[Cranky Old Man]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

Because life doesn't work that way, guy.

Of course it does, it is how God created everything. The Bible is the ultimate manual to life.

[Jesus is Lord]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

Because life doesn't work that way, guy. You jelly of women.

We're what of women? Jelly? What kind of jelly, grape?

But I ROFL every some dumbass spouts some racist shit on this forum.
Like its be down w/ Jesus and co. but phobias are so totally uncool.

Please let a pastor know about any racism on this site. Racism is strictly forbidden on this board.

[Harbinger]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

Of course it does, it is how God created everything. The Bible is the ultimate manual to life.

That, unkind sir, is YOUR opinion. Get some concrete facts that state aside from the bible that state your "facts"
MASS EFFECT 2 FTW!!!

[James Hutchins]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

That, unkind sir, is YOUR opinion. Get some concrete facts that state aside from the bible that state your "facts"
MASS EFFECT 2 FTW!!!

Wow, you told us!

Ok everyone, we were wrong, Christianity is a mistake, stack the Bibles here, close down the Churches.

Grow up.

[Nobar King]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

This should keep her busy:

[Bobby-Joe]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

That, unkind sir, is YOUR opinion. Get some concrete facts that state aside from the bible that state your "facts"
MASS EFFECT 2 FTW!!!

Were do "facts" come into moral, ethics and life philosophy? Are you one of those secularist who want society run by cold science? Would you prefer we practice eugenics kill the weak and ill?

If you haven't been paying attention to the world outside you window while you play with game pad like the basement dwelling luzer you are nature is a might cold place were its eat or be eaten. Is that what you want morality based on?

[.BORN.]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

By keeping them at home during elections men can select a real president like Sarah Palin

You have gravely mis-stated here, brother.

1 Timothy 2:12 clearly says:
I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet.

Sarah Palin cannot be President, it is against God's wishes.

[NMeier]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

I think you all need to read this because I've read through several threads and noticed a trend in that most all of the scripture referenced is taken out of context and misused or misinterpreted... I do hope you'll hear me out. I'll start from the top and show how each one of these references is taken out of context or misused.

Let's start with 1st Timothy 2: 11-12 -"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

First, lets remember this book is written by Paul to Timothy firstly as a warning against false teachings within the church. We also find instructions pertaining to administration and worship within the church. This reference is taken dreadfully out of context. Now lets have an English lesson now I'm using a today's English version of the bible because that's what i have available at the moment, but the word changes are minor. The topic sentence of the paragraph that includes 1 Tim. 2:11-12 is 1 Tim. 2:8-"In every church service I want men to pray, men who are dedicated to God and can lift up their hands in prayer without anger or argument." The passage continues: 1 Tim. 2:9-10-"I also want the women to be modest and sensible about their clothes and dress properly; not with fancy hair styles or with gold ornaments or pearls or expensive dresses, but with good deeds, as is proper for women who claim to be religious." Here begins 1 Tim. 2:11-12, now obviously Paul has been talking about worship through the entire passage and, "COM" as he is referred to as, expects me to believe that Paul suddenly went on a tangent and was talking about how women shouldn't be aloud to teach or have any position of authority over men. As we have seen this is taken woefully out of context and is referring to women in the church women should not be pastors or hold positions of authority in the church. This passage is referring to church services NOT NORMAL WORKING JOBS.

Lets move on to his next reference, shall we? I believe it was Mark 7:8-"For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do." Here is the entire passage leading up to this verse from the King James Version online bible:


1 Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem. 2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault. 3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash [their] hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders. 4 And [when they come] from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, [as] the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables. 5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands? 6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with [their] lips, but their heart is far from me. 7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men. "For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do."

This passage talks about Jesus' disciples eating bread with "unclean" hands, they had not washed them in the way the Pharisee's prescribed. The Pharisee's had taken their law and placed it above the law of God and Jesus calls them hypocrites for it quoting a prophecy of Isaiah. Jesus continues saying that the Pharisee's are teaching the laws of man in place of the doctrines from God. Verse 8 is Jesus telling about how they have laid aside God's commands and held to their own traditions-washing pots and cups and other things in the "proper" way. This verse has absolutely nothing to do with men doing jobs better then women whatsoever.

The next quote our friend makes is from the book of Deuteronomy. Deu. 22:5-"The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God."

This verse is simple old testament law surprisingly not taken out of context as all context around the verse is several other laws. However, as the military does not discriminate against race or gender uniforms do not pertain to one gender over the other... This verse is woefully misused in the context our friend "COM" has put it into.

The next biblical reference "COM" makes is Isaiah 3:12- "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths."

Before we start on this reference lets all agree on something: Isaiah is a book of prophecy it is not like proverbs which contains some useful words and phrases that people may or may not choose to live by. Let's put the verse in its context:
1 For, behold, the Lord, the LORD of hosts, doth take away from Jerusalem and from Judah the stay and the staff, the whole stay of bread, and the whole stay of water, 2 The mighty man, and the man of war, the judge, and the prophet, and the prudent, and the ancient, 3 The captain of fifty, and the honourable man, and the counsellor, and the cunning artificer, and the eloquent orator. 4 And I will give children [to be] their princes, and babes shall rule over them. 5 And the people shall be oppressed, every one by another, and every one by his neighbour: the child shall behave himself proudly against the ancient, and the base against the honourable. 6 When a man shall take hold of his brother of the house of his father, [saying], Thou hast clothing, be thou our ruler, and [let] this ruin [be] under thy hand: 7 In that day shall he swear, saying, I will not be an healer; for in my house [is] neither bread nor clothing: make me not a ruler of the people. 8 For Jerusalem is ruined, and Judah is fallen: because their tongue and their doings [are] against the LORD, to provoke the eyes of his glory. 9The shew of their countenance doth witness against them; and they declare their sin as Sodom, they hide [it] not. Woe unto their soul! for they have rewarded evil unto themselves. 10 Say ye to the righteous, that [it shall be] well [with him]: for they shall eat the fruit of their doings. 11 Woe unto the wicked! [it shall be] ill [with him]: for the reward of his hands shall be given him. "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths."

Now in the very first verse of this passage it mentions that God will take something away from Jerusalem and Judah, so we know this prophecy is about Jerusalem and Judah. We also know that this is Old Testament prophecy. We know that this prophecy is fulfilled through Christ and his perfect life on earth. Also this prophecy has nothing to do with today or America for that matter it was made about another country in a different time period. This verse does NOT mean that women will destroy our paths today. This verse is about Jerusalem not America and does not have anything to do with women and their right to vote.

Next we have Genesis 3:16- "Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."

While it is true God created woman to serve man, nowhere in the bible does it say it is the woman's job to server her husband 24/7 and wait on him hand and foot. Also we must remember this is Old Testament as well Jesus took the punishment for our sins and was the ultimate sacrifice fulfilling all OT laws perfectly. Here is a better idea of what christian marriage should be from 1 Peter 3:1-7:
1 Likewise, ye wives, [be] in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; 2 While they behold your chaste conversation [coupled] with fear. 3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward [adorning] of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; 4But [let it be] the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, [even the ornament] of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. 5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands: 6 Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement. 7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with [them] according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.

CONCLUSION
I hope this has been a very informative post and that you will all forgive "COM" for his mistake. It is very common to misuse, misinterpret, or take the bible out of context. If you think I have misused or taken scripture out of context in this post call me out on it I will take some time and fix whatever you believe I have taken out of context or misused. Good luck, stay safe, and remember, John 3:16.

[Levi Jones]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

I think you all need to read this because I've read through several threads and noticed a trend in that most all of the scripture referenced is taken out of context and misused or misinterpreted... I do hope you'll hear me out. I'll start from the top and show how each one of these references is taken out of context or misused.

Let's start with 1st Timothy 2: 11-12 -"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

First, lets remember this book is written by Paul to Timothy firstly as a warning against false teachings within the church. We also find instructions pertaining to administration and worship within the church. This reference is taken dreadfully out of context. Now lets have an English lesson now I'm using a today's English version of the bible because that's what i have available at the moment, but the word changes are minor. The topic sentence of the paragraph that includes 1 Tim. 2:11-12 is 1 Tim. 2:8-"In every church service I want men to pray, men who are dedicated to God and can lift up their hands in prayer without anger or argument."

Here is your first either misreading or outright lie. Using the New American Standard Bible,

1 Timothy 2:8 Therefore I want the men in every place to pray, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and dissension.

KJV

8I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.

Young's Literal

8I wish, therefore, that men pray in every place, lifting up kind hands, apart from anger and reasoning;

English Standard Version.

8 I desire then that in every place the men should pray,

Let's go on from there.

13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

Wait, according to your logic, she should be having babies in the church, since it only applies to within the church.

[NMeier]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

Here is your first either misreading or outright lie. Using the New American Standard Bible,

1 Timothy 2:8 Therefore I want the men in every place to pray, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and dissension.

KJV

8I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.

Young's Literal

8I wish, therefore, that men pray in every place, lifting up kind hands, apart from anger and reasoning;

English Standard Version.

8 I desire then that in every place the men should pray,

Let's go on from there.

13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

Wait, according to your logic, she should be having babies in the church, since it only applies to within the church.

I think you misread the version its literally called Today's English Version its copyrighted in 1992 and I fail to see your argument could you please be more explanatory?

[Levi Jones]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

The next biblical reference "COM" makes is Isaiah 3:12- "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths."

Before we start on this reference lets all agree on something: Isaiah is a book of prophecy it is not like proverbs which contains some useful words and phrases that people may or may not choose to live by. Let's put the verse in its context:
1 For, behold, the Lord, the LORD of hosts, doth take away from Jerusalem and from Judah the stay and the staff, the whole stay of bread, and the whole stay of water, 2 The mighty man, and the man of war, the judge, and the prophet, and the prudent, and the ancient, 3 The captain of fifty, and the honourable man, and the counsellor, and the cunning artificer, and the eloquent orator. 4 And I will give children [to be] their princes, and babes shall rule over them. 5 And the people shall be oppressed, every one by another, and every one by his neighbour: the child shall behave himself proudly against the ancient, and the base against the honourable. 6 When a man shall take hold of his brother of the house of his father, [saying], Thou hast clothing, be thou our ruler, and [let] this ruin [be] under thy hand: 7 In that day shall he swear, saying, I will not be an healer; for in my house [is] neither bread nor clothing: make me not a ruler of the people. 8 For Jerusalem is ruined, and Judah is fallen: because their tongue and their doings [are] against the LORD, to provoke the eyes of his glory. 9The shew of their countenance doth witness against them; and they declare their sin as Sodom, they hide [it] not. Woe unto their soul! for they have rewarded evil unto themselves. 10 Say ye to the righteous, that [it shall be] well [with him]: for they shall eat the fruit of their doings. 11 Woe unto the wicked! [it shall be] ill [with him]: for the reward of his hands shall be given him. "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths."

Now in the very first verse of this passage it mentions that God will take something away from Jerusalem and Judah, so we know this prophecy is about Jerusalem and Judah. We also know that this is Old Testament prophecy. We know that this prophecy is fulfilled through Christ and his perfect life on earth. Also this prophecy has nothing to do with today or America for that matter it was made about another country in a different time period. This verse does NOT mean that women will destroy our paths today.

It clearly does state that having the women rule over them is a very bad thing. The reference works today as well as then.

Next we have Genesis 3:16- "Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."

While it is true God created woman to serve man, nowhere in the bible does it say it is the woman's job to server her husband 24/7 and wait on him hand and foot. Also we must remember this is Old Testament as well Jesus took the punishment for our sins and was the ultimate sacrifice fulfilling all OT laws perfectly.

Does this sound like all is forgiven?

13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

[Levi Jones]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

I think you misread the version its literally called Today's English Version its copyrighted in 1992 and I fail to see your argument could you please be more explanatory?

I'm telling you, you have a fluffy bunny false version. I showed you four different versions of the Bible that say everywhere and not just in the church.

Also, it says that women will be saved in child bearing. How could that apply to only within the Church?

15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.


By your logic, Paul would have just gone off on an unrelated tangent.

[NMeier]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

It clearly does state that having the women rule over them is a very bad thing. The reference works today as well as then.


[/COLOR][/FONT]
Does this sound like all is forgiven?

13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

Actually, Isaiah is specifically talking about that time period it does not apply to today because today is not then =)

second u forget that genesis is long before Christ comes so using that verse to say " does this sound like all is forgiven" does not work since Jesus came and died long after that.

[Levi Jones]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

Actually, Isaiah is specifically talking about that time period it does not apply to today because today is not then =)

Of course it applies. Isaiah was appalled then as he would be now. Because they are God's rules.

second u forget that genesis is long before Christ comes so using that verse to say " does this sound like all is forgiven" does not work since Jesus came and died long after that.

I was quoting from 1 Timothy 2 not Genesis. Maybe you have heard somewhere that Paul came after Jesus?

11Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

[NMeier]

Re: WOMEN should NEVER be allowed to leave the house!

I'm telling you, you have a fluffy bunny false version. I showed you four different versions of the Bible that say everywhere and not just in the church.

Also, it says that women will be saved in child bearing. How could that apply to only within the Church?

15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.


By your logic, Paul would have just gone off on an unrelated tangent.

Thank you for explaining yourself more now i can disprove it =D.
All those versions refer to worship as they all call for men to pray everywhere so we cannot apply it outside worship also where in that reference does it say women have to give birth inside a church...