[Rev. Jim Osborne]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

The one-way view of the general posters on this forum deem it so.
Not open-minded in the slightest.

Why should we be open-minded towards falsehoods? You know that 2+2=4, right? What if some clod comes in here and starts saying 2+2=5. So you start chastizing him and correcting him. Then he throws back at you: "Why don't you be more open-minded to those who have a different viewpoint?"

You're the idiot here saying it equals 5.

[Robert Hutchins]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

Is it really relevant that the word "Catholic" was users to describe a church before "Baptist?"

Let's not forget that many of the members of the original Church were Pagan. Should we acknowledge them as equals too?

[Sacred Heart]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

Clearly, I'm not involved in whatever trivial discussion you are having about the use of the word father so I can't change the subject of a debate that I'm not a part of. Let's be serious, you're never going to admit that you are wrong, and hence you will never move on to another subject. You're just using this as an excuse to duck and hide from the more serious issue of your "vicar of god" being a protector, and therefore supporter, of pedophiles.

I started a new thread, just for you!!

We are True Christians. We believe in the entire KJV1611 to the letter. Therefore, we are not broken into any demoninations. You are either with us or with satan. There can be nothing more straightforward than following the Bible to the letter. We don't interpret.

Please see below...

We follow the Word of God. This practice has not changed since the days of Abel and Seth some 6000 or so years ago.

Except for the fact that the word of God was not completely written...

....um, yeah. They wrote it as it was intended... duh... therefore, there is no room for interpretation. The Bible says what it says which is what I've been saying. YOU, on the otherhand, seem to be under the impression that the Bible says something other than what it actually says.

Hmm... Again, please see below...

Well, since Jesus was there and didn't cut off any limbs, the context dictates that he isn't made of bread. Just like the context of a certain passage makes it clear that those in positions of religious authority shouldn't be called "father".

Context DICTATES??? What is that? Oh my, I think you are interpreting Scripture!

By your reasoning that is simply not allowed. Make up your mind please.

[Sacred Heart]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

*** A whole lot of stuff ***

Now you seem to think that the Catholic Church does not recognize Scripture at all or that there is some authority greater than Scripture.

And this is not true.

There is no Doctrine opposing Scripture. Not one.

[I][B]

Since you seem to like just showing off what other people have written, I think I'll do the same:

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/sola-scriptura-earlychurch.html

http://biblelight.net/sola1.htm

I am sorry, I do not have time to read through all of this. I'm not trying to make you angry though this at all, just being honest... However, if there was an issue in these links that you specifically wanted me to look at, present the portion and I'll be happy to discuss... But... I can't just read all that. It is simply too much.

Now if you absolutely insist that there is no other way whatsoever to convey your point I will oblige. But my response would take a long time coming back to you...

[Sacred Heart]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

Is it really relevant that the word "Catholic" was users to describe a church before "Baptist?"

Let's not forget that many of the members of the original Church were Pagan. Should we acknowledge them as equals too?

We were talking about which one came first was all...

This was in the process of myself refuting the claim that John the Baptist held the same beliefs the Landover Baptists... Namely the beliefs of Sola Scriptura and Faith Alone.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

We were talking about which one came first was all...

This was in the process of myself refuting the claim that John the Baptist held the same beliefs the Landover Baptists... Namely the beliefs of Sola Scriptura and Faith Alone.

You might want to take a look at THIS thread, Joey.

I'm still Praying that Jesus pulls the scales from your eyes.

[Remy Lebeau]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

Context DICTATES??? What is that? Oh my, I think you are interpreting Scripture!

By your reasoning that is simply not allowed. Make up your mind please.

No, I'm not interpreting scripture. The scripture can mean nothing other than what I have stated. Jesus was not made of bread or crackers(in the case of catholics), ergo it is not an interpretation to state that the bread was not actually His body. Nor was His blood, the precious blood that ran through His veins that He spilled for our sins, an alcoholic beverage made from fermented grapes.

I noticed you didn't answer my question. Here it is again: Do you or do you not believe that Jesus was a giant human shaped loaf of bread animated by the power of God?

Even if Jesus was a bread golem with wine blood (which he is definitely not!!!) who cut off His fingers and feed them to the apostles and then bleed into some glasses and had them drink His wine blood it would be the bread and wine that they consumed at that very moment that would be His body. Not some 12 oz box of Animal Crackers and cheap Yellowtail wine you bought from Walmart, you unsufferable dunce.

[WWJDnow]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

Is it really relevant that the word "Catholic" was users to describe a church before "Baptist?"

It wasn't. John the Baptist lived before the death of Christ, so Baptism predates Christianity. John preached redemption

Let's not forget that many of the members of the original Church were Pagan. Should we acknowledge them as equals too?

If you mean they were formerly pagans, then became Christians, then we can and should acknowledge them as fellow Christians.

If you mean that they were still pagans when they were Christians, then the simple fact is they may have claimed to be Christians, but they were not actually Christians. There is no room for more than one God in Christianity. That's how we know that Catholics aren't Christians--they pray to saints and bow down before statues.

[WWJDnow]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

It wasn't. John the Baptist lived before the death of Christ, so Baptism predates Christianity. John preached redemption

Sorry, everyone, I didn't finish that sentence. What I meant to say was John preached redemption through remission of sins by baptism, so Baptism was already there. All that was needed to make Baptism Christian was the death of Jesus. So, at the very moment of Jesus's death upon the cross, Baptism became Christian Baptism. The first Christians were therefore Baptists.

Of course, we Baptists can't be responsible for the polytheistic heretics who later formed the Catholic church.

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

We were talking about which one came first was all...

This was in the process of myself refuting the claim that John the Baptist held the same beliefs the Landover Baptists... Namely the beliefs of Sola Scriptura and Faith Alone.

I just posted several Biblical quotes that support both Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide, and you ignored them.

I posted quotes from the same church fathers who you worship that support sola scriptura, and you ignored them (note: it's not that I care what they wrote, but you certainly do, so you would think it would matter. And yes, those quotes do not simply say: "traditions are okay as long as they don't contradict the Bible" as you suggest. They say clearly doctrines of faith must be specifically drawn from the Bible. Tell me, where is the Assumption of Mary in the Bible?).

I posted links to websites that contain fairly brief articles and you refused to look at them. What do you want? We cannot have intelligent debate out of soundbites and tiny quotes. Whole books can and have been written on these subjects. But then, I suppose you Catholics have never been too keen on reading (especially the Bible).

And Sola Fide was not invented by Protestant Reformers.

http://thoughtsactions.wordpress.com/2009/08/31/church-history-of-faith-alone/

Ambrose: ‘It is ordained of God that he who believes in Christ is saved freely receiving.’

Anselm:

• Question: “Dost thou believe that the Lord Jesus died for thee?”
• Answer: “I believe it.”
• Question: “Dost thou thank Him for His passion and death?
• Answer: “I do thank Him.”
• Question: “Dost thou believe that thou canst not be saved except by His death?”
• Answer: “I believe it.”

“Come then, while life remaineth in thee; in His death alone place thy whole trust; in naught else place any trust; to His death commit thyself wholly; with this alone cover thyself wholly; and if the Lord thy God will to judge thee, say, ‘Lord, between thy judgment and me I present the death of our Lord Jesus Christ; no otherwise can I contend with thee.’ And if He shall say that thou art a sinner, say thou, ‘Lord, I interpose the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between my sins and thee.’ If He say that thou hast deserved condemnation, say, ‘Lord, I set the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between my evil deserts and thee, and Your merits I offer for those which I ought to have and have not.’ If he say that He is wroth with thee, say, ‘Lord, I oppose the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between Thy wrath and me.’ And when thou hast completed this, say again, ‘Lord, I set the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between Thee and me.’”

• Psalms 84:12: "O LORD of hosts, blessed is the man that trusteth in thee."
• 2 Chronicles 20:20: "...Believe in the LORD your God, so shall ye be established; believe his prophets, so shall ye prosper."
• Luke 18:10-14:"Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.' "But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.' I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God."
• John 3:18: "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son."
• John 6:47: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life."
• John 14:6: "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh to the Father, but by me."
• Romans 4:5: "But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."
• Romans 14:23: "...for whatsoever is not of faith is sin."
• Galatians 5:4,5: "Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith."
• 1 Timothy 1:16 However, for this reason I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might show all longsuffering, as a pattern to those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life.
• Titus 3:5: "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but accordign to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost."

[Scourge of Evil]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

So John founded your Church? Before Jesus died? And when all of Christs followers became Catholic what happened to you guys? Dissappeared until the Anabaptists in 1569?

You Cathlics learn false history. My Pastor saysthe romans was killing all real christians, feeding them to the lions and they had to go into hiding. A lot of them did go to the dark side, but some remained true to jesus.

[Sacred Heart]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

No, I'm not interpreting scripture. The scripture can mean nothing other than what I have stated. Jesus was not made of bread or crackers(in the case of catholics), ergo it is not an interpretation to state that the bread was not actually His body. Nor was His blood, the precious blood that ran through His veins that He spilled for our sins, an alcoholic beverage made from fermented grapes.

But how do you KNOW Remy, that Jesus was indeed not made of crackers and grape juice? Because isn't that what he says? "This is my body" "This is my blood"? You are making an assumption based off of what you already know about humans. You are making an assumption of flesh, and are not taking the Scripture for what it says. You are interpreting it to mean something OTHER than what it says. This is really no big deal, every form of Christianity does it. So why don't you admit to it so we can move on?

I noticed you didn't answer my question. Here it is again: Do you or do you not believe that Jesus was a giant human shaped loaf of bread animated by the power of God?

Of course not.

Even if Jesus was a bread golem with wine blood (which he is definitely not!!!) who cut off His fingers and feed them to the apostles and then bleed into some glasses and had them drink His wine blood it would be the bread and wine that they consumed at that very moment that would be His body. Not some 12 oz box of Animal Crackers and cheap Yellowtail wine you bought from Walmart, you unsufferable dunce.

When he said do this in memory of me, we take that for what it says you see. So we do "this" (meaning changing bread into His body etc) in memory of Him upon His request.

Just a side question, are you going to come to my other thread to discuss pedophilia? I am waiting...

[Meek and Humble]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

When he said do this in memory of me, we take that for what it says you see. So we do "this" (meaning changing bread into His body etc) in memory of Him upon His request.

"This" refers to what Jesus told the Apostles to do - take the bread and eat it. When you gather for a meal, remember Jesus' sacrifice for you.

[WWJDnow]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

But how do you KNOW Remy, that Jesus was indeed not made of crackers and grape juice?

When Mary had a bun in the oven, she didn't literally have a bun in the oven.

So why don't you admit to it so we can move on?

Remy doesn't need your permission to move on. You're a party-line hypocrite who accuses the Pharisees of taking grandiose titles, but when high Catholic officials arrogate far more, and far more grandiose, titles unto themselves you brush it off as "there has to be a head of the Church." So why won't you admit it so we can move on, Sacred Hypocrite?

[Remy Lebeau]

Re: Um... Why is my religion listed as a cult?

But how do you KNOW Remy, that Jesus was indeed not made of crackers and grape juice? Because isn't that what he says? "This is my body" "This is my blood"? You are making an assumption based off of what you already know about humans.

I'm making an assumption about what I already KNOW?

Are you really as stupid as you sound? As I KNOW that Jesus was not a Bread Golem with fermented grape juice for blood, I KNOW that the bread and wine mentioned were not actual pieces of His body. Or perhaps you think all humans are made of bread and wine?

Matthew 1:1-16 tells us that Jesus's physical ancestry. Abraham descended from Noah, as all humans did. So please, spare your pathetic attempts at what I hope is humour. Surely you aren't really as stupid as you sound? You are kidding, right?

I understand that you don't really think I'm interpreting. You are simply insisting as such because you have lost the debate and are reaching. It's typical of pride-filled blowhearts who can't admit when they are wrong. Just so you know, you're making a fool of yourself. But you know that...

When he said do this in memory of me, we take that for what it says you see. So we do "this" (meaning changing bread into His body etc) in memory of Him upon His request.

"And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body. And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." - Matthew 26:26-28

He spoke to the apostles. Not to anyone else.

Oh, and you were saying that the Catholic church has never changed its interpretation of the Bible... So, do they still torture, maim and kill those they deem heretics in Vatican City? Do they stone homosexuals and disobeidient children? Is slavery legal there? Do tell?