[James Peter]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

Don't worry about these Protestants, they are more concerned about reading the Bible then important things like whether you should let the communion host dissolve on your tongue or chew it.

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

This, when NOT taken out of context, simply forbids the WORSHIP of any graven images. Should I pick out the one verse simly forbiding graven images, then you would be correct. However, because I read the entire passage, I know the true intent. To serve no other Gods, for our God is a jealous God. I do not worship saints. I do not worhship Mary.

The word worship is not in that passage. It says do not bow down to any graven image.

It is implied many times. Would you deny the Trinity? Even though it is not stated in scripture?

Here:

Matthew 1:23 - Look! the virgin is with child and will give birth to a son whom they will call Immanuel, "a name which means ‘God is with us’"

Virgin... will give birth to a son. She is His mother.

Galatians 4:4-5 - but when the completion of the time came, God sent his Son, born of a woman...

Born of a woman.... She is His mother.

Luke 1:43 - Elizabeth says to Mary, "Why should I be honored with a visit from the mother of my Lord?"

Luke 3:34 - and Simeon blessed them and said to Mary his mother....

The mother of my Lord... She is His mother. Explicitly stated.

I said quite clearly - when did JESUS call her "mother" ?

Does this mean that Mary was NOT blessed? Nope. It says simply that she not blessed simply for the fact that she gave birth to him alone. For example, it also says that:

"My mother and my brothers are those that hear the word of God and act on it" (Luke 8:21)

Now we have verses supporting both sides. Again, the bible cannot contradict itself. Allow me to teach you.

The beatitude in Luke 11:28 should not be interpreted as a rebuke of the mother of Jesus. Rather, it empahsizes that attentiveness to God's word is more important than biological relationship to Jesus.

Such as in Luke 8:21, the family of Jesus is not constituded by physical relationship with him buy by obediecnce to the word of God. In this, Luke agrees with the Marcan parallel (Mark 3 31-35). Probably he did this because Mary has ALREADY been presented in Luke 1:38 as the obedient handmaid of the lord who fulfills the requirement for belonging to the eschatological family of Jesus. She has already submitted to God's word. She is already family.

You cannot take scripture out of context. This requires deep study and guidance. Otherwise, the Bible will contradict itself. Hopefully this will help you understand.

You are the one taking the Bible out of context when you presented those verses calling Mary blessed. I agree, she was, because she did what God wanted. But the Bible then goes on to say in the verse I presented that just because she was a good woman does not mean to elevate her beyond all compare and all other human beings just because she was the womb that bore Him. Catholics teach that Mary is sinless, perfect, the greatest human being who ever lived. But there is no basis for that. Jesus says in Luke 11 that Mary is no matter than anyone else who does what God wants.

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

Oh. Well we worship how the apostles and their successors did. How can you claim to be connected to them when your roots are in John the Baptist? Which they are not I might add... Unless you can persaude me otherwise..

The apostles were originally disciples of John, so if you claim apostolic succession, you can trace it back to John. But you don't worship the way the apostles did. Let me ask you, do you think the Apostles wore funny robes as they went over a set liturgy repetitive liturgy on Sunday, telling the people when to stand up, sit down, and kneel. Were they handing out communion in little wafer form? Did they hold these meetings in a large luxurious building filled with paintings and statues? Were the priests celibate? No, Catholicism was invented centuries later as a combination of Christianity and Paganism.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Roman%20Catholicism/catholic_heresies-a_list.htm

While you're at it, read this about what a real church should look like: http://members.shaw.ca/alyzza/Phelps...nthechurch.pdf

[Vavoline Johnson]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

NOTE: THIS YOUNG MAN HAS SPENT HIS YOUTH BEING BUGGERED BY PAPIST PRIESTS. HIS MENTAL STATE IS THEREFORE QUESTIONABLE. KEEP THIS IN MIND AS YOU READ HIS DISTURBING POSTS.



I was happy. I thought you were unlike your bretheren here. Forgive me for the mistake.



Jesus loved Mary. Why don't you?

Sorry dis a bit late. We got our-selbs computer problems here at da Johnson house. Damn you Satan!
Anyways, who be sayin we don't love Mary? Course we love dat statue by da pool. It make everyone laugh and laugh when they see it.
But worships her? We only praise and worship Jeesus Christ our Lawd and Sabiour

[Catholic - Not Christian]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

That was when she was alive. The Word clearly tells you to quit bowing and scraping to graven images of Mary, Jesus or your aints.

.... Huh? How does this pertain to Ignatious of Antioch? You said I can't quote him cuz you already know the counter arguements... So i asked what they are, in case I was worshipping wrong.

I think you just quoted the wrong post or something...

[MirthMenace]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

I don't know if there exists a "twelve-step" approach or not, but I am a recovering Catholic and have been free of the constraints of Catholicism for many years now. Catholicism ran rampant in my family throughout my formative years and, with help, I've been able to finally put it all behind me.

As you'll see in my profile, I call myself a pagan Deist. A responsible and ongoing search for truth and meaning has put me on this path. A couple of years ago, my wife and I actually joined the Unitarian Universalist Church and have quite enjoyed the free and respectful exchange of spiritual ideas. We recognize and celebrate the interconnectedness of all people and are among many other "recovering catholics" who've joined the UU Church. I'm mentioning this here because I think it might be worth considering if you're still Catholic and therefore floundering.

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

A Catholic converting to paganism? What? How could you convert into something you already were?

[MirthMenace]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

A Catholic converting to paganism? What? How could you convert into something you already were?

Oh it was an easy transition, as I'm sure you can imagine. I just gradually divested myself of my old childish beliefs in the personal and interactive nature of The Creator, came to see the silliness inherent in the notion that the statues sprinkled throughout the opulent Catholic structures were representations of entities to whom prayers could be addressed, and let observable evidence reveal that Jesus was no more -- or less -- a manifestation of "God" than you or I.

[WWJDnow]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

So what can you tell me about True Christianity? I am quite interested in different viewpoints... However, thus far this site seems almost hateful toward it opposers...

Start from the beginning, where did your religion come from? And don't say the Bible, give me the history

No problem at all. It may take a while, but let's start at the beginning:

Genesis 1

1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
9And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
10And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.
11And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
12And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
13And the evening and the morning were the third day.
14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
16And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
17And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
18And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
19And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
20And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
21And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
22And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.
23And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.
24And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
25And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
26And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
29And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
30And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.
31And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

To be continued...

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

Oh it was an easy transition, as I'm sure you can imagine. I just gradually divested myself of my old childish beliefs in the personal and interactive nature of The Creator, came to see the silliness inherent in the notion that the statues sprinkled throughout the opulent Catholic structures were representations of entities to whom prayers could be addressed, and let observable evidence reveal that Jesus was no more -- or less -- a manifestation of "God" than you or I.

So basically, being raised Catholic drove you to Paganism? Makes sense to me

[TinyJay]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

What I do not comprehend is how the members of the RCC allow their priesthood to molest little boys and then have the Pope blame the children for their misdeeds.If someone could enlighten me I would greatly appreciate it.

[MirthMenace]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

So basically, being raised Catholic drove you to Paganism? Makes sense to me

Exactly! You and I have more common ground than you think, Heathen Basher! You're an astute processor of information and ideas!

[MirthMenace]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

What I do not comprehend is how the members of the RCC allow their priesthood to molest little boys and then have the Pope blame the children for their misdeeds.If someone could enlighten me I would greatly appreciate it.

BigJay, the Pope forgave all those little boys years ago! Get with the times, man!

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/27834

[James Peter]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

What I do not comprehend is how the members of the RCC allow their priesthood to molest little boys and then have the Pope blame the children for their misdeeds.If someone could enlighten me I would greatly appreciate it.

Whenever did the Pope blame children for misdeeds?

May I ask you something? Why do you Mormons make young girls enter into polygamous marriages with men vastly older then themselves, forced into incest, to be raped, beaten, abused, and shut off from the world on compounds? Why is that?

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Catholic. Born, raised and proud

Exactly! You and I have more common ground than you think, Heathen Basher! You're an astute processor of information and ideas!

Thank you, and I suppose we do have more common then I'd like, but I guess I'm not perfect yet. Maybe if you ever decide to become a decent human being and get saved we can be friends.