[BadAssButterfly]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

And here is the the ABSOLUTE, non-subjective truth:
Your mother is wrong, drinking moderately is not a sin. Drinking too much is.. Jesus and His apostles drank wine!
Is she so stupid that she doesn't see the contradiction between what she says and what Jesus did?
Oh well, the apple doesn't fall from the tree now does it, so that would make sense..

Her church bases their idea that alcohol is a sin on the miracle at the wedding in Cana - when Jesus turned water into wine. One of the guests compliments the host on bringing out the "good wine" - her church interprets "good" as "unfermented."

I figure that if she feels that her god doesn't want her to drink, then she shouldn't drink. That's between her and her god. And I won't drink at her house in honor of her wishes. I keep Guinness and wine in my fridge, and she knows better than to tell me not to drink when she's in my house.

And I actually don't have a problem with people drinking to the point of intoxication, as long as they don't get behind the wheel or otherwise endanger other people with their inebriation. I drink moderately simply because I don't like hangovers.

[SalvationSeeker]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

Not necessarily. My mother is Baptist. For her, drinking alcohol and dancing are both sinful. So she doesnt drink and doesn't dance. I believe there is nothing wrong with consumption of alcohol in moderation, and I love to dance. For me, these things are not sinful. There is objective truth - truth that is true for all, such a 2 + 2 = 4. And there is subjective truth, such as the sinfulness or lack thereof of drinking alcohol and jitter-bugging the night away. That depends on the individual.

And here is the the ABSOLUTE, non-subjective truth:
Your mother is wrong, drinking moderately is not a sin. Drinking too much is.. Jesus and His apostles drank wine!
Is she so stupid that she doesn't see the contradiction between what she says and what Jesus did?
Oh well, the apple doesn't fall from the tree now does it, so that would make sense..

[BadAssButterfly]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

[quote=OnYourKnees;55579]The only "social inequality" which Christianity "justifies" is the fact that God shows His favor to those who are faithful to Him.

I was referring to it having been used to justify such heinous practices as slavery, racial segregation of schools and public transportation, and anti-miscegenationlaws forbidding inter-racial marriages.

[BadAssButterfly]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

What dreck in the Holy Bible? Where? Friend, holy books aren't like some catalogue, where you can order the bits you find appealing and throw the rest in the bin, they are claims to Supreme, Ultimate Truth. As soon as you throw part of the Bible out for being insane and implausible, you might as well just get rid of the whole thing.

If the Nicean Council could decide which writings would be included in the anthology that would become known as the Holy Bible, then I can decide which parts of it hold meaning for me and which don't.
I find the parts that talk about things like loving your neighbor as yourself and helping those less fortunate than yourself meaningful. I find the parts that talk about things like eternal damnation by a loving God to be a contradiction in terms, and therefore, dreck.

And that's where you and sane people differ: reasonable people realise that if the truth is true for one person, it's true for everyone. If, as you believe, reincarnation happens, then everyone who doesn't believe in reincarnation is wrong. And so and and so forth with the various lunatic features that makes your "path" unique and solitary, till everyone who ever lived is wrong, save you. And you'd better hope that Jesus does just that.

Not necessarily. My mother is Baptist. For her, drinking alcohol and dancing are both sinful. So she doesnt drink and doesn't dance. I believe there is nothing wrong with consumption of alcohol in moderation, and I love to dance. For me, these things are not sinful. There is objective truth - truth that is true for all, such a 2 + 2 = 4. And there is subjective truth, such as the sinfulness or lack thereof of drinking alcohol and jitter-bugging the night away. That depends on the individual.


Yes, but (ignoring all the obvious jokes about whether Hebrew lawyer types can be considered human) lawyers and juries are the same species. They're essentially equal - that's why the lawyer gets to decide whether the juror's capable of delivering an impartial verdict, and the jury get to decide whether they believe the lawyer or not. Neither created the other, and neither gets to condemn the other to eternal hellfire. So your analogy is flawed.

Only if the defendant's parents or progeny were potential jurors could we say that one created the other. But in that case, they would automatically be eliminated from the pool anyway, so your "neither created the other " argument is moot. And you might as well threaten me with being eaten by the monster under the bed as with eternal hellfire - I disbelieve equally in both.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

You have a book that you believe to be divinely inspired. So do lots of other religions. They believe their book, you believe yours. There is lots of wisdom in your book - and lots of dreck. The same can be said of any other religious text.

What dreck in the Holy Bible? Where? Friend, holy books aren't like some catalogue, where you can order the bits you find appealing and throw the rest in the bin, they are claims to Supreme, Ultimate Truth. As soon as you throw part of the Bible out for being insane and implausible, you might as well just get rid of the whole thing.

I never said that I have dsiscovered the one and only right path. I have found the path that is right for me. I don't think that there is a one-size-fits-all path that works for everyone. And my path is far from lonely. Because I do not limit myself to wisdom and guidance form one souce, I find that there are many people whose paths parallel, overlap, and intersect with mine.

And that's where you and sane people differ: reasonable people realise that if the truth is true for one person, it's true for everyone. If, as you believe, reincarnation happens, then everyone who doesn't believe in reincarnation is wrong. And so and and so forth with the various lunatic features that makes your "path" unique and solitary, till everyone who ever lived is wrong, save you. And you'd better hope that Jesus does just that.

Since I have never been dragged into court on any sort of charges, I have no personal history with juries. However, isn't judging the jury basically what lawyers do when they accept or reject potential jurors during the jury selection process? I do the same thing with deities.

Yes, but (ignoring all the obvious jokes about whether Hebrew lawyer types can be considered human) lawyers and juries are the same species. They're essentially equal - that's why the lawyer gets to decide whether the juror's capable of delivering an impartial verdict, and the jury get to decide whether they believe the lawyer or not. Neither created the other, and neither gets to condemn the other to eternal hellfire. So your analogy is flawed.

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

Since I have never been dragged into court on any sort of charges, I have no personal history with juries. However, isn't judging the jury basically what lawyers do when they accept or reject potential jurors during the jury selection process? I do the same thing with deities.

God is the judge not the jury sinner.

[BadAssButterfly]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

We have a book which is written by God Almighty. Proof doesn't come much more objective than that. Our faith really just comes down to believing in what is true; yours comes down to beliving in what you'd like to be true.

You have a book that you believe to be divinely inspired. So do lots of other religions. They believe their book, you believe yours. There is lots of wisdom in your book - and lots of dreck. The same can be said of any other religious text.

So, another arrogant megalomaniac who thinks they're the only person in the entire history of humanity to have discovered the right path and that everyone else who has ever lived is wrong? Your solitary path sounds mighty lonely to me.

I never said that I have dsiscovered the one and only right path. I have found the path that is right for me. I don't think that there is a one-size-fits-all path that works for everyone. And my path is far from lonely. Because I do not limit myself to wisdom and guidance form one souce, I find that there are many people whose paths parallel, overlap, and intersect with mine.

Friend, you've got it the wrong way round. God judges you; you do not judge Him. Or when you're dragged into court on dope charges, do you consider the evidence before pronouncing the jury guilty or innocent?

Since I have never been dragged into court on any sort of charges, I have no personal history with juries. However, isn't judging the jury basically what lawyers do when they accept or reject potential jurors during the jury selection process? I do the same thing with deities.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

It makes as much sense as what you believe about the afterlife. And it has just as much objective proof as your concepts of heaven and hell - zero. Faith really just comes down to a matter of what makes sense to you.

We have a book which is written by God Almighty. Proof doesn't come much more objective than that. Our faith really just comes down to believing in what is true; yours comes down to beliving in what you'd like to be true.

No, I'm not Hindu - I'm pagan, and I follow a solitary eclectic path.

So, another arrogant megalomaniac who thinks they're the only person in the entire history of humanity to have discovered the right path and that everyone else who has ever lived is wrong? Your solitary path sounds mighty lonely to me.

I don't consider wicca a sin.
Your god may consider me guilty of sins I haven't committed, but since your god is not my god, it really doesn't matter what he/she/it thinks. Any god that would condemn a person for sins they never committed is a sadistic S.O.B. not worthy of my worship.

Friend, you've got it the wrong way round. God judges you; you do not judge Him. Or when you're dragged into court on dope charges, do you consider the evidence before pronouncing the jury guilty or innocent?

[OnYourKnees]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

No, I'm not Hindu - I'm pagan, and I follow a solitary eclectic path. And Hinduism isn't the only religion that believes in reincarnation. And Christianity has also been guilty of using its scriptures to justify social inequality, so you might want to climb down off your high horse before you get a nose bleed from the thin air.

The only "social inequality" which Christianity "justifies" is the fact that God shows His favor to those who are faithful to Him.

That's the foundation of Joel Osteen's "prosperity gospel". Just Google "prosperity gospel scripture" to read all about it. Here are a couple of verses just to get you on the right road:

John 3:2

Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.


Proverbs 13:22

A good man leaves an inheritance for his children's children, but a sinner's wealth is stored up for the righteous.


2 Corinthians 9:8-11:

And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:

(As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.


Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness; )

Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.


Clearly, wealth (common among LBC members . . . coincidence?) is often an indication of God's grace.

Of course, we do have some concerns about Joel Osteen ourselves. He is not a member of Landover Baptist Church, and has been quoted as saying he "doesn't know" whether atheists go to Heaven . . . the Department of Faith is investigating.

lol, love it, especially the wicker part I don't believe in Satan either. I believe in both reincarnation and some sort of heaven/afterlife place though.

Where did you learn of these things? What's the foundation of that belief? Your own imaginings?

[SinisterPizza]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

You're not getting off to a good start by not praising Jesus.

Well, praise Jesus too

[Enobarbus]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

hey, I shower! I think I'm fairly hippieness too..I'm...a clean hippie But I like peace, love, nature, hippie styles, groovy flowers, rock/indie rock music, ect.

There is no such thing as a clean hippy. That is an obvious contradiction in terms. Everyone knows that hippies never wash and thrive on filthiness -- their clothes are never laundered or changed, they have lice in their hair, and pong. Their only interest in flowers is finding opium poppies but they are so doped on other narcotics and marijuana that they can't tell one flower from another and collect them all. They are into drugs, sex, and living off welfare. They listen to unAmerican folk songs embrace anti-American and anti-military nonsense. They tend to be atheists or pagans or follow some other such heretical nonsense. There is nothing good that can be said about them. They have obviously turned their backs on Jesus (and all that is decent in human society) and are doomed to spend eternity in the fiery pits of hell.

[Enobarbus]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

I don't consider wicca a sin.
Your god may consider me guilty of sins I haven't committed, but since your god is not my god, it really doesn't matter what he/she/it thinks. Any god that would condemn a person for sins they never committed is a sadistic S.O.B. not worthy of my worship.

BadAss, there is but one God, and he is a jealous God who will not tolerate the worship of false Gods. If you consider the God of the Bible -- the one and only true God -- sadistic, that is all the more reason, surely, to do as he wishes. Ignore him, reject him, and you will spend eternity in torment. There is no doubt about this: it is made quite plain in his Word -- the KJV1611.

[BadAssButterfly]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

Mine is the only true one. Your religion is false.

Most religions say the same thing - each believes that it is the one true faith and that all others are false. That's the nature of religion. Christianity is no different.

Jesus is the only way to Heaven. (John 14:6)

"The Star-bellied Sneetches had bellies with stars; the Plain-ellied Sneetches hd no stars on thars." (Dr Suess)
Just because it's written in a book doesn't make it fact.



And how do you know they do not lie to you?

It would serve no purpose for them to lie to me.



It doesn't matter what you believe..
Satan believes in you, and he is most surely looking forward to seeing you in hell.

S'ok - I have sunscreen.



You are as much a wicker as a wicker, and as much a homosexual as a homosexual..

I don't consider it a sin to make furniture out of reeds or to be attrcted to the same sex.

The Holy Bible says:

For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
James 2:10

To God, you are guilty of all the sins, even the ones you haven't actually commited. That includes wicca.

I don't consider wicca a sin.
Your god may consider me guilty of sins I haven't committed, but since your god is not my god, it really doesn't matter what he/she/it thinks. Any god that would condemn a person for sins they never committed is a sadistic S.O.B. not worthy of my worship.

[Mrs. Mary Whitford]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

yay Praise Pastor Zeke, I'm off moderation. Thank you very much

You're not getting off to a good start by not praising Jesus.

[SinisterPizza]

Re: Rescued from Wicca

yay Praise Pastor Zeke, I'm off moderation. Thank you very much