[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

No one but God has that call and no one, not even you, can say otherwise.

I agree with this.

God gave us His Word. In His Word, He tells us how to be Saved. There is only One Way to be Saved.

When we use our God given knowledge to let someone know that they are going to Hell if they don't get Saved, it is not a judgment. We are not the ones sending them to Hell. They are sending themselves to Hell. We are trying to warn them.

If a blind and deaf man was walking down the railroad tracks, and a train was bearing down on him, what would you do? Would you be "tolerant" of his choice to walk down the railroad tracks, or would you make a judgment that the man should not be on the railroad tracks, and try to get him off of the track? What would Jesus do?

Pastor Billy-Reuben.

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

I agree with this.

God gave us His Word. In His Word, He tells us how to be Saved. There is only One Way to be Saved.

When we use our God given knowledge to let someone know that they are going to Hell if they don't get Saved, it is not a judgment. We are not the ones sending them to Hell. They are sending themselves to Hell. We are trying to warn them.

If a blind and deaf man was walking down the railroad tracks, and a train was bearing down on him, what would you do? Would you be "tolerant" of his choice to walk down the railroad tracks, or would you make a judgment that the man should not be on the railroad tracks, and try to get him off of the track? What would Jesus do?

Pastor Billy-Reuben.

Ok, I can understand that. My only problem with that is that if you want them to be saved, I don't think that telling them that they're going to Hell is the way to go about it. I understand that you want them to be saved rather badly, cause who really wants someone to burn in Hell, but there has to be a better way of telling them. My grandparents tried to have me "saved" when I was a kid by scaring me with eternal damnation. I don't think that anyone should be brought to God using scare tactics. I think it should be a good relationship where you know God loves you and wants you to be up there in Heaven with him when you die.

[Marshall]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Being honest and letting them know how much they are disappointing Jesus isn't the wrong course of action. We MUST let these cretins know how bad they are.
Stay the course isn't just the way to win a war, it's the way to keep souls out of Hell as well.

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Being honest and letting them know how much they are disappointing Jesus isn't the wrong course of action. We MUST let these cretins know how bad they are.
Stay the course isn't just the way to win a war, it's the way to keep souls out of Hell as well.

But NO ONE is going to listen to you if you attack them. And the ones that do seem to go along with you aren't doing it because they truly believe. They're doing it out of fear of a possible Hell. And if that's the reason they're doing it, they're gonna end up in Hell. Cause that isn't true faith. That's watching your own ass.

[SalvationSeeker]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

But NO ONE is going to listen to you if you attack them. And the ones that do seem to go along with you aren't doing it because they truly believe. They're doing it out of fear of a possible Hell. And if that's the reason they're doing it, they're gonna end up in Hell. Cause that isn't true faith. That's watching your own ass.

You can keep on whining and yapping all you want..

But at the end of the day:
CONFORMING isn't an act of faith, it's an act of ungodly cowardice.
We will never sway from the will of God as found in His Holy Word, no matter what you say.
That's faith.

Being a reformist scared of the public opinion or lying to spare the feelings of others, like you want us to be.
That's being a damned coward, and one who damns others in turn.

GOD DOES NOT COMPENSATE! HE DEMANDS!
AND YOU HAVE BUT TWO CHOICES - EITHER ACCEPT OR REJECT!
So obviously, if we do and teach differently, we are but lying sinners.. And we would damn others with our lies.
Not happening!

Get thee behind me SATAN!

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Ok, I can understand that. My only problem with that is that if you want them to be saved, I don't think that telling them that they're going to Hell is the way to go about it.

Friend, have you read any of Jesus's sermons? Do you think you know better than Him how to go about getting folks saved?

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

That's Jesus talking there, friend.

But NO ONE is going to listen to you if you
attack them.

Again, Jesus would disagree with you. Please read Matthew 23, to see how Jesus went about winning souls.

1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
9A nd call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?
18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.
19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?
20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.
21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.
22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

PRAISE the sweet name of Jesus!

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

You can keep on whining and yapping all you want..

But at the end of the day:
CONFORMING isn't an act of faith, it's an act of ungodly cowardice.
We will never sway from the will of God as found in His Holy Word, no matter what you say.
That's faith.

Being a reformist scared of the public opinion or lying to spare the feelings of others, like you want us to be.
That's being a damned coward, and one who damns others in turn.

GOD DOES NOT COMPENSATE! HE DEMANDS!
AND YOU HAVE BUT TWO CHOICES - EITHER ACCEPT OR REJECT!
So obviously, if we do and teach differently, we are but lying sinners.. And we would damn others with our lies.
Not happening!

Get thee behind me SATAN!

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

[SalvationSeeker]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

That's all you have to say? A dumb cliche? Listen up!
THERE IS BUT ONE WAY WITH GOD, WE'RE NOT DISCUSSING CATS HERE!

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life:
No man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 14:6

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Matthew 7:13-14

As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:9

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Friend, have you read any of Jesus's sermons? Do you think you know better than Him how to go about getting folks saved?

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

That's Jesus talking there, friend.

No man has the power to destroy your soul. Only God can do that. I myself don't believe in Hell, but I'm assuming I'll be called a couple of names for that one. Not necessarily by you, but in general.

Again, Jesus would disagree with you. Please read Matthew 23, to see how Jesus went about winning souls.

1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
9A nd call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?
18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.
19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?
20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.
21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.
22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

PRAISE the sweet name of Jesus!

Pastor Billy-Reuben

Best I can tell, he's talking to those that lead men away from God, not all men. He's specifically picking out the men that purposefully exploit others as a means to an end.

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

No man has the power to destroy your soul. Only God can do that.

I'm glad you finally understand that.

I myself don't believe in Hell

Are you calling Jesus a liar?

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

That's all you have to say? A dumb cliche? Listen up!
THERE IS BUT ONE WAY WITH GOD, WE'RE NOT DISCUSSING CATS HERE!

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life:
No man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 14:6

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Matthew 7:13-14

As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:9

I'm giving you a "dumb cliche" because you listen about as good a brick wall. You're giving me a black and white choice between believing exactly as you do or some imagined damnation. Honestly, I'll take my chances with God, cause he's a little more understanding than your judgmental self.

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

I'm glad you finally understand that.

Thanks?

Are you calling Jesus a liar?

No, I'm calling Jesus a really smart, really cool guy. A guy that had it figured out. He had a good message. A great one. Doesn't mean I have to take everything he said at face value.

[SalvationSeeker]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

I'm giving you a "dumb cliche" because you listen about as good a brick wall.

Friend, you are the one who isn't listening here.
We're telling you how it is, straight from the Word of God and you still keep going on and on and on..
You have but your own OPINIONS, deal with it.

You're giving me a black and white choice between believing exactly as you do or some imagined damnation.

I'm telling it like it is in the Bible.
If you have a problem with that, I suggest you take it up with God.

Honestly, I'll take my chances with God, cause he's a little more understanding than your judgmental self.

What God would that be?
It sure isn't the one found in the Holy Bible.
Friend, your so-called god is but a figment of your imagination.
You have created a false god in your own image.

No, I'm calling Jesus a really smart, really cool guy. A guy that had it figured out. He had a good message. A great one. Doesn't mean I have to take everything he said at face value.

No, what you're doing here is praising YOUR message.
Not Jesus message.

Jesus message is found in the Bible, yours is only found here and in your own imaginations.

[Pastor Billy-Reuben]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Honestly, I'll take my chances with God, cause he's a little more understanding than your judgmental self.

Do you even own a Bible? Do you know what one is? Have you ever seen one? No one who has read the Bible would have made such a profoundly incorrect statement.

No, I'm calling Jesus a really smart, really cool guy. A guy that had it figured out. He had a good message. A great one. Doesn't mean I have to take everything he said at face value.

I agree with Salvation Seeker. I don't believe you have the first clue what Jesus's message is.

Pastor Billy-Reuben

[Peter Skulls]

Re: Is Your Child A Goth?

Friend, you are the one who isn't listening here.
We're telling you how it is, straight from the Word of God and you still keep going on and on and on..
You have but your own OPINIONS, deal with it.

I'm just looking for answers. You're giving me plenty.

I'm telling it like it is in the Bible.
If you have a problem with that, I suggest you take it up with God.

Well, no one can really do that till they die, so I guess I'm out of luck on that one.

What God would that be?
It sure isn't the one found in the Holy Bible.
Friend, your so-called god is but a figment of your imagination.
You have created a false god in your own image.

I don't believe it's your place to tell me what I believe in. Actually, I think that's God's place. Are you presuming that you have the faintest idea as to how God thinks? Cause I think you're full of shit if that's what you're saying.

No, what you're doing here is praising YOUR message.
Not Jesus message.

Jesus message is found in the Bible, yours is only found here and in your own imaginations.

Like I said. Not your place. Learn it.