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  • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

    Originally posted by JustPassingBy View Post
    I see.
    I am familiar with the Bible - basic cultural knowledge. I haven't read all of the evangelical texts in their original form (I don't mean in aramaic or hebrew - by "original form" I simply mean that in a language that I understand, but translated as close to possible to the original).

    Incidentally, do you believe that scripture can be translated, while effectively preserving its true meaning, at all? I mean, if the original would transcend humanity, being put together by a perfect being (which would be God) , then every successive interpretation by a human (i.e. a translator) would necessarily deviate further and further away from the original?
    Also, out of curiosity, if you would imagine a perfect being, then wouldn't that also imply that your mind is perfect, thereby proving that God lives inside you? Or conversely, if you would assert that your mind is not perfect, but you have an image of God in it (your mind), therefore God also is not perfect?

    Another question I have concerns context. Most of the Abrahamic scripture is quite old, isn't it (even thousands of years, in some cases)? People obviously lived differently, had different values, beliefs, the whole world was very different during those times. How can one therefore take a literal interpretation of holy scripture during modern times? And if one doesn't take the whole text literally, how does one choose?

    I took the time and read through many quotes (from scripture) that have been posted on this forum and I see where you are coming from - you seem to follow that scripture quite literally, while also extrapolating from it quite a lot. I don't have enough context in the sense to know whether you're also omitting to follow some other parts of scripture (I suggest you are - which would bring me back to my previous question; how do you choose). The extrapolation also raises the question (see the second paragraph) again - if God gave you scripture to follow, why would you interpret it in your own way? And if you do, where to stop, how far do you know you're allowed to go in the extrapolation process?

    Lastly, you are obviously very sure that your way of life, your religion, your interpretation of God is correct. How have you come to that realization? Is it some kind of intuition? Have you seen God (if so, how does a perfect being look like?)? What convinces you that you are on the right path, apart from dogma or tradition?

    I understand that I off-loaded quite a few questions here. I would think of a hundred more.
    I would really appreciate if some of you could find the time to answer any of them. And please, think of me as a lost soul as opposed to a heathen or something like that - I'm simply curious and am not looking for conflict.
    If the KJV(1611) was not THE definitive Bible don't you think that Jesus would have corrected it?

    Or are you saying that the One who made all of creation cannot use spiritual Tippex(r)?

    YIC
    1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

    Revelation 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

    Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

    Comment


    • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

      Originally posted by JustPassingBy View Post
      I see.
      I am familiar with the Bible - basic cultural knowledge. I haven't read all of the evangelical texts in their original form (I don't mean in aramaic or hebrew - by "original form" I simply mean that in a language that I understand, but translated as close to possible to the original).

      Incidentally, do you believe that scripture can be translated, while effectively preserving its true meaning, at all? I mean, if the original would transcend humanity, being put together by a perfect being (which would be God) , then every successive interpretation by a human (i.e. a translator) would necessarily deviate further and further away from the original?
      Depends. If the translator is inspired by God (like it is the case with the KJV Bible), then the transpation is Perfect®.

      Also - if you think that all translations are imperfect, why do people even bother translating books? If the only language and culture a person can understand is the one we were born into, why do some people bother learning foreign languages and traveling abroad?

      Also, out of curiosity, if you would imagine a perfect being, then wouldn't that also imply that your mind is perfect, thereby proving that God lives inside you? Or conversely, if you would assert that your mind is not perfect, but you have an image of God in it (your mind), therefore God also is not perfect?
      True Christians™ are perfect. (See the link in my signature?)

      Another question I have concerns context. Most of the Abrahamic scripture is quite old, isn't it (even thousands of years, in some cases)? People obviously lived differently, had different values, beliefs, the whole world was very different during those times. How can one therefore take a literal interpretation of holy scripture during modern times?
      Are you implying that God given morality is somehow relative?

      And if one doesn't take the whole text literally, how does one choose?
      Either you take the whole Scripture literally, or you burn in Hell forever. Period.

      I took the time and read through many quotes (from scripture) that have been posted on this forum and I see where you are coming from - you seem to follow that scripture quite literally, while also extrapolating from it quite a lot.
      We don't extrapolate. We take the Bible as is.

      I don't have enough context in the sense to know whether you're also omitting to follow some other parts of scripture (I suggest you are - which would bring me back to my previous question; how do you choose).
      Show us an instance when you think we are cherry picking, and we'll prove you wrong.

      The extrapolation also raises the question (see the second paragraph) again - if God gave you scripture to follow, why would you interpret it in your own way?
      We don't.

      And if you do, where to stop, how far do you know you're allowed to go in the extrapolation process?
      2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

      Lastly, you are obviously very sure that your way of life, your religion, your interpretation of God is correct. How have you come to that realization? Is it some kind of intuition?
      No. We just read the Bible. it's all there.

      Have you seen God (if so, how does a perfect being look like?)?
      John 20:29. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

      What convinces you that you are on the right path, apart from dogma or tradition?
      Because we have Jesus' own words to prove that we are on the right path.
      God created fossils to test our faith.

      * * *

      My favorite LBC sermons:
      True Christians are Perfect!
      True Christian™ Love.
      Salvation™ made Easy!
      You can’t be a Christian if you don’t believe the Old Testament.
      Jesus is impolite. Deal with it.
      Jesus is xenophobic and so should we.
      Sanctity of Life is NOT a Biblical Concept.
      Biblical view on modern-day slavery.
      The Immorality of the "Universal Declaration of Human Rights."
      Geneva Conventions vs. The Holy Bible.
      God HATES Rational Thinking!
      True Christian™ Man as a spitting image of God.

      Comment


      • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

        Originally posted by JustPassingBy View Post
        I see.
        I am familiar with the Bible - basic cultural knowledge. I haven't read all of the evangelical texts in their original form (I don't mean in aramaic or hebrew - by "original form" I simply mean that in a language that I understand, but translated as close to possible to the original).

        Incidentally, do you believe that scripture can be translated, while effectively preserving its true meaning, at all? I mean, if the original would transcend humanity, being put together by a perfect being (which would be God) , then every successive interpretation by a human (i.e. a translator) would necessarily deviate further and further away from the original?
        Also, out of curiosity, if you would imagine a perfect being, then wouldn't that also imply that your mind is perfect, thereby proving that God lives inside you? Or conversely, if you would assert that your mind is not perfect, but you have an image of God in it (your mind), therefore God also is not perfect?

        Another question I have concerns context. Most of the Abrahamic scripture is quite old, isn't it (even thousands of years, in some cases)? People obviously lived differently, had different values, beliefs, the whole world was very different during those times. How can one therefore take a literal interpretation of holy scripture during modern times? And if one doesn't take the whole text literally, how does one choose?

        I took the time and read through many quotes (from scripture) that have been posted on this forum and I see where you are coming from - you seem to follow that scripture quite literally, while also extrapolating from it quite a lot. I don't have enough context in the sense to know whether you're also omitting to follow some other parts of scripture (I suggest you are - which would bring me back to my previous question; how do you choose). The extrapolation also raises the question (see the second paragraph) again - if God gave you scripture to follow, why would you interpret it in your own way? And if you do, where to stop, how far do you know you're allowed to go in the extrapolation process?

        Lastly, you are obviously very sure that your way of life, your religion, your interpretation of God is correct. How have you come to that realization? Is it some kind of intuition? Have you seen God (if so, how does a perfect being look like?)? What convinces you that you are on the right path, apart from dogma or tradition?

        I understand that I off-loaded quite a few questions here. I would think of a hundred more.
        I would really appreciate if some of you could find the time to answer any of them. And please, think of me as a lost soul as opposed to a heathen or something like that - I'm simply curious and am not looking for conflict.
        Sorry friend, no time to read the whole post. Looks like a lot of rambling. You lost my interest when you said you were familiar with but did not read the Bible. Kind of makes it hard to praise His Perfection when you have nary a clue what you are going on about.
        So I'll help you out.
        God made everything
        Therefore, He understands everything
        He has no reason not to be Honest with us.
        Therefore, the Bible is factual.

        Have a nice day!
        Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
        Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?
        Numbers 21:6 And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died.
        Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
        Matthew 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
        Matthew 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

        Comment


        • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

          Originally posted by Basilissa View Post
          Also - if you think that all translations are imperfect, why do people even bother translating books? If the only language and culture a person can understand is the one we were born into, why do some people bother learning foreign languages and traveling abroad?
          Interesting question. If I'm reading poetry, or even a certain kind of 'classical' literature, I always prefer the original language. Otherwise, if I'm reading something fun just for recreation, it doesn't really matter.

          Learning another language is actually an excellent way to get insight into another culture! Did you know that the way that people think (i.e. in what patterns, for example, when doing math) is very dependent on what language they think in? Also you can infer a lot of other things from a cultures' language. For example, if they have multiple tenses how to express verbs in past/present/future, or whether they distinguish nouns by sex. Fascinating stuff, but I digress...

          Originally posted by Basilissa View Post
          Are you implying that God given morality is somehow relative?
          I'm not implying anything.
          The same answer goes to your question as well, Laurence.

          Anyway, thanks for answering, Laurence, Basilissa and James. Have a good day.

          Comment


          • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

            Originally posted by JustPassingBy View Post
            Interesting question. If I'm reading poetry, or even a certain kind of 'classical' literature, I always prefer the original language. Otherwise, if I'm reading something fun just for recreation, it doesn't really matter.
            Wow, you sound very smart. So, how many languages do you speak, in order to be able to read in original languages? I'm not very smart, so I'm fluent only in three languages; I can read in a few others, but I couldn't read very dry academic stuff, you know. (I can barely get through Bordieau in English, reading him in French would be unbearable, lol!).

            Learning another language is actually an excellent way to get insight into another culture! Did you know that the way that people think (i.e. in what patterns, for example, when doing math) is very dependent on what language they think in? Also you can infer a lot of other things from a cultures' language. For example, if they have multiple tenses how to express verbs in past/present/future, or whether they distinguish nouns by sex. Fascinating stuff, but I digress...
            I agree, it is fascinating. Did you know that the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis (meaning the stuff you just wrote) is called a hypothesis, even though it has been around for a century, because it has never been proven to be right? In other words, most anthropologists and linguists today agree that Sapir and Whorf exaggerated a lot the influence of language on human thought. Not to mention that their data was extremely limited. You should read their articles sometimes, like, critically. They wrote in relatively plain English, so these articles are easy to understand.

            Anyway, thanks for answering, Laurence, Basilissa and James. Have a good day.
            You welcome, and thank you, I most certainly will!
            God created fossils to test our faith.

            * * *

            My favorite LBC sermons:
            True Christians are Perfect!
            True Christian™ Love.
            Salvation™ made Easy!
            You can’t be a Christian if you don’t believe the Old Testament.
            Jesus is impolite. Deal with it.
            Jesus is xenophobic and so should we.
            Sanctity of Life is NOT a Biblical Concept.
            Biblical view on modern-day slavery.
            The Immorality of the "Universal Declaration of Human Rights."
            Geneva Conventions vs. The Holy Bible.
            God HATES Rational Thinking!
            True Christian™ Man as a spitting image of God.

            Comment


            • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

              Is this forum a joke? Firstly I thought that people are just making jokes about that the Earth is flat and that the Earth is only 6000 years old or that humans are some non-animal beings?


              Also, I want to know if you hate Estonia or you hate people who don't follow the "true" religion?

              Comment


              • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                Earth is only 6000 years old
                Not just the earth. Everything you see, earth, plants, animals, the whole universe was created in six days little over 6000 years ago.

                GLORY!

                Comment


                • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                  Originally posted by Alphonse Alban View Post
                  Not just the earth. Everything you see, earth, plants, animals, the whole universe was created in six days little over 6000 years ago.
                  These are not even facts.

                  We are living in 21st century. People who still believe that the Bible has 100% true facts must be brainwashed/badly educated/mentally ill. This madness must be ended.

                  Also, it is not nice to insult other people. You don't have to insult people who live in other countries and who follow other traditions.

                  Comment


                  • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                    Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                    People who still believe that the Bible has 100% true facts must be brainwashed/badly educated/mentally ill.
                    Followed by:

                    Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                    Also, it is not nice to insult other people.
                    2 Timothy 3:16

                    All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:


                    Comment


                    • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                      Originally posted by Attila's Wife View Post
                      Followed by:




                      I can't read your mind, could you explain me what did you mean by that?

                      Comment


                      • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                        Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                        I can't read your mind, could you explain me what did you mean by that?
                        She was pointing out the irony of you complaining about us insulting people, while you were in the process of insulting us.

                        Try and keep up, huh?



                        Yours in Christ,

                        Z. Smyth
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                          Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                          I can't read your mind, could you explain me what did you mean by that?
                          I would put it like this:

                          1. You insult people who believe in the Bible, i.e. us, calling us "brainwashed/badly educated/mentally ill".

                          2. You then say it is not nice to insult other people.

                          This is illogical.

                          You would probably put it more offensively.
                          2 Timothy 3:16

                          All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:


                          Comment


                          • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                            You surely don't know the difference between true facts and imaginary stories.
                            There's a huge difference between a fact and an insult that is not true at all. And that bothers me, because why the hell (is this phrase allowed on this forum?) do you have to say lies about other nationalities .....

                            Comment


                            • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                              Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                              Is this forum a joke? ...
                              I initially considered this as well, but after some exploring around (which at first was amusing but made me increasingly sad), it seems that the users of this forum are indeed sincere.

                              It's their forum, though, and we can't do anything about it. If they choose to believe in the things they do and hold the morals they do, they're allowed to do so. We live in an era of information and technology, and everyone in the 1st and 2nd world countries have access to enough education to have a healthy world-view. Ignorance is no longer a curse, it's a choice. These people seemed to have made their choice.

                              A sense of community offers confidence and creates a positive-feedback mechanism that keeps communities like this one alive. As long as they're not hurting anyone (some people here do have quite violent thoughts against others, though), then they just exist and that's it. The rest of the world, including Estonia, goes on, fortunately.

                              Comment


                              • Re: 7 reasons why God hates Estonia

                                Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                                These are not even facts.
                                God is a fact. These are opinions.

                                Originally posted by UseYourBrainPls View Post
                                People who still believe that the Bible has 100% true facts must be brainwashed/badly educated/mentally ill.
                                You are not very smart, are you.

                                Comment

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