[ramakandra]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

What are you doing walking alone at night? Why are you not at home taking care of your family as God wants you to?

there is a little thing called free will, who the f*** are you to challange that? women can come and go in this day and age, deal with it or crawl back under the rock you seem to have made your home

Why do you liebrals think women should be allowed to walk down the street naked? It isn't our Christian men who are out raping, it's your fellow liebrals. Then they cry on TV about how bad they were and go on sinning. If a woman dresses like a whore why should she not be treated like one? If someone dresses like a gang member, they should be treated as such. Although God created you with the color of your skin and your build, how you dress is completely in your power.

whomever said there was nakedness? and for as far as i can tell most inmates in america are cristians (like son of sam, 1 of the most notorious mass murderers ever to walk this earth). nobody asks to be raped, as a matter of fact, the very definetion of rape states its against someones (i.e. a womens) will. ergo; a rapist should be punished as he commits a horrible crime. if you dare dispute this; i hope you and your children get raped you sick bastard.

So how often do you fantasize about raping beautiful women? Of course if the woman plays the whore she should be treated as such. God tells us in Deuteronomy 22 what to do if someone is raped. Who are we to second guess God?

never, i fantasize about sleeping with them, but like a normal humanbeing i hope she will sleep with me out of free will, or i expect her never to sleep with me at all. if a woman dresses a certain way then yes she oftenly wants sexual attention, but she never, NEVER, wants to get raped, how retarded would you have to be to think someone wants to have something done against their will??

anyway, god didnt write the bible, if he did there wouldnt be so many variations within the same language. dont tell me its some kind of test either, im just not buying that anymore.

oh and god is still welcome to f*** my life up, so far hes been unsuccesfull.

[Meek and Humble]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

there is a little thing called free will, who the f*** are you to challange that? women can come and go in this day and age, deal with it or crawl back under the rock you seem to have made your home

Free will? That's an unbiblical lie. There is no such thing as free will.

ergo; a rapist should be punished as he commits a horrible crime.

Of course he should be punished. The Bible tells us what the punishment is. He has to pay a fine to the woman's father, and then marry her.

but she never, NEVER, wants to get raped, how retarded would you have to be to think someone wants to have something done against their will??

I'm sure she doesn't, but she should have thought twice before putting herself in that kind of situation. It's like walking through the ghetto late at night waving hundred dollars bills around and not expecting to get mugged.

Besides, the Bible tells us when you look at a woman with lust, it is the same as committing adultery. A woman should not be dressing to cause men to sin like that!

anyway, god didnt write the bible, if he did there wouldnt be so many variations within the same language.

What variations?

oh and god is still welcome to f*** my life up, so far hes been unsuccesfull.

It's spelled unsuccessful. One "L".

[Roonil Wazlib]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

Free will? That's an unbiblical lie. There is no such thing as free will.

Wait, there's no free will at all? So everything we do is predetermined for us?

[True Disciple]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

Wait, there's no free will at all? So everything we do is predetermined for us?

Exactly:

Psalm 58:3:
The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Isaiah 48:8:
Yea, thou heardest not; yea, thou knewest not; yea, from that time that thine ear was not opened: for I knew that thou wouldest deal very treacherously, and wast called a transgressor from the womb.

Matthew 22:14:
For many are called, but few are chosen.

Mark 4:11-12:
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all [these] things are done in parables: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and [their] sins should be forgiven them.

John 6:44:
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:64-65:
But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

John 15:5:
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

Acts 13:48:
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Romans 8:29-31:
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

Ephesians 1:4-5:
According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

2 Thessalonians 2:11-13:
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

2 Timothy 1:9:
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Jude 1:4:
For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

[Roonil Wazlib]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

If everything humans do is predetermined, then a sinner would have been predestined to commit their sins, and also predestined to either repent or not repent. How could God punish sinners for things over which they have no control, especially when they had no choice in whether they repented for their sins?

[True Disciple]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

If everything humans do is predetermined, then a sinner would have been predestined to commit their sins, and also predestined to either repent or not repent. How could God punish sinners for things over which they have no control, especially when they had no choice in whether they repented for their sins?

How could He do that? That's the wrong question. The point is that He does. Our mortal minds cannot possibly fathom the reasons for Him doing so:

Isaiah 55:8-9:
For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

[The Bright Beast]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

So, does this mean God has predetermined who is to be a True Christian(tm) beforehand?

[Meek and Humble]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

So, does this mean God has predetermined who is to be a True Christian™ beforehand?

Yes, of course. It's right there in the Bible.

John 15:16: "You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide, so that whatever you ask the Father in my name, he may give it to you."

Acts 13:48: "And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed."

Romans 9:15-16: "For he says to Moses, 'I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.' So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy."

Ephesians 1:4-5: "even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,"

Philippians 1:29: "For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake"

1 Thessalonians 1:4-5: "For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction. You know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sake."

2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification [by the Spirit] and belief in the truth."

2 Timothy 1:9: "who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began,"

[BelieverInGod]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

there is a little thing called free will, who the f*** are you to challange that? women can come and go in this day and age, deal with it or crawl back under the rock you seem to have made your home

There's a little thing called consequences to your actions. Why do liebrals believe that they should be able to do whatever they want and to be consequence free.

whomever said there was nakedness? and for as far as i can tell most inmates in america are cristians (like son of sam, 1 of the most notorious mass murderers ever to walk this earth). nobody asks to be raped, as a matter of fact, the very definetion of rape states its against someones (i.e. a womens) will. ergo; a rapist should be punished as he commits a horrible crime. if you dare dispute this; i hope you and your children get raped you sick bastard.

Sure there's lots of false christians in prisons. And you wish rape on my boys? But you call yourself tolerant? Who's the sick one here? I have not wished rape on anyone, all I've said is that if a woman dresses like a whore she shouldn't be surprised when she's treated as one.

never, i fantasize about sleeping with them, but like a normal humanbeing i hope she will sleep with me out of free will, or i expect her never to sleep with me at all. if a woman dresses a certain way then yes she oftenly wants sexual attention, but she never, NEVER, wants to get raped, how retarded would you have to be to think someone wants to have something done against their will??

I said rape, not sleeping with. But thank you for admitting that women dress that way because she wants sexual attention. Now why should she cry when she gets it?

anyway, god didnt write the bible, if he did there wouldnt be so many variations within the same language. dont tell me its some kind of test either, im just not buying that anymore.

This is a lie, there is the AKJV 1611 and a bunch of (per)versions out there.

[/quote]oh and god is still welcome to f*** my life up, so far hes been unsuccesfull.[/QUOTE]
You seem to be messing up your life quite well all by yourself. Enjoy hell

If everything humans do is predetermined, then a sinner would have been predestined to commit their sins, and also predestined to either repent or not repent. How could God punish sinners for things over which they have no control, especially when they had no choice in whether they repented for their sins?

Who are you to say what God can and cannot do? Read the last 4 chapters of Job, that should make it much clearer.

[ramakandra2]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

There's a little thing called consequences to your actions. Why do liebrals believe that they should be able to do whatever they want and to be consequence free.

your getting it all wrong, there should be consequences for the rapist (hes commiting a crime, both against the laws of the land as well as against human rights!!!) not the girl who got raped, considering she wasnt in control at all in the given situation!

Sure there's lots of false christians in prisons. And you wish rape on my boys? But you call yourself tolerant? Who's the sick one here? I have not wished rape on anyone, all I've said is that if a woman dresses like a whore she shouldn't be surprised when she's treated as one.

to you all atheists are the same, so to me all christians are the same. and i wished your boys got raped to make the point you helped me make. if it happens to your own kids its a crying shame, but when it happens to someone elses kids its suddenly ok? dont try and sell me that crap, because im not buying!!

I said rape, not sleeping with. But thank you for admitting that women dress that way because she wants sexual attention. Now why should she cry when she gets it?

she is horrified because she got raped, how hard is that to understand? god shouldve given you a decent brain, since the one you have no is grossly lacking.

This is a lie, there is the AKJV 1611 and a bunch of (per)versions out there.

how is this a lie? dont you people say it was written by PEOPLE like paul, job, matthew, etc. yourselfs?

You seem to be messing up your life quite well all by yourself. Enjoy hell

ohyeah, i almost forgot how terrible my life is... also i do not worry about hell at all, its as fictional as your god. seriously who do you think your impressing with your flights of fantasy? children and other christians... maybe.

[James Hutchins]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

your getting it all wrong, there should be consequences for the rapist (hes commiting a crime, both against the laws of the land as well as against human rights!!!) not the girl who got raped, considering she wasnt in control at all in the given situation!

There is! He is required to marry the girl AND pay 50 sheckels.

to you all atheists are the same, so to me all christians are the same. and i wished your boys got raped to make the point you helped me make. if it happens to your own kids its a crying shame, but when it happens to someone elses kids its suddenly ok? dont try and sell me that crap, because im not buying!!

God tells us man should not lie with man. Are you trying to make everyone a homer like you? If so, shame on you!

she is horrified because she got raped, how hard is that to understand? god shouldve given you a decent brain, since the one you have no is grossly lacking.

Since when is a man showing interest in a woman horrifying?

ohyeah, i almost forgot how terrible my life is... also i do not worry about hell at all, its as real as your god. seriously who do you think your impressing with your flights of fantasy? children and other christians... maybe.

I am sorry you have a terrible life. Perhaps if you turned it over to God, it would not be so bad. Nothing like having you BFF at your side all the time.

[scaredshoeless]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

You people sicken me. This is why religion is a source of destruction in the world- because you all possess irreparably polarized views based on fabricated documents that can't withstand the tests of science. WAKE UP. The Bible was written by power-hungry men interested in capitalizing on the ignorance of the masses, and you're all mindless sheep that have fallen into the trap. If God is so flawless, why would he have created a world where 98% of all species that have ever come into existence have become extinct? Why couldn't he get it right the first time? And what just, ominous being would create both women and men "in his image," yet subject women to a life of oppression and subjugation? Rape is never alright- I don't care how a woman dresses. The fact that you, in your warped mines, are able to justify a man sticking his genitals into a woman without her permission just appalls me! All women possess the right to refuse- as do men. No one should be forced to perform any sexual act that he or she does not agree to.
You might want to do a little research on the psychology behind rape. It has nothing to do with sexual desire, but all about obtaining power and defiling the victim. It's completely distinct and separate from normal, healthy expressions of affection. To suggest that this poor girl should marry her rapist is ghastly to say the least; she was traumatized by a selfish and deranged delinquent. He shouldn't be allowed within a hundred feet of the girl. And if she chooses to abort the fetus (which is advisable in cases of rape, since the victim is not aware of the potential health repercussions that the rapist could have passed on to the child), so be it; it is her choice and her body.
As a victim of rape and sexual assault, I am extremely offended by your ignorance. I did not ask to be attacked, and I have had a very difficult time coping with the psychological repercussions of being assaulted. I did not want to have sex with those men, so I should not have been forced to.
Women are half of the population- to treat them as inferior is simply inefficient. Women are equally intelligent and capable as men, and to deprive them of the opportunity to fulfill their potential as productive, valuable members of society is counterintuitive. You are inhibiting this opportunity for growth and progress by dismissing a woman's right to choose who she has sex with- a most basic and fundamental right. To be raped is to be irreversibly traumatized, and women should not be subjected to such treatment.
If you choose to remove me from this forum, you will simply be confirming my beliefs that Christians are hypocritical, intolerant, and short-sighted.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

All women possess the right to refuse- as do men. No one should be forced to perform any sexual act that he or she does not agree to.

I generally agree with you on this point, even though you come off as completely hysterical and hormonal.

The rationale for the woman marrying the rapist makes sense. It is a way to force him to take care of his obligation to the woman. He has to marry her and can never put her away for all his days. She basically gets a lifetime meal ticket. That's a pretty harsh punishment for the man.

You might want to do a little research on the psychology behind rape. It has nothing to do with sexual desire, but all about obtaining power and defiling the victim. It's completely distinct and separate from normal, healthy expressions of affection. To suggest that this poor girl should marry her rapist is ghastly to say the least;

Why do you hate Jesus so much?

As a victim of rape and sexual assault, I am extremely offended by your ignorance. I did not ask to be attacked, and I vehemently expressed my desire to be left alone. I did not want to have sex with those men, so I should not have been forced to.

Could you perhaps tell us a little more about the circumstances behind this? Where was your father or brother in all this?

Women are half of the population- to treat them as inferior is simply inefficient.

It seems to have worked for thousands of years just fine.

Women are equally intelligent and capable as men, and to deprive them of the opportunity to fulfill their potential as productive, valuable members of society is counterintuitive.

Now you are just being funny. Tell me another funny joke.

You are inhibiting this opportunity for growth and progress by dismissing a woman's right to choose who she has sex with- a most basic and fundamental right. To be raped is to be irreversibly traumatized, and women should not be subjected to such treatment.

I agree with you there. They shouldn't be subjected to this sort of thing, but it unfortunately happens. When it does, we turn to the Bible as the source for morality and guide for our lives.

[scaredshoeless]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

"All women possess the right to refuse- as do men. No one should be forced to perform any sexual act that he or she does not agree to."

I generally agree with you on this point, even though you come off as completely hysterical and hormonal.

You must be joking. I couldn't have said it in a more diplomatic and civil manner. That's the problem with you religious folk- you twist everything to conform to your beliefs. You can't just simply admit that I'm right, you have to include some pejorative statement suggesting that I'm irrational. It's called the "Ad Hominem" fallacy- Attacking the character of the individual with whom you disagree rather than addressing the argument. It's often used by people who have been outwitted and have no retort.

The rationale for the woman marrying the rapist makes sense. It is a way to force him to take care of his obligation to the woman. He has to marry her and can never put her away for all his days. She basically gets a lifetime meal ticket. That's a pretty harsh punishment for the man.

But what about the woman? What makes you think she'd find justice in being irreparably bound to the man who victimized her? And what makes you think the abuse would stop? You're lack of common sense is rather concerning.

"You might want to do a little research on the psychology behind rape. It has nothing to do with sexual desire, but all about obtaining power and defiling the victim. It's completely distinct and separate from normal, healthy expressions of affection. To suggest that this poor girl should marry her rapist is ghastly to say the least"

Why do you hate Jesus so much?

Wtf does Jesus have to do with this? Once again, another rhetorical fallacy. This is called the "Red Herring," when you divert attention away from the issue at hand because you cannot construct an argument that addresses the topic in question.


"As a victim of rape and sexual assault, I am extremely offended by your ignorance. I did not ask to be attacked, and I vehemently expressed my desire to be left alone. I did not want to have sex with those men, so I should not have been forced to."

Could you perhaps tell us a little more about the circumstances behind this? Where was your father or brother in all this?

Actually, I'd rather not tell you more about it. It's extremely private and a very sensitive topic. I was sexually assaulted while I was away at college; my father and my brother did not fail in their capacities as strong, protective men.

"Women are half of the population- to treat them as inferior is simply inefficient."

It seems to have worked for thousands of years just fine.

Are you kidding? Have you even taken a history course? Genocide, war, destruction- I think we have a lot of room for improvement.

"Women are equally intelligent and capable as men, and to deprive them of the opportunity to fulfill their potential as productive, valuable members of society is counterintuitive."

Now you are just being funny. Tell me another funny joke.

This doesn't even dignify a response. I will instead direct you to an article to help you realize the idiocy of your previous assertion. http://www.newsweek.com/2008/01/22/h...he-thinks.html

"You are inhibiting this opportunity for growth and progress by dismissing a woman's right to choose who she has sex with- a most basic and fundamental right. To be raped is to be irreversibly traumatized, and women should not be subjected to such treatment."

I agree with you there. They shouldn't be subjected to this sort of thing, but it unfortunately happens. When it does, we turn to the Bible as the source for morality and guide for our lives.

Oh, you mean the same bible that condones such atrocities as torture, slavery, and murder? Yes, it's an excellent sort of guidance. Even if it weren't antiquated and completely irrelevant to this time period, it would still be morally egregious.

Yes, women shouldn't be subjected to rape, but what you don't seem to understand is that marrying her rapist would be more harmful than it would be beneficial- it is a completely destructive solution to an already horrible situation. And we DO have a system in place to deal with these sorts of things- it's called the law. Justice and righteousness based on logic and morality, sans religion. It is much more effective and productive than any of the unorthodox solutions suggested here.

As an atheist, I don't need the incentive of an afterlife to be morally righteous. I don't cause harm to others because I empathize with the pain that it causes, and I don't wish to be the source of anguish for another. I also feel that we are all equals and helping one another is simply part of the human experience. It's a cop-out to use the Bible or the prospect of Heaven to justify your morality; we are all capable enough to determine that transgressions such as murder and rape are destructive acts that should be avoided- we did not need the word of God to come to this conclusion (otherwise, how did the people of Moses manage to get to Mt. Sinai without knowing that murder was wrong? They must have functioned well enough to reproduce and proliferate- this couldn't have happened in the absence of some moral code).

I don't have a problem with religion- I have a problem with the intolerance under the guise of morality. To be referred to as "trash" (as appears under my username every time I make a post on this website) certainly doesn't seem Christian. If I don't agree with your opinions, I am cast off as inferior- and you don't see a problem with this logic? If you had been born and raised in India, you'd be Hindu; if you had been born and raised in Sri Lanka, you'd be Buddhist; if you had been born and raised in Israel, you'd be Jewish. Your religious beliefs are as capricious and random as your birthplace. Religion is all part of one giant mechanism to control and indoctrinate the masses. I've done my research on religion, and the more I find out, the less I like about it.

[Born Again Bob]

Re: What can you do if your daughter refuses to marry her rapist?

Sheesh... Men, THIS is why you never rape a woman... Yak yak yak yak

bab!
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