewed in context. It is saying. If a man worships idols or has sin in the camp, God will not reveal to him the truth. God will put up a barrier and any prophet that speaks falsly God will destroy. If you read through this carefully, you will find that God does not od any lieing here.

6. 2 Thessalonians 2:11. Umm...did you do a typo here? There is no reference at all to lieing in this verse, I dont know where you got that info from, but you might want to recheck it because this verse doesnt say anything about lieing.



You see....God doesnt lie! you know why. Because God can't sin! It is not in his character, he is free of inuquities.

[SalvationSeeker]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

the Bible was written in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic.

You read this on some website didn't you?
Because it is obvious that you don't really know what you're talking about.
Hebrew is simply an Aramaic dialect, and the TRUE version of the Bible was dictated by God in 1611, IN ENGLISH.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

Oh yeah, of course God does not lie. He is without sin.

Perhaps you'd care to explain your "interpretation" of these verses, in that case?
1 Kings 22:23 Now, therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee.
2 Chronicles 18:22 Now therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets.
Jeremiah 4:10 Ah, Lord GOD! surely thou hast greatly deceived this people.
Jeremiah 20:7 O Lord, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived.
Ezekiel 14:9 And if a prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the Lord have deceived that prophet.
2 Thessalonians 2:11 For this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie.

So, how exactly does God deceive all these people without lying to them?

[Mrs. Mary Whitford]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

the Bible was written in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic.

Every other language comes from translations. The KJV version is just another translation of the Bible. With that being said, people can still misinterpret scripture. We can look at the same verse, written the same way, and still get different meanings out of it.

Then people should be praying harder to understand more easily what is so clearly written.

[The Revelator]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

the Bible was written in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic.

Every other language comes from translations. The KJV version is just another translation of the Bible. With that being said, people can still misinterpret scripture. We can look at the same verse, written the same way, and still get different meanings out of it.

[Mrs. Mary Whitford]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

There is nothing to interpret. God had it written in plain old English so that we could all read His plain-spoken Word.

[The Revelator]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

If that was true, you'd have no arguments with our pastors.

Yeah, but the only problem is interpretation. You see people look at Scripture and interpret it different ways. Thats why we have so many different denominations under the umbrella of Christianity. I agree with your pastors on some things, other things I disagree with. But I know that we both believe the Bible is 100% accurate. It is simply a matter of interpretation.

[Mrs. Mary Whitford]

Re: Racism is a sin, amirite?

I believe the bible is true 100% of the time, not just when I see fit.

If that was true, you'd have no arguments with our pastors.