[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

wow you think your perfect? i thought only god and jesus were perfect...so now your saying your god? haha i believe your going to hell for saying that

Friend, he who abides in Jesus Christ is made sinfree (as 1 John 3:5-9 says). We are washed clean of sin in His blood. Shout GLORY!

[Booger]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

True Christians are perfect if you actually bother to read the Bible.

yea thats saying your perfect...lol

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

yea thats saying your perfect...lol

The Holy Bible says what it says. Do you presume to know more than God?

[Booger]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

are you seriously proud in yourself for how you berate others? doesnt that mean your damned to hell? and your no stud either buddy...you look like a cancer patient...have fun with your naive thoughts

thats funny looking

[Pastor Isaac Peters]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

are you seriously proud in yourself for how you berate others? doesnt that mean your damned to hell? (ad hominem arguments snipped)

I have a fun new idea. Maybe you can read the Bible verses that have been cited to you and find out.

[epignosis]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

Matthew 7:1-5 Explained
The so-called "prohibition against judging"

Again, I must point reiterate, nowhere in the Bible does it tell us not to judge. Period. I hope this exegesis of Matthew 7:1-5 has been enlightening for you and and you will refrain from looking like an idiot in the future by claiming that "Jesus said we can't judge others".

Yours in Christ,

Rev. Jim Osborne

James 4:12 (King James Version)

12There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Romans 14:4 (King James Version)

4Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.


Matthew 7:1-5 (King James Version)

Matthew 7

1Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

3And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

4Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

We have to be very careful , when it comes to judging others. Because in the end it comes to God doing the judging, and it may be found that our judging maybe actually against God.

[Zechariah Smyth]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

James 4:12 (King James Version)

12There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Romans 14:4 (King James Version)

4Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.


Matthew 7:1-5 (King James Version)

Matthew 7

1Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

3And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

4Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

We have to be very careful , when it comes to judging others. Because in the end it comes to God doing the judging, and it may be found that our judging maybe actually against God.

Yup, lots of folks cherry-pick those verses, and totally neglect some like this:

(Leviticus 19:15) "Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour."

and

(John 7:24) "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."

Etc. etc.

Friend, you appear to have a passing familiarity with the Bible, or at least some reasonably decent internets skills, but in order to gain entrance to Heaven you must accept the WHOLE Bible.

(Deuteronomy 4:2) "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you."



Yours in Christ,

Z. Smyth

[epignosis]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

Yup, lots of folks cherry-pick those verses, and totally neglect some like this:

(Leviticus 19:15) "Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour."

and

(John 7:24) "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."

Etc. etc.

Friend, you appear to have a passing familiarity with the Bible, or at least some reasonably decent internets skills, but in order to gain entrance to Heaven you must accept the WHOLE Bible.

(Deuteronomy 4:2) "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you."



Yours in Christ,

Z. Smyth

The scriptures I mentioned are also in the bible, just as the ones you brought up. So, is this a contradiction of the bible it'self, or is it to be understood a different way? What I mean, is there deeper understanding to this?
If you took the scriptures I quoted and the ones you quoted literately or a least at face value you would have a contradiction of the scriptures. One side saying do not judge and other side saying it is OK to judge.
So are you saying Matthew 7:1-5 is not correct? Or is inaccurate?

Matthew 7:1–5
aJudge not, bthat ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and cwith what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, dfirst cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

The scriptures I mentioned are also in the bible, just as the ones you brought up. So, is this a contradiction of the bible it'self, or is it to be understood a different way? What I mean, is there deeper understanding to this?
If you took the scriptures I quoted and the ones you quoted literately or a least at face value you would have a contradiction of the scriptures. One side saying do not judge and other side saying it is OK to judge.
So are you saying Matthew 7:1-5 is not correct? Or is inaccurate?

Matthew 7:1–5
aJudge not, bthat ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and cwith what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, dfirst cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

Matthew 7 is only if you are judging hypocritically. It would be like me having an affair on my wife while judging you for doing the same.

It's something you have to be careful of.

[epignosis]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

Matthew 7 is only if you are judging hypocritically. It would be like me having an affair on my wife while judging you for doing the same.

It's something you have to be careful of.

There are many ways to judge ones, hypocritically. It doesn't mean it has to be the same sin.

[Jedediah]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

There are many ways to judge ones, hypocritically. It doesn't mean it has to be the same sin.

That's why when True Christians(tm) judge others, there is no hypocrisy. Sin is a thing of the past for us.

I John 3:6-9
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We've already been over this. Did you bother to read the thread to see if your concerns had already been addressed before posting?

[epignosis]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

That's why when True Christians™ judge others, there is no hypocrisy. Sin is a thing of the past for us.

I John 3:6-9
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We've already been over this. Did you bother to read the thread to see if your concerns had already been addressed before posting?

Yes I did read the rest of this thread, that is why I really felt the need to comment on this.

Romans 5:12 (King James Version)

12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

To say that we are perfect, is actually a contradiction of this scripture.
Adam and Eve had a direct relationship with God. But we need Jesus as a mediator.

1 Timothy 2:5-6 (King James Version)

5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

6Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

To say were are perfect denies what Jesus died for.

[epignosis]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

I would like to add a few more comments on this 'perfection'

1 Kings 8:46-48 (King James Version)

46If they sin against thee, (for there is no man that sinneth not,) and thou be angry with them, and deliver them to the enemy, so that they carry them away captives unto the land of the enemy, far or near;


Proverbs 20:9 (King James Version)

9Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

These scriptures say that all men are sinners.



I John 3:6-9 (KJV)
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 3:6-9 (New Living Translation)

6 Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is.

7 Dear children, don’t let anyone deceive you about this: When people do what is right, it shows that they are righteous, even as Christ is righteous. 8 But when people keep on sinning, it shows that they belong to the devil, who has been sinning since the beginning. But the Son of God came to destroy the works of the devil. 9 Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life[a] is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God.

Do you see in this scripture that it is the practice of sin that is evil. And it is our not practising sin any more that we are counted as righteous. It doesn't mean we are perfect, or sinless.
The KJV doesn't give the full meaning to this verse.


1 John 5:18 (King James Version)

18We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.


1 John 5:18 (Amplified Bible)

18We know [absolutely] that anyone born of God does not [deliberately and knowingly] practice committing sin, but the One Who was begotten of God carefully watches over and protects him [Christ's divine presence within him preserves him against the evil], and the wicked one does not lay hold (get a grip) on him or touch [him].


1 John 5:18 (New Living Translation)

18 We know that God’s children do not make a practice of sinning, for God’s Son holds them securely, and the evil one cannot touch them.

I added some other translations of the verse in 1 John 5:18.
The KJV is not very good with this verse. The other translations give a better understanding. It is not that we are perfect or sinless, but that we strive not to practice sin any more. That is how God counts us righteous or perfect. But we are not righteous or perfect like Jesus was, as a man.

[True Disciple]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

Yes I did read the rest of this thread, that is why I really felt the need to comment on this.

Romans 5:12 (King James Version)

12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

To say that we are perfect, is actually a contradiction of this scripture.
Adam and Eve had a direct relationship with God. But we need Jesus as a mediator.

Friend, you shouldn't take Scripture out of context. If you had read further, you would have come across this Verse:

Romans 5:19:
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Romans 5:12 teaches that all have sinned, as it is explaining the nature of sin, and the forgiveness of sins because of Jesus' atoning Blood shed on the cross.

It then continues to explain that, as we all sin because of Adam's original sin, we are now made righteous by Jesus' sacrifice, effectively undoing Adam's transgression. This is why True Christians™ are without sin:

1 John 3:9:
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 5:18:
We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

1 Timothy 2:5-6 (King James Version)

5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

6Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

To say were are perfect denies what Jesus died for.

Nonsense. We are made perfect by Jesus' blood:

Colossians 1:21-22:
And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight

So in fact the opposite is true: to say we aren't perfect is to deny that Jesus died for us.

I would like to add a few more comments on this 'perfection'

1 Kings 8:46-48 (King James Version)

46If they sin against thee, (for there is no man that sinneth not,) and thou be angry with them, and deliver them to the enemy, so that they carry them away captives unto the land of the enemy, far or near;

Again, this was written before Jesus died for our sins. Back then, there indeed were no sin-free persons.

Of course, there is also a difference between never sinning and being sin-free. We are not sin-free because we never sinned; we are sin-free because Jesus died for our sins.

Proverbs 20:9 (King James Version)

9Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

These scriptures say that all men are sinners.

You rather clumsily misinterpret this Passage. It doesn't say that all people are in sin, it says that no person can make his heart clean himself. Only Jesus can do that.

I John 3:6-9 (KJV)
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 3:6-9 (New Living Translation)

6 Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is.

7 Dear children, don’t let anyone deceive you about this: When people do what is right, it shows that they are righteous, even as Christ is righteous. 8 But when people keep on sinning, it shows that they belong to the devil, who has been sinning since the beginning. But the Son of God came to destroy the works of the devil. 9 Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life[a] is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God.

Do you see in this scripture that it is the practice of sin that is evil. And it is our not practising sin any more that we are counted as righteous. It doesn't mean we are perfect, or sinless.
The KJV doesn't give the full meaning to this verse.

1 John 5:18 (King James Version)

18We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

1 John 5:18 (Amplified Bible)

18We know [absolutely] that anyone born of God does not [deliberately and knowingly] practice committing sin, but the One Who was begotten of God carefully watches over and protects him [Christ's divine presence within him preserves him against the evil], and the wicked one does not lay hold (get a grip) on him or touch [him].

1 John 5:18 (New Living Translation)

18 We know that God’s children do not make a practice of sinning, for God’s Son holds them securely, and the evil one cannot touch them.

I added some other translations of the verse in 1 John 5:18.
The KJV is not very good with this verse. The other translations give a better understanding. It is not that we are perfect or sinless, but that we strive not to practice sin any more. That is how God counts us righteous or perfect. But we are not righteous or perfect like Jesus was, as a man.

Friend, the NLT is a modern corruption of God's Word. We only follow the KJV here, and if the KJV says: "True Christians cannot sin," then True Christians cannot sin.

And even if you look at the "original Greek," then the NLT translation is not supported, as the words translated as "doth not commit sin" are hamartian ou poiei. Hamartia means "sin," in the Bible it is used many times, like here:

Matthew 26:28:
For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. (hamartia)

I would think it means "sin" here, wouldn't you?

Ou means "not," poieo means "to do." So, hamartian ou poiei means "does not commit sins." The "making a practice of," "deliberately and knowingly" and "strive not to" parts of the NLT aren't supported anywhere by the original Greek text, and were just made up at the spot to twist Scripture to make it deny the sin-free state of True Christians™.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: The Most MISUNDERSTOOD Passage in All the Bible (Matthew 7:1-

Friend, the NLT is a modern corruption of God's Word. We only follow the KJV here, and if the KJV says: "True Christians cannot sin," then True Christians cannot sin.

Amen, brother. The NLT is even worse than the NIV in most ways.

From here
The New Living Translation used translators from a variety of denominations. The methodology combined an attempt to translate the original texts simply and literally with a dynamic equivalence synergy approach used to convey the thoughts behind the text where a literal translation may have been difficult to understand or even misleading to modern readers. It has been suggested that this "thought-for-thought" methodology, while making the translation easier to understand, is less accurate than a literal (formal equivalence) method, and thus the New Living Translation may not be suitable for those wishing to undertake detailed study of the Bible.

They admit that they are not translating the Word accurately. Then, they even admit to picking and choosing which manuscript said the closest to what they wanted it to say. These charlatans went so far as to even use the Latin Vulgate when it suited their fancy.