[LogicRulesLife]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Indeed, it is completely pointless to argue with somebody who took the trouble to register here but cannot take the trouble to attempt to refute any of the points raised by this thread and instead just calls us names.

Thanks for proving my point

[Aristotle]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Oh I can but there is just no point on these forums, considering Ill be told that they are lies told by Satan and or they'll throw some random biblical phrases at me, or they might call me gay. Or the crap about the universe being only 6 thousand years old and if you believe that the whole point in explaining that the stars are thousand to millions of years old and the light is now reaching us is completely pointless to argue.

Its pointless to argue because all the above is true. Just look it up in the BIBLE(KJV).

[Brother Helge]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Because non of you idiots ever attended school, instead you wasted your time reading book about magic and now you have a lower intelligence than that of the average 10 year old.

The funny thing here is that you try to insult us, but only show us your incapability to distinguish intelligence from education level.

[ReasonableChristian]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Hello all,

I can see where your criticism comes from, but I would still like to clear up some misconceptions.

Light is very much well accepted to be composed of massless particles called photons, which work very much like "messengers" for electromagnetic interactions. Its speed in vacuum is precisely 186 282.397 miles per second, and a little less in air. You consistently asked why doesn't it impact things. Some people tried to reply that it is because it's massless, or "different", and you were right to dismiss that as rubbish. The correct answer is: it does.

The interactions of light with matter depend very much on the type of material, and that's why there are different colors, textures, and wonderful stones such as opal. In very general terms, however, a portion of it is absorbed and another is reflected (like a sound wave impacting a wall: you can hear the echo, so you know it's reflected, and you can hear it from the other side of the wall).

Now, why can't we FEEL the impacts? It's quite simple: it is too weak. If a photon of blue light impacted an object weighing about a pound, it would move off with a speed of about 4 billionths of a foot per second. If you calculate the pressure exerted by the light of the sun here on earth, you'll get about one tenth of a millionth of a pound per square foot. If a sheet of paper resting on your hand isn't powerful enough to smash it against the ground, then light shouldn't be either - and the paper is 160000 times more powerful!

I will close by saying that nowhere in the Bible does it say that light should be instantaneous. And, in fact, I was able to measure the speed of light in the laboratory myself, so I can very well believe that it propagates at the speed I just mentioned. So it is not unreasonable that these stars are millions of light-years away - the light has been traveling for millions of years, and stars are very long-lived objects. My personal belief is that, in the beginning, days and nights didn't have the same duration as they do today, so the 6 days of the creation could have taken place in a much longer (to us) period.

[barton]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

My personal belief is that, in the beginning, days and nights didn't have the same duration as they do today, so the 6 days of the creation could have taken place in a much longer (to us) period.

Your belief in what you calculate to be true is absolute while the truth of the Bible is secondary. What kind of Christian faith is this? Reasonable? Rational? No. It's diluted, let's-not-scare-people-with-Hell, liberal false Christianity.

You complain that the Bible doesn't tell us that light travels instantaneously. Whatever. I'm just wondering why you care what the Bible says or doesn't say since you so casually dismiss the literal, precise words in Genesis that describe creation. It says "days". It doesn't say "long day-like periods". What mealy-mouthed, water-downed sermons do you listen to that encourages you to play deviant lawyer tricks with the Word of God? You twist His words to fit your agenda.

You are about half-way down the slippery slope to Hell, I think. Can you turn around? Pray to your Creator for forgiveness before it's too late!

[Wide-Open]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

It says "days".

Amen Brother!

Let's not forget that God created plants on the third day.

11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

But He waited until the fourth day to create the sun.

16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

If those days were "much longer", one would have to wonder how the plants and trees (fruit-yealding and all!) survived all that time.

[ReasonableChristian]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Your belief in what you calculate to be true is absolute while the truth of the Bible is secondary. What kind of Christian faith is this? Reasonable? Rational? No. It's diluted, let's-not-scare-people-with-Hell, liberal false Christianity.

You complain that the Bible doesn't tell us that light travels instantaneously. Whatever. I'm just wondering why you care what the Bible says or doesn't say since you so casually dismiss the literal, precise words in Genesis that describe creation. It says "days". It doesn't say "long day-like periods". What mealy-mouthed, water-downed sermons do you listen to that encourages you to play deviant lawyer tricks with the Word of God? You twist His words to fit your agenda.

You are about half-way down the slippery slope to Hell, I think. Can you turn around? Pray to your Creator for forgiveness before it's too late!

So you kill people who work on Saturdays?

[Cindy Lou Jenkins]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

So you kill people who work on Saturdays?

We are commanded by God to obey secular law as well. So we vigorously work towards a theocracy in America, so that True Christian Men™ may slay those who work on the Sabbath, subjugate women, etc.

(Billy Bob: I approve this post.)

[barton]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

So you kill people who work on Saturdays?

This is what God commands in Exodus 31:14

"Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it [is] holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth [any] work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people."

God is serious about this. In Numbers 15, a man is found gathering sticks on the Sabbath. God demands they stone him to death:

"And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses."

Who are you to reinterpret what God so clearly demands of us? Do you really think He didn't mean it? Are you brainwashed by New Testament "freedom from the law" apologetics? Yes, Romans 8:1-3 is pretty clear:

[There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Each of us is free from the law, meaning our salvation does not depend on the old covenant law. Of course, if we are truly upright Christians, we naturally follow the law without even realizing it. God's grace makes that happen automatically. If any so-called Christian breaks the Sabbath, that is evidence that contradicts his relationship with Jesus... evidence that he is not "of faith" as required in Galations 3:11-12...

But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, [it is] evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Therefore, breaking the Sabbath demonstrates a lack of faith, which puts one squarely in the category of living in the old law. The congregation has no choice but to follow God's will, under the old law, for breaking the Sabbath... except as already spelled out by sister Cindy Lou. We do not flout secular law.

[RomanK]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Here is a question you.

So a light year = the distance light travels in a year.

Scientists say stars are million light years away.

So my question is how are we observing this light million light years away now?

I'm not millions of years old, i'm 20.

You were dropped a kid huh! Do you a sensor to keep from walking into walls?

[Meek and Humble]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

You were dropped a kid huh! Do you a sensor to keep from walking into walls?

This point really should be adressed. Let me use an analogy. Say one person was waiting for a an object for 1 year, then it arrived.

They would have to be atleast 1 year old, for the journey was 1 year.

Now we are told it takes 11 million years for light (the journey) to travel to earth.

That means you have to be 11 million years old. No one is though.

[ReasonableChristian]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

You're wrong. To prove it, I'm taking a wooden carving of a thrush that belonged to my grandfather, and I'm keeping it in a box. I will give it to my first child as soon as he or she is born. There, it's a carving over 90 years old being given to a child that'll only be alive for a few seconds upon receiving the gift.

@barton: so you put the law of men above the law of God?

[barton]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

@barton: so you put the law of men above the law of God?

Well, first of all, I rejoice that this is the only issue you had with my previous post. It gladdens my heart to know that you agree with everything else. Perhaps you are not so close-minded to God's literal truth as I had supposed! This is wonderful!

Your question about secular vs Biblical law is a very good one. I think there are several different ways to approach this but one that seems most apt is very, very simple. When God's laws were first given to men, they were the basis for a theocracy. There was no competing, divergent, separate secular law. Right now, however, we Christians are not in a homogeneous society and, despite the wishes of our Founding Fathers, the Christian moral basis for our law has been twisted into secularism.

I don't believe America is too far gone and can't be redeemed. However, until true Christians can bring about a true Christian theocracy in this country, with full force of law applicable to all within our borders, we have a very real jurisdictional problem. We Christians are as strangers in a strange land and those we eject from our midst for flouting our laws are no longer subject to our Christian laws, escaping the immediate physical consequences. Instead, they are subject to the secular laws of this land, beyond our legal reach for now. I am praying daily for this to change!

So far, though, none of this deals with the most common reason to debate secular vs God's law. Usually, we discuss this in terms of our own personal choices and what the law requires of us as individuals. For these things, I will always choose God. I will not lie or cheat or steal or murder or fornicate, no matter what secular laws 0bama might enact that require it of me. I would martyr myself rather than flout God's laws...

1st Corinthians 6:20 "For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

Basically, I will not personally be compelled by anyone to do anything that profanes my body or spirit. God is forever first in my life. I am just currently unable to bring God's earthly judgment as proscribed in the Bible upon others.

I hope this helps you get past your stumbling block with this. God wants you to go to heaven!

[Meek and Humble]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

You're wrong. To prove it, I'm taking a wooden carving of a thrush that belonged to my grandfather, and I'm keeping it in a box. I will give it to my first child as soon as he or she is born. There, it's a carving over 90 years old being given to a child that'll only be alive for a few seconds upon receiving the gift.

@barton: so you put the law of men above the law of God?

Nope this makes no sense still.

Stars generate their own light until they burn out. That means if it takes 11 million years for the light from a star to hit earth you would need to be 11 million years old.

Stars generate their light now. Like fire, a flame continues to burn and give off it's light.

Common sense debunks the whole starlight thing, and there are no problems with starlight with the Young Earth Creation model because of the above.

[Wash O'Hanley]

Re: How can we see stars if they are "millions of light years" aw

Scientists have once again gone against God's word and have tried to make us believe things that simply aren't true in order to damn our eternal souls to Hell.

The fact of the matter is that even if light really did need to travel millions of years in order for us to see stars you have to account for the fact that it gets dark every night when the sun goes away. This means the sun only has about 12 hours to send light to be reflected off those stars before it goes behind the earth and all the progress it made is canceled.