[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: Atheist fallacies

feel free to make me some questions about atheism.

What is it like to be an atheist?

[Didymus Much]

Re: Atheist fallacies

Any problem with that?...

Your reading comprehension.

...Seems like a discussion is synonimous of debate. So... what's the problem after all?

Again, your reading comprehension. "Debate" is ONE possible meaning of "discussion"; that does not mean they are synonymous.

If you have questions, ask them, POLITELY (after using the "search" function to ensure that the question has not been answered already), and they will be answered. Attempt debate, and you will be banned (after being informed that you are wrong, anyway). That will not be my doing, so don't bother bitching to me.

[Billy Bob Jenkins]

Re: Atheist fallacies

Amen Billy Bob.

Question, while watching a debate a little while ago, I started to see another contradiction and wondered whether this be a fallacy. I mean the Atheist in the debate began using terminology from Computer Science, they began demonstrating their theory with a program. But I could not help but see that God made the universe, by softly spoken words.

The contradiction it seems comes by way of the mathematics used to create a program. To create this demo, a rendering of the universe by using a language, but yet God spoke creation into existence...

Dunno, this just came to mind while listening.

And Billy Bob, that is interesting in what you say, that only the Divine Laws are broken. Why is that?

Friend, I believe we have covered some of this ground. The reason that prescriptive laws like "Thou shalt have no gods before me" can be broken while natural laws like Intelligent Pulling cannot, is because God loves us and therefore wants us to be free to burn in Hell for all eternity without any possibility of escape; the reason God allows evil is because He is so good. This is Christianity 101, friend.

[Pim Pendergast]

Re: Atheist fallacies

So many misconceptions about Atheism. You clearly don't know that much about what being atheist is about. Being Atheist is not some kind of rocket science, it's a pretty simple concept, it isn't as complex as tou seem to think

Let's try to have a serious and grown up debate here, feel free to make me some questions about atheism. Let me help you to understand Atheism and in the process maybe I can also understand you better.

It's not my intention to turn anyone to Atheism, the same way I will not be converted to your religion. I just want we to understand ourselves better.

How about explain why you reject all the evidence for God's existence. There are many sources of evidence: the Bible; creation (Rom 1:18-32), creation science and Flood geology; world events, answered prayers and miracles; and your own conscience (Rom 1:18-32). Rational discussion is encouraged on this forum. So I challenge you to explain why you reject all the evidence for God, without resorting to fallacious (irrational) reasoning, especially "begging the question," which I mentioned in the OP. Maybe then you'll see how foolish your position is.

[Truth I Seek]

Re: Atheist fallacies

Your reading comprehension.

Again, your reading comprehension. "Debate" is ONE possible meaning of "discussion"; that does not mean they are synonymous.

It's just a matter ofsemantics. In practice both discussion and debate are the same, 2 or more people speaking about a subject.

If you have questions, ask them, POLITELY (after using the "search" function to ensure that the question has not been answered already), and they will be answered. Attempt debate, and you will be banned (after being informed that you are wrong, anyway). That will not be my doing, so don't bother bitching to me.

Let them ban me if they are so insecure of their beliefs that this is the only way they have to deal with someone that is not being rude to them.

[Truth I Seek]

Re: Atheist fallacies

How about explain why you reject all the evidence for God's existence. There are many sources of evidence: the Bible; creation (Rom 1:18-32), creation science and Flood geology; world events, answered prayers and miracles; and your own conscience (Rom 1:18-32). Rational discussion is encouraged on this forum. So I challenge you to explain why you reject all the evidence for God, without resorting to fallacious (irrational) reasoning, especially "begging the question," which I mentioned in the OP. Maybe then you'll see how foolish your position is.

These are all faith related evidences. I need factual evidence. And the reality is that there isn't a single factual evidence of the existence of your god.

The bible is not the proof of god's existence, it's the claim of it's existence. In the same way the qu'ran it's the claim that Mohammed is the true prophet of allah and has pretty much the same faith related evidences that the bible has. Why do you accept one and reject the other?

[Pim Pendergast]

Re: Irrits (the)

How many fallacies can you count there?

I couldn't count them all, but the song reminded me of the non sequitur. "P is true; therefore R." I can only assume that if heathens like the Beatles are prone to this fallacy, it must be widespread among atheists also. I must say, after reading those lyrics I needed to read my Bible for an hour straight just to clear my head.

Proof by assertion. Simply stating something to be true without offering evidence or a supporting argument for the statement. This fallacy takes the form "P is true." For example, "God doesn't exist." Or, "Evolution is now a fact." Atheists seem to think that if they just keep saying the same thing over and over, that makes it true. God wants us to immunise our children against this kind of brainwashing. That's why it's important to homeschool them so that they can learn the truth: God does exist, and evolution is a lie from the devil; God created everything.

Appeal to ridicule. Presenting your opponent's position in a way that makes it seem ridiculous. "If the Genesis Creation account is true, then God created light before He created the sun, moon and stars!" (Which of course is true, but imagine this being said in a condescending, mocking tone). They love to mock the Creation account. They can't see the folly of their own position. If there is no God, then the universe just appeared out of nothing.

[Pim Pendergast]

Re: Atheist fallacies

These are all faith related evidences. I need factual evidence.

The bible is not the proof of god's existence, it's the claim of it's existence. In the same way the qu'ran it's the claim that Mohammed is the true prophet of allah and has pretty much the same faith related evidences that the bible has. Why do you accept one and reject the other?

But the Bible is proof of God's existence. The very first verse states the existence of God as a fact.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

And how do I know God's Word is true? Simple. The Bible tells me so.

Jn 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

Why is God's Word true? Because it is inspired by God.

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

I reject the koran because the Bible warns against adding to God's Word.

Rev 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: and if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

The koran was written at least five centuries after Revelation. Accepting it would be adding to God's Word.

And the reality is that there isn't a single factual evidence of the existence of your god.

^^^Misapplying the burden of proof^^^

So you say, but is there any factual evidence against His existence?

[BelieverInGod]

Re: Atheist fallacies

If the non-believers are not welcome make it an invite only forum.

Because Jesus told us to preach to all the world. Can you think of a better way of getting the word out in this day-and-age other than the internet?

Anyway, how would we find True Christians™ around the world if it wasn't open? We've even had people convert because of our pages.

Who told that I didn't read that? Foruns are by nature places of debate, a rule that states it isn't makes no sense to me. Theres something else on that thread that caught my attention:

No you didn't read the thread. We know that because you're asking questions that were answered in the thread.

"We tend to get two types of dissenters here. Some are calm and reasonable folks who are capable of rational discussion. I personally enjoy discussing religious topics with this sort of person."

seems like serious and rational debate are not that unwelcomed after all.

There's a difference between discussion and debate. We will gladly have a discussion with someone who has read the Bible and actually has some idea of what they're talking about.

You on the other hand

[BelieverInGod]

Re: Atheist fallacies

It's just a matter ofsemantics. In practice both discussion and debate are the same, 2 or more people speaking about a subject.

Wow, so this is what public education has come to...

Perhaps you should read a dictionary before you attempt the KJV Bible.

Definition of discussion
noun

[mass noun]

• the action or process of talking about something in order to reach a decision or to exchange ideas: the committee acts as a forum for discussion the EC directive is currently under discussion
• [count noun] a conversation or debate about a specific topic: discussions about environmental improvement
• [count noun] a detailed treatment of a topic in speech or writing: see Appendix One, for a more detailed discussion

Origin:

Middle English (denoting judicial examination): via Old French from late Latin discussio(n-), from discutere 'investigate' (see discuss)




Definition of debate
noun

• a formal discussion on a particular matter in a public meeting or legislative assembly, in which opposing arguments are put forward and which usually ends with a vote: last night’s debate on the Education Bill
• an argument about a particular subject, especially one in which many people are involved: the national debate on abortion [mass noun]: there has been much debate about prices

verb

[with object]

• argue about (a subject), especially in a formal manner: MPs debated the issue in the Commons [no object]: members of the society debated for five nights
• [with clause] consider a possible course of action in one’s mind before reaching a decision: he debated whether he should leave the matter alone or speak to her

Phrases

be open to debate



be unproven and requiring further discussion: whether a further wave of takeovers would benefit consumers is open to debate

under debate



being discussed or disputed: the subject is still under debate

Let them ban me if they are so insecure of their beliefs that this is the only way they have to deal with someone that is not being rude to them.

Kicking a yappy dog does not mean I'm insecure about the dog. It means it's pestered me to the point I don't want to listen to it any more.

For some reason most of you atheist type come here looking to be banned. Somehow you think that annoying us to the point that our pastors kick you out the door somehow proves your intelligence. It doesn't. It just means you're an annoying yappy little dog who got kicked out the door for being a pest.

[Truth I Seek]

Re: Atheist fallacies

But the Bible is proof of God's existence. The very first verse states the existence of God as a fact.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

And how do I know God's Word is true? Simple. The Bible tells me so.

Jn 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

Why is God's Word true? Because it is inspired by God.

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

I see 3 claims, Three convinient claims each one supporting the other but no proof of god's existence whatsoever.

I reject the koran because the Bible warns against adding to God's Word.

Rev 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: and if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

The koran was written at least five centuries after Revelation. Accepting it would be adding to God's Word.

Fair enough. But what about the Torah?

^^^Misapplying the burden of proof^^^

So you say, but is there any factual evidence against His existence?

If I'm wrong and there factual evidences then please tell me where they are becaus I have no knowledge of any.

As for the factual evidences against his existence... the simple fact there isn't any prove in favor of his existence leads me to believe he doesn't exist. Besides is not the non believers that need to prove anything, it's the believers that claim his existence. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary proofs.

[Billy Bob Jenkins]

Re: Atheist fallacies

These are all faith related evidences. I need factual evidence. And the reality is that there isn't a single factual evidence of the existence of your god.

The bible is not the proof of god's existence, it's the claim of it's existence. In the same way the qu'ran it's the claim that Mohammed is the true prophet of allah and has pretty much the same faith related evidences that the bible has. Why do you accept one and reject the other?

See, even atheists admit that faith counts as evidence. The only move they can make is to deny that our faith is a fact. This is why religious people laugh at atheists. You deny the fact that we have faith, but admit that such faith would be evidence of God's existence. Given these assumptions, how could there not be a God?

[Billy Bob Jenkins]

Re: Atheist fallacies

This unsaved vermin has just PROVED that there is a God, through an utter failure to appear objective while arguing for the precarious faith of atheism.

Next, please.

[Truth I Seek]

Re: Atheist fallacies

See, even atheists admit that faith counts as evidence. The only move they can make is to deny that our faith is a fact. This is why religious people laugh at atheists. You deny the fact that we have faith, but admit that such faith would be evidence of God's existence. Given these assumptions, how could there not be a God?

Wrong, only factual evidence count because they can be verified. Faith related evidences cannot so they do not count.

If I claim I have a ring in my pocket you may believe it or not, it's a question of faith and while it is in my pocket it cannot be verified.

If I take the ring off my pocket it can be verified and it's a factual proof.

[Truth I Seek]

Re: Atheist fallacies

This unsaved vermin has just PROVED that there is a God, through an utter failure to appear objective while arguing for the precarious faith of atheism.

Next, please.

Atheism deals with facts, Faith has nothing to do with atheism. Atheism rejects faith. Faith cannot prove the existence of god because on its nature faith is believing without having proofs.