[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Everything you mention here argues in favor of the maturity argument. One of your lines even uses the word maturity. NONE of these definitions say anything about sinless perfection.

Again, you have no response for Luke 1 and all the Old Testament quotes I showed you.

Also 1 John is addressed to believers. This IS NOT speaking t to the unsaved. The audience is beleivers.

Stop the presses! 1 John is telling believers that they don't sin?

That's my point precisely.

As backup I submit again the verses from the Apostle Paul:

1 Timothy 1:15 - This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

Paul says "I am chief". This is present tense, not past before he was saved.

Are you saying the Bible is contradictory?

I am trying to show you, using the Bible, why you are wrong and are hell bound!

[studentoftheword (On Moderation)]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

I have heard that argument before. In Matthew 5, when Jesus exhorts us to be perfect, the word used is teleios. That quite literally means perfect. Strong's defines it thusly. You total depravity dummies are putting a lot on hoping that it is definition 4b1.

1) brought to its end, finished
2) wanting nothing necessary to completeness
3) perfect
4) that which is perfect
a) consummate human integrity and virtue
b) of men
1) full grown, adult, of full age, mature

You still haven't accounted for Luke 1 and all the Old Testament scriptures.



Again, that is before Salvation. Why would John go on to completely contradict himself in chapter 3 if it wasn't?

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Everything you mention here argues in favor of the maturity argument. One of your lines even uses the word maturity. NONE of these definitions say anything about sinless perfection.

Also 1 John is addressed to believers. This IS NOT speaking t to the unsaved. The audience is beleivers. As backup I submit again the verses from the Apostle Paul:

1 Timothy 1:15 - This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

Paul says "I am chief". This is present tense, not past before he was saved.

[Jedediah]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Oh really? What if I told you that the Holy Sprit was telling me the same thing about you? You have no right to judge me. You are usurping God's role.

Then I would say that you are a liar and a backbiter, attempting to sow discord and deceive Jesus' very elect. God hates that! (Proverbs 6:16-19)

The Holy Spirit is telling me that your mind is infested with demons, who whisper wicked things into your ear. I will keep you in my prayers.

Read the scripture and be learn IF you are able. You do take scripture literally don't you. Take this then:

Romans 2:1 You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.

How dare you suggest that the Bible contradicts Itself!

Paul is addressing unsaved trash here, not True Christians™. In fact, I was taught in seminary that Paul was addressing dirty, hypocritical jews in Romans 2. But don't believe me; read for yourself.

Let's read what Paul says when he is writing to Jesus' elect instead of Christ-killers.

I Corinthians 2:15
But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

As blood-bought children of God who follow His Commandments and abide by His Word without deviation, not only may we judge others; others may not judge us!

Paul goes on to tell the Corinthians that we will indeed judge angels in our righteousness and perfection. Hosanna!

I Corinthians 6:2-4
Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Oh really? What if I told you that the Holy Sprit was telling me the same thing about you? You have no right to judge me. You are usurping God's role.

While you sit high on the judgment seat of us. Pride comes before the fall.

Interesting how you handle people who point out your errors. You slow them down by forcing more time between posts to give yourself an advantage. Can't think fast enough?

It's to make you actually put some work into your posts instead of hysterically waving your arms screaming at us that we are doing Christianity wrong.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

"Pastor" William Nathaniel. You are absolutely incorrect. First the word perfect in scripture does not mean without sin. The word in the greek means "mature", not sinless. The Bible makes it very clear we are all sinners. Christians are imperfect people saved by God's grace. You are a wonderful example of imperfection yourself. I at least admit to my imperfection.

I have heard that argument before. In Matthew 5, when Jesus exhorts us to be perfect, the word used is teleios. That quite literally means perfect. Strong's defines it thusly. You total depravity dummies are putting a lot on hoping that it is definition 4b1.

1) brought to its end, finished
2) wanting nothing necessary to completeness
3) perfect
4) that which is perfect
a) consummate human integrity and virtue
b) of men
1) full grown, adult, of full age, mature

You still haven't accounted for Luke 1 and all the Old Testament scriptures.

1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

Again, that is before Salvation. Why would John go on to completely contradict himself in chapter 3 if it wasn't?

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

[Born Again Bob]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Dear Friend,

'Religion' is a MAN-MADE psychological construct. Christianity/Hinduism/Buddhism/Satanism etc. were all man-made thought-constructs...they did not EXIST until we (mankind) made them up in our own minds. 'Religion' is the anti-spirit.

Before mankind could fathom the concept of 'religion', before mankind could fathom the thought-concept of 'faith', before mankind could fathom the notion of 'supernatural power(s)', before mankind could fathom the belief in a 'divine power'....before all of that, there was: GOOD, EVIL, LOVE, HATE, RESPECT, AND DISRESPECT...ALL OF WHICH EXISTED NATURALLY IN THE FREE-WILL, SPACE-AND-TIME IN WHICH WE EXIST IN.

Religion gets in the way of mankind reaching/understand his or her own 'self-actualization'. The natural spirit that is in all our physical bodies does not need religion, all it needs is FREE-WILL and the universal expectation of RESPECT.

How is Lyndon Larouche these days?

YIH,
BAB

[studentoftheword (On Moderation)]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

What do you think we've been doing all these years?!! What do you think I'VE BEEN TRAVELLING THERE all these years for?!

You don't know what you're talking about, boy!




And why would you put yourself in direct opposition to God's Loving Wrath against that demon worshiping nation? Who are you to judge God?

Putting "stud" back into Bible study? Is Pastor Ezekial having a pride problem? I don't know what you've been praying for. Hopefully you have been praying fro Japan to come to Christ. I would certainly agree with you there. I don't agree with this thread that prays for a nuclear holocaust to fall upon Japan. You presume that's what God wants. How do you what is in the mind and heart of God?

Isaiah 55:

8For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. 9For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

[studentoftheword (On Moderation)]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Why do you think we are praying for disaster to strike Japan? It is precisely because of our Christian Love that we want them to snap out of their delusional way of thinking and accept Jesus Christ as their personal LORD and Savior! If you had one iota of Christian discernment, you would realize this.

The Holy Spirit is telling me that you are no Saved® because you flagrantly refuse to follow His Word in its entirety.

And just so you realize that our prayers are indeed being answered, take a look at this uplifting story:

What have you done for the Glory of the Kingdom lately, son?

Oh really? What if I told you that the Holy Sprit was telling me the same thing about you? You have no right to judge me. You are usurping God's role.

Read the scripture and be learn IF you are able. You do take scripture literally don't you. Take this then:

Romans 2:1 You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.

Interesting how you handle people who point out your errors. You slow them down by forcing more time between posts to give yourself an advantage. Can't think fast enough?

[Irrational One]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

'Religion' is a MAN-MADE psychological construct. Christianity/Hinduism/Buddhism/Satanism etc. were all man-made thought-constructs...they did not EXIST until we (mankind) made them up in our own minds. 'Religion' is the anti-spirit.

Before mankind could fathom the concept of 'religion', before mankind could fathom the thought-concept of 'faith', before mankind could fathom the notion of 'supernatural power(s)', before mankind could fathom the belief in a 'divine power'....before all of that, there was: GOOD, EVIL, LOVE, HATE, RESPECT, AND DISRESPECT...ALL OF WHICH EXISTED NATURALLY IN THE FREE-WILL, SPACE-AND-TIME IN WHICH WE EXIST IN.

Religion gets in the way of mankind reaching/understand his or her own 'self-actualization'. The natural spirit that is in all our physical bodies does not need religion, all it needs is FREE-WILL and the universal expectation of RESPECT.

[loveis..]

Re: Please pray for Sister Pamela Thompson

Yes I've read the Bible many times over. I am a life long disciple of the Word and the rubbish that Landover publishes bears no resemblance to the true word of God. Landover is a disgrace and an embarrassment to the body of Christ. False prophets spewing hateful out of context, twisting of scripture.

i agree.. I never thought there were groups like this but apparently there are... all we can do is pray that they will see the truth and hope and pray they don't suck anymore people into this nonsense...

[studentoftheword (On Moderation)]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Absolutely wrong. The Bible speaks of holiness and being unblemished more than it speaks of total depravity.

Did you not read the thread Brother Jedediah posted for your edification?

Allow me to list the scriptures and you can try to pick it apart telling me how we are twisting the Bible.

Psalm 119:1-4 Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.

Here God tells Abraham that perfection is achievable.

Genesis 17:1 I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

I can hear some panties getting into a twist over these scriptures. Perhaps you think, that's Old Testament. The Bible says, "for all have sinned." That was prior to our Salvation. I would like to draw your attention to:

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

How could we not be perfect if Jesus himself admonishes us to be perfect?

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

In the Book of Luke, Jesus tells us that in becoming perfect, we are like God.

Luke 6:40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.

In many of the Epistles, the authors tell us that we are perfect and can be "unblameable in holiness," like our Master Who is in Heaven.

1 Thessalonians 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

Colossians 1:22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

Colossians 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 5:10 But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.

Philippians 3:15Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

And most importantly,

1 John 3:5-9 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I wanted to add a list of a few perfect people in the Bible besides Jesus for those you who don't believe there was anyone else who was ever perfect.

Luke 1:5-6 THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

Genesis 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

God speaking to Ezekiel.

Ezekiel 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

David speaking to God.

Psalm 101:2 I will behave myself wisely in a perfect way. O when wilt thou come unto me? I will walk within my house with a perfect heart.

And

2 Samuel 22:22-24 For I have kept the ways of the LORD, and have not wickedly departed from my God.
For all his judgments were before me: and as for his statutes, I did not depart from them.
I was also upright before him, and have kept myself from mine iniquity.



Overused and completely taken out of context. That is prior to Salvation. Keep reading the chapter. Once you accept the grace, assuming you were predestined to, your sins are washed clean.

24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;




No tardlette. Read it with your eyes open this time.

5And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

By your logic, Jesus was manifested to take away our sins whoever abides in Jesus Jesus does not sin. But if Jesus does sin, Jesus has never known Jesus.



Read the list I gave you. There has been more than one sin free person.



And I don't appreciate yours, missy! That is why you have just earned an infraction for scripture twisting!

"Pastor" William Nathaniel. You are absolutely incorrect. First the word perfect in scripture does not mean without sin. The word in the greek means "mature", not sinless. The Bible makes it very clear we are all sinners. Christians are imperfect people saved by God's grace. You are a wonderful example of imperfection yourself. I at least admit to my imperfection.

The apostle Paul said he was a sinner. Read scripture below and learn something.

So you claim to take God's word literally? If so the Bible says you are calling God a liar in 1 John 1:10. Read the scripture and learn something.

Romans 7:
14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

[Jedediah]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

You call me a "judgmental hypocrite" because I point out what you are doing? Yes I am a sinner saved by God's grace. I do not care what you think of me I only care what God thinks of me. Why can't you pray for Japan to come to Christ as a result of the disaster that has already hit them. Why do you wish even worse ont them, a nuclear disaster on them as well? That's not love.

Why do you think we are praying for disaster to strike Japan? It is precisely because of our Christian Love that we want them to snap out of their delusional way of thinking and accept Jesus Christ as their personal LORD and Savior! If you had one iota of Christian discernment, you would realize this.

The Holy Spirit is telling me that you are no Saved® because you flagrantly refuse to follow His Word in its entirety.

And just so you realize that our prayers are indeed being answered, take a look at this uplifting story:

Tokyo governor admits earthquake is punishment from God, and Japan must be cleansed of its sins.


Interest: Tokyo Head: Tsunami is 'Divine Punishment'—Haruhi's Yamakan Responds (Updated)



Quote:
Tokyo Governor Shintaro Ishihara said the following about the March 11 earthquake (Tōhoku Chihō Taiheiyō-oki Jishin) and tsunami to the press in the metropolis on Monday:

The identity of the Japanese people is selfishness. The Japanese people must take advantage of this tsunami as means of washing away their selfish greed. I really do think this is divine punishment.

Ishihara was contrasting the "selfishness and greed" that he perceived in Japan with the identity of the United States with "liberty" and the identity of France with "liberty, philanthropy, and equality [sic]."

What have you done for the Glory of the Kingdom lately, son?

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Why can't you pray for Japan to come to Christ as a result of the disaster that has already hit them.

What do you think we've been doing all these years?!! What do you think I'VE BEEN TRAVELLING THERE all these years for?!

You don't know what you're talking about, boy!

Why do you wish even worse ont them, a nuclear disaster on them as well? That's not love.

And why would you put yourself in direct opposition to God's Loving Wrath against that demon worshiping nation? Who are you to judge God?

[studentoftheword (On Moderation)]

Re: Please pray for Japanese nuclear reactors to meltdown

Pull the beam from your own eye, judgmental hypocrite, and read the next verse.

18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

You call me a "judgmental hypocrite" because I point out what you are doing? Yes I am a sinner saved by God's grace. I do not care what you think of me I only care what God thinks of me. Why can't you pray for Japan to come to Christ as a result of the disaster that has already hit them. Why do you wish even worse ont them, a nuclear disaster on them as well? That's not love.

[Jedediah]

Re: Please pray for Sister Pamela Thompson

That John 8:11 quote has nothing to do with this. You can't just randomly stick scripture where you please and add a praise god to make it fit. You feel me? We can still sin. We DO still sin. It says so through out the bible.

Why does it have nothing to do with this? Perhaps because it contradicts your vain, preconceived notions about what it means to be a Christian? Why don't you try actually following the Word of God instead of your conscience. This is precisely why God tells us to avoid thinking for ourselves.

Proverbs 3:5-6
Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

When we are clensed we are forgiven, but not protected. Temptation comes our way and the devil comes to oppress us. 'Sinners' refers to people INTENTIONALLY sinning against God. 'Sin no more' is like trying yourbest and asking for forgiveness for when you mess up.

Now you are blatantly twisting Scripture to say something that it does not. That is what separates True Christians™ from fluffy-bunny, God-loves-everybody-no-matter-what false Christians like yourself.

"Sin no more" means exactly what it says: SIN NO MORE!

If in trying your best, you continue to sin, then you were never truly a Christian to begin with. I noticed that you chose to completely ignore the Scripture I provided you earlier, so let me reiterate:

I John 3:6-9
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Account for the many other scriptures in the bible. Ecclesiastes 7:20 Proverbs 20:9 Romans 3:23

Blasphemy upon blasphemy! Now you are trying suggest that the Holy Bible contradicts itself? I am incredulous!

Ecclesiastes 7:20
For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.

Before Jesus purchased the souls of His elect with His Blood (Acts 20:28, I Corinthians 6:20), there were no just men upon the earth. We are all born into sin, which is why little children who haven't yet accepted Jesus Christ into their hearts go to hell every day.

Proverbs 20:9
Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

Indeed, who can say that they are pure of sin? True Christians™, that's who! If you have not already done so, I suggest you read Pastor Jones' sermon: True Christians are Perfect!

Romans 3:23
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Indeed they have. Before accepting Jesus as my personal LORD and Savior, I used to be a homosexual... what unrepentant sodomites refer to as a "power bottom." But having bathed in Christ's Blood, I now stand justified in my righteousness and perfection. I like the following verses as well. They give me strength.

Romans 3:24-26
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

You know that we're all born again. Being born again is like a symbolic change to wear you don't have DESIRE for those things and sins. Do they still happen from time to time? Sure! The devil comes to destroy. That's why we must stay strong in our faith!

We're all born again? Even non-Christians? What are you, some sort of universal unitarian? I'm sure you'll have no trouble backing that assertion up with Scripture.

Or have you actually read more than a handful of cherry-picked "feel-good-about-yourself-and-your-perversions" verses?

Ever since I became a True Christian™, the only desire I have felt is to share the Good News with the world and to keep God's Commandments. I'm not sure how you plan to stay strong in your faith when whatever semblance of faith you have is misplaced in false teachings and false doctrines.

For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. This scripture is talking about Jesus. Jesus was and IS the only sinfree man.

Again, actually having read the Bible would clear up so many of your misunderstandings. Those who accept Christ and keep His Commandments, as prescribed in the KJV 1611, are sons of God.

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

1st John 3:2
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Romans 8:14
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Those who do not hear His Words (*ahem*) are sons of the devil and shall not have their part in His Kingdom.

John 8:43-44
Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

I don't appreciate your out of context scripture giving. Very misleading. I'm sure it was a mistake, right? It's getting late and I need to be off to bed. Goodnight and may God speak to you in such a real way tonight. May he bless you. ~Brandi

Oh my, that is rich! Since I'm pointing out to you exactly what the Bible says, as it is written, but you don't like what you're hearing, then it must be me who is misquoting Scripture!

My family and I will pray that you take your faith more seriously and that one day you truly come to understand what it means to be a Christian.