The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Brothers and sisters, today I was reading an article whose author suggested that morality is confronted by the "Euthyphro dilemma". That is, whether what is called "good" is good because God loves it, or God calls it "good" because it is inherently good.

If a moral standard is inherently good, then it is objective morality.

If a moral standard is good because God says so, then it is a subjective and relativistic morality.

Subjective, that is, to God.

The particular author insists that morality cannot be objective, because if it were, all religions would promote the same morals.

What do you think? Is morality:

Objective to God and to humans, which means an objective standard exists separate from both God and humans; it's just "good";

Objective to God and subjective to humans, which makes no sense at all because it'd mean humans can determine what's good but God cannot;

Subjective to God and objective to humans, meaning that God subjectively decides what is good, and humans have to accept that; or

Subjective to God and subjective to humans, meaning that God decides what is good, but humans can also decide what is good.

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

This is a pretty simple question.

We know that

• God is perfect as He says so in The Bible
• Humans, who were created by God, are worthless scum and should shut up and do as God says so before He burns us.

Therefor morality is objective to God, subjective to humans (as in subjected to what God tells them is morality)

We know morality is inherently good because God says so.

How do we know this? Simple; everyone who has disagreed with God's morality has ended up burning in Hell for all eternity.

[WWJDnow]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

GOOD without GOD is O.

[Chaz1218]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

This is a pretty simple question.

We know that

• God is perfect as He says so in The Bible
• Humans, who were created by God, are worthless scum and should shut up and do as God says so before He burns us.

Therefor morality is objective to God, subjective to humans (as in subjected to what God tells them is morality)

We know morality is inherently good because God says so.

How do we know this? Simple; everyone who has disagreed with God's morality has ended up burning in Hell for all eternity.

So you're gods bitch?

[Brother Helge]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

So you're gods bitch?

God doesn't have pets.
He already got the Angels to fetch His slippers.

[Dr Laurence Niles]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

What ever God says is the way it must be.

Seems pretty clear, me. Even an atheiotardist should be able to understand that.

YIC

[Jack O'fagan]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

Without God anything is acceptable. If most people in a society say that killing babies is morally right then within that society then it is right, that is why atheism is so dangerous, just look at Stalin as an example. With God we know what is right or wrong because He tells us. We know that killing babies is without exception* going to be morally wrong because we have God.

YIC

Jack


*unless He tells us to obviously.
1 Samuel 15:3
Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.




.

[Capt. Aaron Portway]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

Brothers and sisters, today I was reading an article whose author suggested that morality is confronted by the "Euthyphro dilemma". That is, whether what is called "good" is good because God loves it, or God calls it "good" because it is inherently good.

If a moral standard is inherently good, then it is objective morality.

If a moral standard is good because God says so, then it is a subjective and relativistic morality.

Subjective, that is, to God.

The particular author insists that morality cannot be objective, because if it were, all religions would promote the same morals.

What do you think? Is morality:

Objective to God and to humans, which means an objective standard exists separate from both God and humans; it's just "good";

Objective to God and subjective to humans, which makes no sense at all because it'd mean humans can determine what's good but God cannot;

Subjective to God and objective to humans, meaning that God subjectively decides what is good, and humans have to accept that; or

Subjective to God and subjective to humans, meaning that God decides what is good, but humans can also decide what is good.

Thanks a lot Reverend! Naomi read your post last night and got confused and started asking me all sorts of questions about what it meant and which of the poll answers she should pick. Then I read the post and couldn't make heads or tails of it, so now I look like an idiot to my idiot wife!

[Brother Helge]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

Without God anything is acceptable. If most people in a society say that killing babies is morally right then within that society then it is right, that is why atheism is so dangerous, just look at Stalin as an example. With God we know what is right or wrong because He tells us. We know that killing babies is without exception* going to be morally wrong because we have God.

YIC

Jack


*unless He tells us to then obviously.
1 Samuel 15:3
Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.




.

Amen Brother!

I am so glad that I've found Jesus. As you point out, otherwise I would never had known that killing babies for fun is wrong.

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

So you're gods bitch?

Are you Satan's bitch? Have fun taking a demon's barbed tallywacker up your behind in hell.

[Capt. Aaron Portway]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

After thinking about this most of the night, I decided to go with the last one. We are God's subjects, so we need to be subjective to Him. And since we, His subjects, are created in His image, He isn't an object, He's like a person, so I guess He is subjective too. I hope I picked right, I certainly don't want to make God mad by picking the wrong answer.

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

After thinking about this most of the night, I decided to go with the last one. We are God's subjects, so we need to be subjective to Him. And since we, His subjects, are created in His image, He isn't an object, He's like a person, so I guess He is subjective too. I hope I picked right, I certainly don't want to make God mad by picking the wrong answer.

I disagree with the last part; God is the most objective creature ever. We know this because God says so. I have touched upon this subject here.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

After thinking about this most of the night, I decided to go with the last one. We are God's subjects, so we need to be subjective to Him. And since we, His subjects, are created in His image, He isn't an object, He's like a person, so I guess He is subjective too. I hope I picked right, I certainly don't want to make God mad by picking the wrong answer.

God is angry. You have said that humans get to decide for themselves what is right and wrong.

I'm pretty sure that's blasphemy . . .

[Cranky Old Man]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

So you're gods bitch?

An unusual way to phrase it, but essentially true.

We have to do whatever He demands from us to be allowed in Heaven. Which is only fair as He created us, Heaven, Hell and the rules.


John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

[Billy Bob Jenkins]

Re: The Euthyphro Dilemma - Is morality objective or subjective?

God is angry. You have said that humans get to decide for themselves what is right and wrong.

I'm pretty sure that's blasphemy . . .

Speaking of anal sex, Reverend, I would like to state for the record that it is most certainly objectively wrong.

Morality is subjective to God, because He derives it from His own Divine Nature through self-knowledge. It is objective to us, because we receive it in the form of eternal and immutable Laws.