[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

I am starting to get rumblings about the understanding I have on the bible.
So I'm probably out staying my welcome.
So I will not bother you people any more.
I enjoyed our talks, and I hope the best for you all.
Even you Bogdana, (The scientists do not have the answer.)

I will check the posts for a little bit, but I probably have said enough.
Thanks
epi

[BelieverInGod]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

I guess I thought this was obvious. Sorry about that.
God is not under a solar day like man is. He isn't even under days of the week. What is a year for God? Man has a year, it depends on our sun. We divide that up into weeks and months. God is not bound by our solar time. For God, time is symbolic, and he uses our time, so that we can understand. But he is not limited, by our physical earth or sun.

So lets try a different tactic here. Why are you so special that you are the only one who "REALLY" knows what God means? After all, if I was an almighty being, I would say what I mean and mean what I say. The Bible tells us that God means what he says and says what he means, but somehow God has told you differently.

Who are you that you're so special?

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Exodus 20:10-11:
But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Why do you consistently ignore this? If the days in Genesis weren't literal days, then why should we take one literal day of rest after six literal days of labor? Or does your Sabbath only start 5 billion years from now?

I guess I thought this was obvious. Sorry about that.
God is not under a solar day like man is. He isn't even under days of the week. What is a year for God? Man has a year, it depends on our sun. We divide that up into weeks and months. God is not bound by our solar time. For God, time is symbolic, and he uses our time, so that we can understand. But he is not limited, by our physical earth or sun.

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

So, it is just a vague, non-prediction. Like me saying someone, at some point in time, somewhere in the world, will be murdered in some way for some reason. That's probably true, but that's hardly a prophecy. The truth is there have been great unheavals, earthquakes, wars, pestilences, etc. for all of human history. In many ways in fact, life is a lot more comfortable today.

According to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_disasters Eight of the biggest natural disasters in human history happened before the modern age.

Around people 1.5 million people died in floods in China in 1931.

Another million died in floods in 1887.

830,000 died in an earthquake in 1556.

500,000 died in a cyclone in Bangladesh in 1970.

300,000 died in a cyclone in India in 1839.

250,000 died in an earthquake in Turkey in 526.

400,000 died in an earthquake in 1976.

234,117 died in an earthquake in 1920.

The only modern disasters that even get close to this are the Indian Ocean Tsunami in 2004, and the Haiti earthquake in 2010. And even in these events, the numbers of dead were smaller than these other events.

In a lot of the other earthquakes that have been in the news in recent years, there have actually been relatively few deaths compared to these major disasters. The number of earthquakes hasn't increased. Only the amount of news coverage about them.

Wars? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rmed_conflicts

The wars we have today do not even begin to compare to the wars of the past. The biggest wars in history were the following:

World War II (1939-1945): 40 million dead
An Shi Rebellion (755-763): 33 million dead
Mongol Conquests (1207-1472): 30 million dead
Qing Dynasty Conquest of the Ming Dynasty (1616-1662): 25 million dead
Taiping Rebellion (1851-1864): 20 million dead
World War I (1914-1918): 50 million dead
Conquests of Timur (1369-1405): 15 million dead
Dungan Revolt (1862-1877): 8 million dead
Russian Civil War (1917-1921): 5 million dead

The only modern war that even begins to compare to these numbers in the Second Congo War from 1998 to 2003. And it is less than all of the other ones. (And don't forget, there are much more people in the world today, so you would think there should be more dying in wars. But the reverse is true.)

Pestilence? Again, people are much healthier nowadays. Health epidemics are tiny compared to the past. Here are the deadliest health epidemics of all time:

Plague of Justinian (541-542): 100 million dead
Black Death (1338-1351): 100 million dead
1918 flu pandemic: 75 million dead
Antonine Plague (165-180): 5 million dead
Asian flu (1957-1958): 2 million dead
Third Cholera Pandemic (1852-1860): 1 million dead
Russian flu (1889-1890): 1 million dead
Hong Kong flu (1968-1969): 1 million dead
Sixth Cholera Pandemic (1899-1923): 800,000 dead

The only modern epidemic to kill that many people is the HIV/AIDS pandemic. But far less people are dying from diseases nowadays.



And yet the life expectancy keeps on rising.

For you then, it must fell pretty good, the world is going along better than in the past, so things are great.

[True Disciple]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

These were time periods, from evening to morning,meaning start to finish. These creative 'days' had no time period( number of years) connected with them.
The idea of different years representing a 'day' , means the days can be any length of time to accomplish the work for that day.
The years mentioned in the bible as a day for a year, and a day for 1,000 years are used in different circumstances. we have talked about Adam, in that he was to die in the 'day' he eat from the tree, he lived for 930 years, so he died in that day. So in that case a 'day' was a 1,000 years.

Friend, now you are being willfully ignorant. Exodus 20:10-11 disproves this, I have proven that. Ignoring our rebukes is not going to prove your argument.

Also in Genesis 1:1 the creation of the universe ( including earth) was accomplished before the first creative day on the earth. It could have been a billion years old.

Utterly ridiculous. Genesis 1 says "And the evening and the morning were the first day," exactly the same words God uses after the other days. Genesis always lists a few creative events, and then concludes with this sentence. It is not different on the first day. This means that all creative events in Genesis 1-5 happened on the first day.

The science and the creation account of the bible do not conflict.

Yes, they do. Stop telling lies, friend. We explained why, and ignoring anything that doesn't suit your erroneous, unbiblical worldviews isn't going to salvage your argument in any way.

In a time when man thought the earth was flat, the bible says the circle of the earth. How did the writer know that? It was because he wrote down as he was borne along by Holy Spirit. The bible is inspired. Not by mans thoughts or thinking.

Friend, this Verse doesn't prove in any way that the Earth would be round. Read this thread, where I prove conclusively that a flat-earth cosmology is the only acceptable one for a True Christian(tm).

[Bogdana Alkeav]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

The bible told us that sign for the end of this systems there will be great upheavals. Earth quakes in one place after another,many wars, pestilences, the attitudes of people will back etc.

So, it is just a vague, non-prediction. Like me saying someone, at some point in time, somewhere in the world, will be murdered in some way for some reason. That's probably true, but that's hardly a prophecy. The truth is there have been great unheavals, earthquakes, wars, pestilences, etc. for all of human history. In many ways in fact, life is a lot more comfortable today.

According to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_disasters Eight of the biggest natural disasters in human history happened before the modern age.

Around people 1.5 million people died in floods in China in 1931.

Another million died in floods in 1887.

830,000 died in an earthquake in 1556.

500,000 died in a cyclone in Bangladesh in 1970.

300,000 died in a cyclone in India in 1839.

250,000 died in an earthquake in Turkey in 526.

400,000 died in an earthquake in 1976.

234,117 died in an earthquake in 1920.

The only modern disasters that even get close to this are the Indian Ocean Tsunami in 2004, and the Haiti earthquake in 2010. And even in these events, the numbers of dead were smaller than these other events.

In a lot of the other earthquakes that have been in the news in recent years, there have actually been relatively few deaths compared to these major disasters. The number of earthquakes hasn't increased. Only the amount of news coverage about them.

Wars? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rmed_conflicts

The wars we have today do not even begin to compare to the wars of the past. The biggest wars in history were the following:

World War II (1939-1945): 40 million dead
An Shi Rebellion (755-763): 33 million dead
Mongol Conquests (1207-1472): 30 million dead
Qing Dynasty Conquest of the Ming Dynasty (1616-1662): 25 million dead
Taiping Rebellion (1851-1864): 20 million dead
World War I (1914-1918): 50 million dead
Conquests of Timur (1369-1405): 15 million dead
Dungan Revolt (1862-1877): 8 million dead
Russian Civil War (1917-1921): 5 million dead

The only modern war that even begins to compare to these numbers in the Second Congo War from 1998 to 2003. And it is less than all of the other ones. (And don't forget, there are much more people in the world today, so you would think there should be more dying in wars. But the reverse is true.)

Pestilence? Again, people are much healthier nowadays. Health epidemics are tiny compared to the past. Here are the deadliest health epidemics of all time:

Plague of Justinian (541-542): 100 million dead
Black Death (1338-1351): 100 million dead
1918 flu pandemic: 75 million dead
Antonine Plague (165-180): 5 million dead
Asian flu (1957-1958): 2 million dead
Third Cholera Pandemic (1852-1860): 1 million dead
Russian flu (1889-1890): 1 million dead
Hong Kong flu (1968-1969): 1 million dead
Sixth Cholera Pandemic (1899-1923): 800,000 dead

The only modern epidemic to kill that many people is the HIV/AIDS pandemic. But far less people are dying from diseases nowadays.

Are the scientists, part of that? Also more and more people are not getting involved with God any more.

And yet the life expectancy keeps on rising.

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

You have not read one post where the Pastors have pointed out that the Genesis day is specifically designated as dawn to dusk. You just stick your head in the sand and go "I can't hear you"

Even if it was a day is a thousand years, it would not work out to the billions of years that evolutionists claim. It would be 7,000 years. Or are you going to twist that around to make it fit what you believe as well?

These were time periods, from evening to morning,meaning start to finish. These creative 'days' had no time period( number of years) connected with them. The idea of different years representing a 'day' , means the days can be any length of time to accomplish the work for that day.
The years mentioned in the bible as a day for a year, and a day for 1,000 years are used in different circumstances. we have talked about Adam, in that he was to die in the 'day' he eat from the tree, he lived for 930 years, so he died in that day. So in that case a 'day' was a 1,000 years.

Also in Genesis 1:1 the creation of the universe ( including earth) was accomplished before the first creative day on the earth. It could have been a billion years old.
The science and the creation account of the bible do not conflict. In a time when man thought the earth was flat, the bible says the circle of the earth. How did the writer know that? It was because he wrote down as he was borne along by Holy Spirit. The bible is inspired. Not by mans thoughts or thinking.

[BelieverInGod]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Genesis 2:2 (King James Version)

2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

So he is resting from his work of creation. Not from everything else.

You went to public school didn't you.

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Okay, so God created the earth in six days (time periods) that ended with the creation of man.

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

If on the seventh day (time period) He rested,

Genesis 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

God is talking to Adam and Eve in Genesis 3.

Genesis 3:9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

How can that be? God is supposedly resting for an entire time period, according to you.

Genesis 2:2 (King James Version)

2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

So he is resting from his work of creation. Not from everything else.

[True Disciple]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Of course we use the day to mean 24 hrs, .
But the bible is clear, a day can means many other lengths of time also.
When I say in Noah's day. What 24 hr day am I talking about. People say 'in the day', meaning maybe when they were younger, maybe a teenager, or during the 60's when there was really good music.



2 Peter 3:8 (King James Version)

8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Friend, Brother Basher quoted this Verse for you:

Exodus 20:10-11:
But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Why do you consistently ignore this? If the days in Genesis weren't literal days, then why should we take one literal day of rest after six literal days of labor? Or does your Sabbath only start 5 billion years from now?

Anyway, it says that God blessed the "Sabbath Day" (definitely a literal day) because He rested on the seventh day. So the seventh day was definitely a day, and so must the other ones therefore have been.

To speak with your own words:

Could it be any clearer than that.

And about the Scripture you quoted, nowhere in the Bible is 2 Peter 3:8 linked with the six days of creation. Exodus 20:10-11, however, is explicitly linked with the six days of creation, and Exodus 20:10-11 definitely speaks about a literal day of rest.

Therefore, while we have no reason to assume that the days of Creation weren't literal, as there isn't a single Verse in the Bible even vauely implying that, but there is a Passage that supports the literal interpretation, the only option for the True Christian™ is to read Genesis 1 literally.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Yes they were.

Okay, so God created the earth in six days (time periods) that ended with the creation of man.

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

If on the seventh day (time period) He rested,

Genesis 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

God is talking to Adam and Eve, the first man and woman by your words, in Genesis 3.

Genesis 3:9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

How can that be? God is supposedly resting for an entire time period, according to you.

[BelieverInGod]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

I wonder if you read my posts on what a day in the bible?

If evolution was true, then you must have evolved from an ostrich. I have never seen anyone stick their heads so deep in the sand before.


You have not read one post where the Pastors have pointed out that the Genesis day is specifically designated as dawn to dusk. You just stick your head in the sand and go "I can't hear you"

Even if it was a day is a thousand years, it would not work out to the billions of years that evolutionists claim. It would be 7,000 years. Or are you going to twist that around to make it fit what you believe as well?

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Were Adam and Eve the first humans or not?

Yes they were.

[epignosis]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

He did? When? Specifically, or vaguely?

The bible told us that sign for the end of this systems there will be great upheavals. Earth quakes in one place after another,many wars, pestilences, the attitudes of people will back etc.

This effects everyone. This all is a result of Satan's system and that Satan was pushed out of heaven, the bible says woe to the earth the and world of mankind. The prophecy has is come true.


Revelation 12: (King James Version)


7And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.




1 Timothy 4:1 (King James Version)

1 Timothy 4

1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;


Are the scientists, part of that? Also more and more people are not getting involved with God any more.

All of this was told to us when the bible was written. So seeing these things happening now, around the world, tells us where we are in the stream of time.
The world we live in now are dangerous times.

If you want to blame someone, blame Satan he is the cause of all of this.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: God HATES Rational Thinking!

Of course we use the day to mean 24 hrs, .
But the bible is clear, a day can means many other lengths of time also.
When I say in Noah's day. What 24 hr day am I talking about. People say 'in the day', meaning maybe when they were younger, maybe a teenager, or during the 60's when there was really good music.



2 Peter 3:8 (King James Version)

8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Could it be any clearer than that.

Were Adam and Eve the first humans or not?