[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: Ignorance through God

But that would mean that God would APPROVE of killing fellow Christians, just because they lived in a hostile nation! No loving God would require a man to kill his own brother over politics.

Were you addressing anybody's comment in particular?

And who said God loves everybody? The Bible explains in detail many different sorts of people God hates, including all those who do not follow Him in the ways He commands.

Is it more sinful to violate the law (which violates the Bible) or violate the bible directly?

There is no such thing as "more sinful" in God's eyes. Any sin is sufficient to damn you to an eternity in His Lake of Fire.

[Lycia The Repentant]

Re: Ignorance through God

But that would mean that God would APPROVE of killing fellow Christians, just because they lived in a hostile nation! No loving God would require a man to kill his own brother over politics.

Is it more sinful to violate the law (which violates the Bible) or violate the bible directly?

God isn't JUST a loving God.

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." Isaiah 45:7

And a sin is a sin is a sin. They're all equal.

Except blasphemy. That's the only sin you can't repent from.

[Brother Temperance]

Re: Ignorance through God

But that would mean that God would APPROVE of killing fellow Christians, just because they lived in a hostile nation! No loving God would require a man to kill his own brother over politics.

Do you remember the story of Abraham and Isaac? If God came to you and told you to kill your son, would you go along with what God said, or would you say "No loving God would require a man to kill his own son for no apparent reason" and continue worshipping yourself?

[Ksevio]

Re: Ignorance through God

Or course I wouldn't kill him.
1. God said thou shalt not kill, especially an innocent person like my son.
2. God said not to us humans in sacrafice
3. Killing one's son is not a good thing to do

If you would be willing to kill your own son in ignorance of those reasons, then you are a horrible and sinful person who belongs in the depths of hell.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: Ignorance through God

Or course I wouldn't kill him.
1. God said thou shalt not kill, especially an innocent person like my son.
2. God said not to us humans in sacrafice
3. Killing one's son is not a good thing to do

If you would be willing to kill your own son in ignorance of those reasons, then you are a horrible and sinful person who belongs in the depths of hell.

So, you would disobey a direct order from God because you don't think it's "a good thing to do"?

Say, could you point out exactly where God said not to use humans in sacrifices?

Seriously. You have asserted that God said not to sacrifice humans to Him. Show me where the Bible says it is wrong to sacrifice humans to God.

Then read Judges 11 and tell me again how God condemns human sacrifice. (You can just start at verse 30 if you want to be lazy and not understand Jephthah's backstory.)

[Ksevio]

Re: Ignorance through God

Deuteronomy 18:10: There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
Kings 21:6 And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.

If God wants someone dead, He's certainly powerful enough to make it happen by Himself.

[Viggo B. Kristoffersen]

Re: Ignorance through God

Deuteronomy 18:10: There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
Kings 21:6 And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.

If God wants someone dead, He's certainly powerful enough to make it happen by Himself.

Of course he is. What's your point?

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: Ignorance through God

Deuteronomy 18:10: There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
Kings 21:6 And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.

If God wants someone dead, He's certainly powerful enough to make it happen by Himself.

Yes, He makes millions of unsaved children die of starvation, dysentery, and other treatable conditions each year. What's your point?

What you have referenced, "making son or daughter pass through the fire", is a reference to sacrifices to Ba'al, not to God. It is a sin to sacrifice your children to false gods. That's not the same as God declaring it sinful to sacrifice humans to Him.

Did you read Judges 11, or did you decide to skip that?

[Ksevio]

Re: Ignorance through God

Well the part of the bible where God says not to kill people clearly overrides that.

The 6th command says: Thou shalt not kill
It doesn't say: Though shalt not kill*

*except when you don't like people.

[Seth Campbell]

Re: Ignorance through God

Well the part of the bible where God says not to kill people clearly overrides that.

The 6th command says: Thou shalt not kill
It doesn't say: Though shalt not kill*

*except when you don't like people.

And PeTA claims that "thou shalt not kill" also includes animals.

Funny how if you keep reading, God goes on about a whole bunch of rules that demand the death penalty, usually by public stoning.

Oh, and can you explain where in the Bible it say's one part overrides another part? The only ones I can think of are the very few OT laws that were overwritten in the NT.

[Pastor Isaac Peters]

Re: Ignorance through God

Well the part of the bible where God says not to kill people clearly overrides that.

The 6th command says: Thou shalt not kill
It doesn't say: Though shalt not kill*

*except when you don't like people.

Yes, that's it exactly. That commandment overrides other parts of the Bible, even if those other parts of the Bible came later. When God inspired those other parts of the Bible, He was just inserting filler. That makes way more sense than the alternative explanation, which is that you're just cherry-picking and misreading a few verses.

[MitzaLizalor]

Re: Ignorance through God

Judges 11

Thank-you for reminding us of that passage, Rev. Rodimer.
How imperfect our understanding must seem to a perfect God in the light of His Perfect Love!
And my heart blossomed in the beautiful light of His word, wretch that I am, as I read Judges 11:31 and again as I read verse 32. God must have been so happy with Mr. Jephthah, and so excited by what he was going to do for Him. Nowadays, satan tries to tell us that different things should make us happy, and it is by reading The Bible that we arm ourselves against those demonic attacks.

EPHESIANS 6:11,14-17
11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil
14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God

Judges 11:33 shows us the extent of God's mercy, and His love for those who honour Him.
This passage started with verse 30, and because God knew that Jephthah would keep his word to God, God showed His Beautiful Lovingkindness not only to Jephthah, but through all the ages, even to us.
Naturally his beautiful virgin daughter - an only child - does not deserve a name, but when she came out to meet her father I know how happy she must have been, and how proud of her father, after his great achievement.

JUDGES 11:34 And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child


Satan loves to show us false beauty, and lure us with deceit. But we have been alerted to his wiles through God’s word.
And what a difference there is! Just go to any carnival or mardi gras or other devil infested saturnalia and witness the depravity, the hysteria, the trance states of demonic possession that are marketed in the service of Mammon to utterly destroy our human sensitivities, hardening our hearts with FALSE happiness to the Perfect Love of God.
The Bible tells about TRUE happiness, and brings us God’s Perfect Love.

PSALM 137:9 Happy shall he be that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

II KINGS 15:16 Then Menahem smote Tiphsah, and all that were therein, and the coasts thereof from Tirzah: because they opened not to him, therefore he smote it; and all the women therein that were with child he ripped up.

HOSEA 13:14a I will ransom them from the power of the grave HALLELUJAH!

HOSEA 13:14b I will redeem them from death GLORY!

Satan even tells us that unborn babies are innocent. And people believe him!

HOSEA 13:16 Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up.
PRAISE GOD! PRAISE HIS BEAUTIFUL LOVINGKINDNESS ! !

[Ksevio]

Re: Ignorance through God

Yes, that's it exactly. That commandment overrides other parts of the Bible, even if those other parts of the Bible came later. When God inspired those other parts of the Bible, He was just inserting filler. That makes way more sense than the alternative explanation, which is that you're just cherry-picking and misreading a few verses.

You're cherry-picking just as much by ignoring that parts about not killing (mentioned several times), and following the parts that directly contradict it. It's hard to misinterpret a basic statement like "Thou shalt not kill" but you seem to manage it. Just evidence that the Bible is somewhat out dated for modern society and should not be taken literally.

[Pastor Isaac Peters]

Re: Ignorance through God

You're cherry-picking just as much by ignoring that parts about not killing (mentioned several times), and following the parts that directly contradict it. It's hard to misinterpret a basic statement like "Thou shalt not kill" but you seem to manage it. Just evidence that the Bible is somewhat out dated for modern society and should not be taken literally.

Dear friend:

First, we don't take kindly to people who twist Scripture to make it sound internally contradictory. As has already been explained to you, there is no contradiction.

Second, if the Bible should not be taken literally, how do you know that "Thou shalt not kill" should be taken literally? How do you know which parts to follow and which are not suitable for modern society? What is the test — whether each verse appeals to you?

[Ksevio]

Re: Ignorance through God

I believe the basic laws/commandments stated should be taken literally:

"Thou shalt have none other gods before me."
Obviously should be taken literally - no debate about that, words straight from God.

However a story that has been retold by a writer of one of the books of the Bible maybe should be taken metaphorically.

Leviticus 19:10 And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the LORD your God.

Rather than literally leaving grapes out for the poor, that verse says to help those in need through charity.