[JennyD]

Re: Family of Dead Queer Blames School

You're right Jen, my verbatem powers of scripture are a bit weak I'm ashamed to say. I'm sure you're rather keen though.

Show me where the bible says:

-Idolators are forced to be homosexuals (from what I recall, the Tribes of Israel were delivered into slavery because of their idolotry, not into homosexuality)

Romans 1:21-27

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

- A new testament reference where Jesus Christ approves the violent slaying of anyone for any offense (If there was one thing Jesus Christ was fond of doing, it was flying in the face of the old testament jewish law, working miracles on Sunday's, stoning adulterers, exct.)

Matthew 5:17-18

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Also, see the entire Book of Revelation, when Jesus returns as the destroyer of nations, and will slaughter 1/3 of all humans in most gruesome manners BEFORE the Day of Judgment.

God is Jesus, and Jesus is God. It's His Law. It doesn't change. Jesus just provided the final sacrifice, ending those messy animal sacrifices at the Temple.

-Where homosexuality is a choice. I've heard that old yarn from many a liberal. I didn't believe it then, and I won't believe it now.

Humans have free will. We decide which actions we are to take. Nobody forces you to stick your tallywhacker inside another man; that's your choice.

Sodomy is an abomination before God. It is your choice to take part or not. I don't need to prove that with Scripture, son.

I am glad, however, that we agree there is a place for compassion for the sinful. Poor bastards need all the help they can get if they are ever to find the path of righeousness.

Indeed you do. However, those who refuse to repent are not forgiven, and we are directed to shun them.

2 John 1:9-11

9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

You really SHOULD try READING the Bible, instead of making up nonsense you WISH it said and pretending it's actually in there.

[Pinecone]

Re: Family of Dead Queer Blames School

Your scripture is good insofar as to identify that these particular idolators did transition rather nastily into homosexuality. Consider though, the events surrounding the tribe of Israel while on it's way to the promised land. Several times did the tribe dissobey the commandments of God, including idolotry. They were not turned into homosexuals, rather they were punished with plagues, death, defeat, and slavery. Check Exodus Chapter 32 for a prime example. Plenty of idolotry, no homosexuality mentioned.

I have to say bravo on the Relevations account of Jesus. You are 100% on with that and I feel the fool for not have thinking of it myself. Though as far as the invalidation of old testement law is concerned, Leviticus deatails alot of eating commandements which are no longer adhered to (nothing from pigs, any seafood without scales or fins, exct.) and restrictions for menstrating women.

These could be viewed more specifically as instructions to the tribe at the time, but the fact it's spelled out in black and white in the Bible makes it an issue. Often when sparring with athiests or the like this argument comes up and I feel innadequate in my defense against it. I generally don't try to defend an infallible literalist interpretation of the Bible, but you never know when that might come in handy.

I concur that there is an element of choice involved with homosexuality, just as there is an element of choice in any addicition. The origional point was this sort of disease cannot be cured by a physical beating. If that were the case, there would be far fewer homosexuals plaguing the world today.

Shunning sounds like an Amish idea. If a sinner is unrepentant, it is not a license for a Christian to give up and accept failure in the face of their responsability to usher souls to the path of righteousness. unless of course it is and i am missing the relevent scripture here.

As far as wishing for things to be in the Bible that aren't, you're probably right, but that's why I'm here, to learn.