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Default Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-05-2007, 02:35 AM

I was just reading for real under the title forum. I sure do understand why Catholics, Wiccans, Santanists, Mormons, and more are false Religions and Cults... But what is wrong about Lutherans?

The only thing I know is they are close to catholism???? Not sure.

Anywho, can someone explain this to my sad humble soul. Thank you.



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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 03:25 AM

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Originally Posted by Seeker View Post

I was just reading for real under the title forum. I sure do understand why Catholics, Wiccans, Santanists, Mormons, and more are false Religions and Cults ... But what is wrong about Lutherans?

The only thing I know is they are close to catholism???? Not sure.

Anywho, can someone explain this to my sad humble soul. Thank you.
AAARRRGGGHH! what's wrong with Lutherans?

They are another false-doctrine-watered-down-euro-fied church of lies, inspired of the devil from the get-go, and they even serve the communion bread and wine, just like cathy-lickers! Oh sure, they dumped the pope and some of the Romanizer nonsense, just like the English church did, but it was still based on the original corruption to begin with, so it didn't succeed and never got the Truth™ of Jesus.

Besides that they are humorless, and boring as HELL, and if you go there, you will go there! (get it, get it?)


1st Timothy 2: 9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;
1st Timothy 2: 10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works ...


1 Timothy 5: 16 If any man or woman that believeth have widows, let them relieve them, and let not the church be charged; that it may relieve them that are widows indeed ...

Proverbs 31: 26 She openeth her mouth with wisdom; and in her tongue is the law of kindness ...
Proverbs 31: 27 She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness ...
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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 03:49 AM

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Originally Posted by Seeker View Post
But what is wrong about Lutherans?
  • Infant baptism
  • Transubstantiation
  • Denial of Eternal Security
  • Anything but KJV
Pastor Billy-Reuben


Upon request I will cite scripture for all these facts in God's Holy Word.

✝ This is a Christian community and we worship GOD of the Holy bible, the only Living GOD. We worship Jesus Christ, Son of GOD and Savior. Anything else is absurd. ✝
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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 03:52 AM

In short, they are just slightly watered down papists. Jesus favors only True Christians™.


Who Will Jesus Damn?

Here is a partial list from just a few scripture verses:

Hypocrites (Matthew 24:51), The Unforgiving (Mark 11:26), Homosexuals (Romans 1:26, 27), Fornicators (Romans 1:29), The Wicked (Romans 1:29), The Covetous (Romans 1:29), The Malicious (Romans 1:29), The Envious (Romans 1:29), Murderers (Romans 1:29), The Deceitful (Romans 1:29), Backbiters (Romans 1:30), Haters of God (Romans 1:30), The Despiteful (Romans 1:30), The Proud (Romans 1:30), Boasters (Romans 1:30), Inventors of evil (Romans 1:30), Disobedient to parents (Romans 1:30), Covenant breakers (Romans 1:31), The Unmerciful (Romans 1:31), The Implacable (Romans 1:31), The Unrighteous (1Corinthians 6:9), Idolaters (1Corinthians 6:9), Adulterers (1Corinthians 6:9), The Effeminate (1Corinthians 6:9), Thieves (1Corinthians 6:10), Drunkards (1Corinthians 6:10), Reviler (1Corinthians 6:10), Extortioners (1Corinthians 6:10), The Fearful (Revelation 21:8), The Unbelieving (Revelation 21:8), The Abominable (Revelation 21:8), Whoremongers (Revelation 21:8), Sorcerers (Revelation 21:8), All Liars (Revelation 21:8)

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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 04:06 AM

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Originally Posted by Pastor Billy-Reuben View Post
  • Infant baptism
  • Transubstantiation
  • Denial of Eternal Security
  • Anything but KJV
Pastor Billy-Reuben
I would say the infant baptism is because all children are born in sin?? Yes we believe that as Christians. But they want to to get the horse inhead of the cart.

What is this....Transubfcvuodufowairpo3 that I have never heard of? Can you explain, Billy?

I thought they did believe in eternal security? I just thought they went through some stupid 12 step program at the age of 12 to get saved?



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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 04:22 AM

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Originally Posted by Seeker View Post

What is this .... Transubfcvuodufowairpo3 that I have never heard of? Can you explain, Billy?
If you don't mind an answer from me, Seeker, the Cathy-lickers believe that when the bread and wine are blessed and the priests pronounce Romanized mumbo-jumbo over it at the altar, the 'elements' become the actual body and blood of Jesus.

That is, they believe the inaninmate bread and wine turn into GOD Himself. Then they eat it and drink it, like cannibals.

That's transubstantiation.


1st Timothy 2: 9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;
1st Timothy 2: 10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works ...


1 Timothy 5: 16 If any man or woman that believeth have widows, let them relieve them, and let not the church be charged; that it may relieve them that are widows indeed ...

Proverbs 31: 26 She openeth her mouth with wisdom; and in her tongue is the law of kindness ...
Proverbs 31: 27 She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness ...
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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-05-2007, 04:32 AM

Seeker: I would say the infant baptism is because all children are born in sin?? Yes we believe that as Christians. But they want to to get the horse inhead of the cart.
All infants are born in sin, but baptism is only for saved believers. You get saved first, then you get baptized.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Repent and be baptized.

Seeker: What is this....Transubfcvuodufowairpo3 that I have never heard of? Can you explain, Billy?
Just like Catholics, they believe that the communion wafer physically becomes Jesus' body, and the wine physically becomes His blood.

Seeker: I thought they did believe in eternal security? I just thought they went through some stupid 12 step program at the age of 12 to get saved?
No. They believe that a person once saved, can fall from grace. According to the Bible, that's just not so.

John 10:28-29:
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Romans 11:29: For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

Pastor Billy-Reuben


Upon request I will cite scripture for all these facts in God's Holy Word.

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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-05-2007, 06:01 AM

The Lutherans deny most of the Bible (KJV1611) with their "sola fide" doctrine.

Those words mean salvation by faith alone.

Friend, this goes against most of the book of James. This also goes against parts of Revelation.

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Jesus HIMSELF said:

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Friend, do you doeth?

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.


The Lutherans, with their "faith alone" "sola fide" stance are hearers only. I pray that you don't fall into their easy trap.

YIC
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-05-2007, 02:56 PM

We've been over this before very recently. It's pretty simple. They ordain women who deny Christ. That's not very Christian.


O Lord our God, help us to tear their soldiers to bloody shreds with our shells; help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, writhing in pain; help us to lay waste their humble homes with a hurricane of fire; help us to wring the hearts of their unoffending widows with unavailing grief; help us to turn them out roofless with little children to wander unfriended the wastes of their desolated land in rags and hunger and thirst, sports of the sun flames of summer and the icy winds of winter, broken in spirit, worn with travail, imploring Thee for the refuge of the grave and denied it--for our sakes who adore Thee, Lord, blast their hopes, blight their lives, protract their bitter pilgrimage, make heavy their steps, water their way with their tears, stain the white snow with the blood of their wounded feet! We ask it, in the spirit of love, of Him Who is the Source of Love, and Who is the ever-faithful refuge and friend of all that are sore beset and seek His aid with humble and contrite hearts. Amen.


God being truth, justice, goodness, beauty, power, and life, man is falsehood, iniquity, evil, ugliness, impotence, and death. God being master, man is the slave. Incapable of finding justice, truth, and eternal life by his own effort, he can attain them only through a divine revelation... he who desires to worship God must harbor no childish illusions about the matter, but bravely renounce his liberty and humanity.
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Default Re: Why are Lutherans a cult - 10-06-2007, 01:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Billy-Reuben View Post
Seeker: I thought they did believe in eternal security? I just thought they went through some stupid 12 step program at the age of 12 to get saved?
No. They believe that a person once saved, can fall from grace. According to the Bible, that's just not so.

John 10:28-29:
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
Romans 11:29: For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

Pastor Billy-Reuben
How right you are, brother. Even more:
To fall from grace - that would require that we start to sin..
And he that sins, he isn't Saved. And never was.

Thus, it's completely impossible for the Saved to fall from grace.

Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not:
Whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1 John 3:6


If thou be wise, thou shalt be wise for thyself: But if thou scornest, thou alone shalt bear it.
A foolish woman is clamorous: She is simple, and knoweth nothing.
Proverbs 9:12-13
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-22-2007, 04:02 PM

Luther did liken the Pope's pronouncements to breaking wind.

But Luther scribbled his own Bible translation in German (ptooie) rather than waiting on the AV 1611 which was done in the heavenly tongue (English).

Melancthon was a compromising homer who wore sissy clothes... and their "pastors" wear dresses to church.

And instead of being independent they huddle in SIN-ods.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-25-2009, 08:51 PM

I found this forum while I was googling online, researching for my paper on the Reformation. Stumbled across this particular thread about Lutherans, and felt that I have to clarify certain things:

(1) We don't follow transubstantiation as a theological doctrine, rather Real Presence/Sacramental Union - where the flesh and blood of Christ is present alongside the bread and wine. It does not turn to his flesh and blood after being blessed, it simply is already part of the sacrament.

People who aren't Lutherans generally tend to generalize and think that we follow the Roman Catholic's Eucharist doctrine, when we don't. Non-Lutherans judge that our doctrine is consubstantiation but most Lutherans reject this.

(2) Infant baptism is done because our parents, as Lutherans, wants us to grow up a believer (certainly, after they swore an oath during our baptism, that our parents are responsible for leading us to live a Christian life, whether or not that's under the Lutheran umbrella). Of course, it remains controversial since we were too young to judge for ourselves and our faith. However, our spiritual journey doesn't end there. Confirmation would be a time in our teens to deepen our faith and learn more about our faith and mature in it. Infant baptism symbolizes that we belong to God and no one else's. It does not mean we're saved.

All in all, I've signed up just to say only this. I feel greatly about my faith, and while I'm not what you call a 'True Christian' - I do believe in God, and I do know that someday my Prince will come. However, I don't call myself a Christian, because I don't want others to judge Christians wrongly in case I do something un-Christian like. I'm still searching for my time to be completely saved, but I guess for you all, being a Lutheran, I'm already damned to hell, aren't I?

But I'm not going to start a trip about how I don't appreciate my faith being listed under a cult, because I know there is no use in starting up a debate as you all have pretty much (with an afternoon of reading around the forum) proved me that there's no room for differences around here. I don't particularly appreciate bigotry, hate, or just plain rudeness so if you have nothing nice to say, just don't.

I posted this because like you, I feel strongly about my faith, and when something said about Lutherans by non-Lutherans need a little fixing, I feel like I have to clear it out. You can take it however you want it, albeit it's probably with bitterness and judgment.

Just to say, Luther wrote his 95 theses in order to criticize the Roman Catholic church because he cared about the need to reform and improving the spiritual lives of his surroundings at the time. I respect Catholics because they, like it or not - pretty much established the idea of an organized church. Yes, we Lutherans have a strong Roman Catholic background, but we were also the ones who kickstarted the Reformation and gave others a chance to branch out to other denominations.

The least you could do is treat the older denominations that were responsible for the existence of your very own church with a little bit of respect, even if you don't agree on what we teach or believe in.

But I think even that is asking a bit too much.

Go ahead, condemn me and my kind to eternal damnation. I don't really care because you're not the one who will judge me later on. The God I know is a loving, merciful, and forgiving God. You've managed to make Jesus sound like a Nazi. I can't believe that people who actually love Jesus this much can be filled with so much hatred.

That's pretty much all.

Cheers.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-25-2009, 09:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dieuepargne View Post
I [...]felt that I have to clarify certain things:
You needn't hve bothered.

Quote:
(1) We don't follow transubstantiation as a theological doctrine, rather Real Presence/Sacramental Union - where the flesh and blood of Christ is present alongside the bread and wine. It does not turn to his flesh and blood after being blessed, it simply is already part of the sacrament.
Garbage, sounds like the difference between being hanged by a new rope and an old one. It is symbolic - read your bible... wait, no.. read KJV1611

Quote:
(2) Infant baptism is done because our parents, as Lutherans, wants us to grow up a believer (certainly, after they swore an oath during our baptism, that our parents are responsible for leading us to live a Christian life, whether or not that's under the Lutheran umbrella).
Do you see any missing logic here?
Quote:
Of course, it remains controversial since we were too young to judge for ourselves and our faith.
Ah! You do, but the word you are looking for is not "contraversial" it is "garbage" and ooga-booga superstitiuos mumbo-jumbo.
Quote:
However, our spiritual journey doesn't end there. Confirmation would be a time in our teens to deepen our faith and learn more about our faith and mature in it.
OK, so why don't you wait and get baptized then?
Quote:
Infant baptism symbolizes that we belong to God and no one else's. It does not mean we're saved.
Symbolizes!? It does nothing -zilch - denada if you don't understand it, you may as well bread a plate over the child's head for all the good it does.

Quote:
I do believe in God, and I do know that someday my Prince will come. [...]
That's enough! "Some Day My Prince Will Come"??? You compare the Second Coming to a vile Disney film about a single woman living with retarded midgets without being married to any of them. You make me sick to my soul!






“We must reassert that the essence of Christianity is the love of obedience to God’s Laws and that how that complete obedience is used or implemented does not concern us.”

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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 10-28-2009, 11:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dieuepargne View Post
I don't particularly appreciate bigotry, hate, or just plain rudeness so if you have nothing nice to say, just don't.
Are you sure you're a Lutheran?

I heard that Martin Luther was in favor of taking away the property of Jews and forcing them into slave labor. Some people would consider that hate and bigotry and just plain rude.

I guess Lutherans don't!


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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-26-2009, 10:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzard View Post
Luther did liken the Pope's pronouncements to breaking wind.

But Luther scribbled his own Bible translation in German (ptooie) rather than waiting on the AV 1611 which was done in the heavenly tongue (English).
He transcribed the Bible to German so that the people of his country could read and understand the Bible for themselves and be able to chose which church they belonged to based on what the Bible said and not what people were telling them.

Quote:
We've been over this before very recently. It's pretty simple. They ordain women who deny Christ. That's not very Christian.
Not all denominations ordain women. The denomination I am in doesn't. Nor does my denomination allow gays to be pastors.

Quote:
To fall from grace - that would require that we start to sin..
And he that sins, he isn't Saved. And never was.
So you believe that you never sin? I'm a bit confused by that, sorry.

Quote:
Are you sure you're a Lutheran?

I heard that Martin Luther was in favor of taking away the property of Jews and forcing them into slave labor. Some people would consider that hate and bigotry and just plain rude.

I guess Lutherans don't!
Nope. We don't believe that. I've never saw where Martin Luther did either, but I'm not claiming to know everything that Martin Luther thought.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-27-2009, 05:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heathen_Basher View Post
I'm glad to see that at least you know that women aren't good enough to be ordained and that homosexuality is an abomination

Once a person is saved, they can never sin again. If they do, they were never saved in the first place. The Bible teaches us:

1 John 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not. 1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.
3 John 11 He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luther_and_antisemitism

[/URL]
That's really interesting. I guess I've never heard about the antisemitism part before though because we don't practice it anymore. I'm guessing we changed that sometime.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-28-2009, 04:48 AM

With the posting of his 95 feces to the door, Luther established his own personality cult.

While, in principle, I applaud folks who aggravate the Papal Abomination, I must nevertheless insist that they conform to Landoverian KJV1611 Biblical Truth when they do it.


Jud 1:15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are unGodly among them of all their unGodly deeds which they have unGodly committed, and of all their hard [speeches] which unGodly sinners have spoken against him.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-28-2009, 07:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportzgrl33 View Post
That's really interesting. I guess I've never heard about the antisemitism part before though because we don't practice it anymore. I'm guessing we changed that sometime.
Any religion that needs to be changed was probably broken in the first place. God's true word is perfect and eternal.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-28-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportzgrl33 View Post
That's really interesting. I guess I've never heard about the antisemitism part before though because we don't practice it anymore. I'm guessing we changed that sometime.
So you don't even follow your own prophet?

That means you're a FALSE Lutheran as well as a FALSE Christian.


Holbein

1st Corinthians 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
1st Corinthians 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
1st Corinthians 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
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Default Re: Why Lutherans are a cult - 12-28-2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dieuepargne View Post
(2) Infant baptism is done because our parents, as Lutherans, wants us to grow up a believer (certainly, after they swore an oath during our baptism, that our parents are responsible for leading us to live a Christian life, whether or not that's under the Lutheran umbrella). Of course, it remains controversial since we were too young to judge for ourselves and our faith. However, our spiritual journey doesn't end there. Confirmation would be a time in our teens to deepen our faith and learn more about our faith and mature in it. Infant baptism symbolizes that we belong to God and no one else's. It does not mean we're saved.
Am I to believe your faith's baptism does not mean you are saved? That is the first time I have ever heard such a bold statement completely contradicting a relationship with God.

When the child is old enough to make his own mind up he has a second go at it?

That is NOT the way it is to be done!

Ephesians 4:5
One Lord, one faith, one baptism.

Baptism is when you and God make a joint and binding covenant that you are a True Christian™ and repent your worldly ways.

Acts 19:4
Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

If something this basic and easy escapes you - something we teach our children at grade school age because it is so easy to grasp - then perhaps you need to reconsider the road you are on, the vehicle you are driving, and the very tires you are using to adhere to that road.

What path are you truly on brother?

-ND
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