[Jack O'fagan]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I believe that it is possible to have morals without believing in God. I know inside of me that it is wrong to murder, steal, rape, be dishonest, etc. I don't know why I know these things are wrong but I believe we all have some sort of moral compass inside of us no matter what religion we follow.

You know these things are wrong because God has written the law onto your heart,

Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another


YIC


Jack

[Steve]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I would describe myself who doesn't believe in the existence of a God but I do not rule out the possibility.

I understand you dislike labels, but would 'agnostic' be a fit for you?

Where do I begin with your question (its a very broad question)? I'll give you some examples of things I believe in and you can ask for more specifics. This is going to be disjointed.

Okay.

I believe that humans are incredible in their ability to solve problems and are curious about what we don't know.

Yes. The Lord placed us above all animals and the abilities you cite above give us mastery over the earth.

I believe that humans are inherently good and seek to help each other and better the world.

I'm not with you there. The history of humanity is a bloodbath stretching from the distant past right up to this very minute. Armed conflicts are raging across the Earth right now. Everywhere people are stealing, lying, cheating, committing adultery, abusing,raping, murdering - the list of what we do to each other is endless. Humanity is a walking horror show and I'm rather surprised God doesn't wipe us all out and start over like He did in Noah's time.

I believe that everyone should be allowed to believe what they want, practice whatever religion they want, say and do what they want as long as it doesn't endanger other humans.

That's believing in a fairytale. Every group seeks to push their views on others. Look at Gay Pride parades, for example. What's that all about? Why do I need to see nancies prancing around naked in the streets? That's why we need the KJV Bible. Humanity needs Truth to replace all the nonsense.

I believe I am a good person because I know what is morally right and wrong.

How can their be a moral right or a moral wrong without God? Morals are absolutes and they have to come from somewhere. God is that somewhere. Without God their can be no morality. Morals are a great proof of god's existence.

I believe that redemption is possible for anyone.

100% agree. Even Dahmer and Hitler, if they came to Christ in their final moments.

This one's corny, but I believe that the best things in life are free. Spending time with a loved one, hiking to see a beautiful sight, a good long night of sleep, etc. The list goes on but all of the most enjoyable things in life are free.

Again, I agree. And the very best free thing is the gift of Salvation. It has to be free because we have nothing of equal value to pay for it. That's why the price was paid with Christ's blood. All you have to do is accept this gift.

I believe that only 1 of ~7 billion people on this planet in this infinitely vast universe. I believe that I truly am insignificant in the scope of all history but that doesn't mean I can't make significant differences for the people around me.

I agree with this as well. After all, that's what i'm trying to do here with you.

Following from that, I believe that one of the most significant and special things I can do is show the people I care about that I do love them and care for them.

What more significant thing can you do for those you love than show them the path to eternal Salvation?

I believe the universe is beautiful in that it functions perfectly to foster life on Earth and to sustain the stars and galaxies that we see at night.

God's creation is a magnificent thing.

I believe there could be other life forms somewhere out in the universe.

Of course. Angels and demons.

I think that there the advances in science and technology that we've had are amazing but there is still an infinite amount of knowledge that we don't know.

Yes. our knowledge compared to God's is as that of a bacteria to a human.

I believe since we are curious and intelligent beings we will continue to solve the worlds mysteries but since the unknown is infinite we will never be able to understand everything.

Yes. There are things only God knows and only god will ever know.

For a less abstract belief, I believe that education is vital for everyone as it allows us to achieve progress and gain knowledge.

Absolutely. That's why you can ask for a free copy of the KJV Bible at any Baptist church.

Lastly, since it pertains to the forum that we are in, I do believe in the possibility of a God and I also believe in the possibility of the big bang or some theory that we haven't figured out yet which would explain why we are here.

So you're on the fence. Okay, at least your mind isn't closed. Do remember though, you don't have forever to decide which side of the fence to come down on. Jesus could kill you at any time, and you do want to be on His good side when that happens.

I tried to organize that list in some sort of discernible order. Sorry if it seems random. I could go on listing beliefs forever. If you have any specific questions about that list or about any specific topics that you would like to know my beliefs on I will try to answer them as best as I can. Again, I will ignore rude comments. Thank you Destiny's Blunder for showing genuine interest in what someone who doesn't believe in God believes in.

You did fine and I hope you found my comments edifying rather than offensive. God Bless.

[bobbyd]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I understand you dislike labels, but would 'agnostic' be a fit for you?

That's believing in a fairytale. Every group seeks to push their views on others. Look at Gay Pride parades, for example. What's that all about? Why do I need to see nancies prancing around naked in the streets? That's why we need the KJV Bible. Humanity needs Truth to replace all the nonsense.

How can their be a moral right or a moral wrong without God? Morals are absolutes and they have to come from somewhere. God is that somewhere. Without God their can be no morality. Morals are a great proof of god's existence.

You did fine and I hope you found my comments edifying rather than offensive. God Bless.

I always thought agnostic came with the connotation that one isn't spiritual or doesn't care or hasn't thought about religion. I do think a lot about being spiritual and religious so if it carries that connotation I wouldn't accept that label. Strictly from the dictionary definition below I could agree that I am agnostic.

ag·nos·tic (g-nstk)
n.
1.
a. One who believes that it is impossible to know whether there is a God.
b. One who is skeptical about the existence of God but does not profess true atheism.

Thank you for putting the time in to actually read my post and respond thoughtfully. I didn't find your comments offensive at all and I hope you haven't found any of my comments offensive either. I'm not going to respond to many of them because we agree on many of them and the slight differences are not anything worth arguing over.

There are two that I wanted to clarify/add to.

The first I want to clarify on the belief that you called a "fairytale." I wouldn't call them a "fairytale," rather idealistic. However, I think beliefs can be completely idealistic and impractical. That's why they are beliefs and not rules or facts. Everyone has some "typical" beliefs and some crazy, far-out there beliefs. That's why I think its so much fun to meet new people and learn what interesting ideas and beliefs they have.

The second point and my final comments will probably get me banned as they are blasphemy but I have to say them if I want to explain my beliefs fully, which I do, because you have shown a genuine interest.

Here is my definition of morality. This is taken straight from a dictionary.

mo·ral·i·ty (m-rl-t, mô-)
n. pl. mo·ral·i·ties
1. The quality of being in accord with standards of right or good conduct.

I believe that one can have morals even with no belief in God as there is no mention of God in my definition of morality. Morality is simply having right or good conduct.

To truly understand my beliefs and viewpoints you have to realize that as someone who does not believe in God, I do not see the Bible as the infallible truth. Even though the Bible has a definition of morality, that doesn't mean that I automatically take that as my definition. Even though the Bible says everyone is born with morals because God put them there, I do not automatically assume that's why I have innate morals.

More generally, since I don't see the Bible as the only source of valid information. I analyze information from the Bible with the same critical mind that I analyze scientific studies, political policy, personal experience and everything else with. I think the Bible is an incredibly important text, but it does not receive greater weight when I analyze its information as anything else. I apologize if this blasphemy offends you but this is my belief.

This will probably be my last post as I think I have added as much as I can to this discussion. I have learned a lot about myself and my beliefs doing this. Thank you for that. I hope you can understand that even though I do not believe in God I still have a ton of beliefs and most of the beliefs I listed you said you agree, at least partially, with. I think we have many similar beliefs, but we disagree on some of the details and I am completely fine with that. In fact, I would completely fine if you said you disagree with all of my beliefs as one of my beliefs is that it is your right to believe whatever you want.

I don't want to leave by saying God Bless since I think that would inappropriate given the discussion, but I sincerely hope for the best for you and everyone here. I hope you have good health and fruitful, prosperous lives for yourselves and everyone you care about.

[Dr Laurence Niles]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I hope you have good health and fruitful, prosperous lives for yourselves and everyone you care about.

That's nice an all but you are still going to Hell because of you hatred of God, even if you don't know it.

Jeremiah 17:9*The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

All the best.

[Redeemed Papist]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

Did you not read anything I have just written in this thread? I do not have an empty life. It is filled with wonderful things.
Give my life to 'God' ? My life is my own. I shall give it to no one. How can you say such things when you have no idea who I am?

So. Helping others is a pitiful existence? So you don't believe in helping those in need?

Yes but what's the point of it all if you are going to burn for all eternity?

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

Hello my Brothers and Sisters,

I do not believe in god and I live a wonderful life. I don't know why you assume anyone who doesn't believe in god is lonely and depressed.

BobbyD

Probably because so many "not lonely and depressed" atheists insist upon joining this Christian church's discussion forum to prove how wonderful their lives are without God.

Who exactly are you folks trying to convince? Surely not us, because you invariably attack and insult us.

I think you're trying to convince yourselves that you're not miserable without God.

Please read my short list of beliefs that I came up with off the top of my head.

I see, so you've given the meaning of life, etc. great consideration and deep thought.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

An agnostic is just an atheist with no balls.

But seriously, Bobby....Denying the existence of God is not unbelief but an exercise in self-deception. You may know things, but you cannot account for anything you know. Arguing against God's existence would be on par with arguing against the existence of air, breathing it all the while. You use the universal, immaterial, unchanging laws of logic, mathematics, science, and absolute morality in order to come to rational decisions, but you cannot account for them. These laws are not the only way God has revealed himself to you, but they are sufficient to show the irrationality of your thinking, and expose your guilt for denying Him.

There is a reason that you deny the existence of God and it has nothing to do with proof. I can show this to you. Do you think that you can continue to deny God because surely somewhere, sometime, a philosopher or scientist will come up with an explanation for universal, immaterial, unchanging laws apart from God?' Did you ever try to come up with an alternate explanation on your own?

Hoping that an alternate explanation for universal, immaterial, unchanging laws can someday be found apart from God, is a blind leap of faith, or wishful thinking. Isn't it interesting that this is exactly what professed unbelievers accuse Christians of?

Please examine the real reason why you are running from God. It is my prayer that God will open your eyes and change your heart so that you may be saved from your sin, embraced by His ferocious love, and that you will tithe robustly immediately using the Paypal button at the bottom of this page.

[limesugar]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I just posted here for the first time on another thread, I just wanted to say that actually I'm not guided by what suits me best, my decisions are driven by empathy, I choose to assist in others lives, no matter their religion, yes I am atheist, but in your eyes if this means I am ignorant, it must be more hurtful than helpful to continually speculate on our lives and how terrible they must be, Its really not that bad

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I just posted here for the first time on another thread, I just wanted to say that actually I'm not guided by what suits me best, my decisions are driven by empathy, I choose to assist in others lives, no matter their religion, yes I am atheist, but in your eyes if this means I am ignorant, it must be more hurtful than helpful to continually speculate on our lives and how terrible they must be, Its really not that bad

It'll be bad when Jesus kills you and sends you to hell. Real bad.

Please make a thread of your own in the "Introductions" section of the forum, so that we can properly greet you. Tell us about yourself, the church you grew up in, and how you came to hate Jesus.

And if you're here to flame us, better take a look at THIS before making an even bigger ass out of yourself.

[Steve]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I just posted here for the first time on another thread, I just wanted to say that actually I'm not guided by what suits me best, my decisions are driven by empathy, I choose to assist in others lives, no matter their religion, yes I am atheist, but in your eyes if this means I am ignorant, it must be more hurtful than helpful to continually speculate on our lives and how terrible they must be, Its really not that bad

But it will be.

2 Chronicles 15:13
Whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.

John 15:6
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

We, too, choose to assist in others' lives, to bring them to Christ and eternal lfe. We don't stand in judgement of you, God does. We simply point this out in the hope (often vain) that you will realize the folly of the path you have chosen and instead choose worship of Christ and the eternal life in Heaven He wants you to have.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I'm not guided by what suits me best, my decisions are driven by empathy,

. . . then empathy is what suits you best.

[Question-Everything]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I see a lot of under lying topics cropping up here, time and time again.

1. Hatred
2. Misconstrued understanding
3. Religious zealous
4. Close mindedness
5. Stereotyping
6. Over-riding of the infallible pope's authority/judgement on topics such as homosexuality.
7. Morality

1. I am pleased that in Britain, the Christian church and its followers are kind, hospitable, understanding, non-judgmental, approachable, helpful and take each person (and their belief) at face value. They understand and co-exist with other religions - or non religious folk - and on occasions many different faiths come together and run community fun days for children and adults. All I read here is pure hatred for anyone that does not believe the same as you and/or does not live by the code that your bible says to live by. Even though most of the bible is demorolizing to women, cruel, genocidal and oppressive.

2. The majority of atheists are not out to destroy your religion, although I personally do believe scripture to be human kinds first attempt at understanding the world around them, which, at that time was fine. But, now I see it as an outdated model which needs modernising to move with the zeitgest of the times (but I must stress that I have no problem with people believing what they want). We have come a long way since then, especially in the scientific fields which you seem to have many grievances against, even though it has produced cures for the worst afflictions and diseases (even the computer or mobile phone that you will be reading this on and cursing my soul to eternal hell), it has proven that earth quakes, tsunamis and bad whether have nothing to do with the wrath of God but simple, geological processes. I read once that prominent American evangelist deduced that what happened to New Orleans was God's wrath on a lesbian comedian that lived there, really! Kill thousands because of 1 lesbian? And I gather from some posts here that some - not all - of you may well be inclined to believe that too. Also evolution is not out to destroy religion, although in my eyes it does not seem necessary, I have many Muslim and Christian friends that I have forged long lasting relationships at university that believe it makes God even more beautiful without having to go down the intelligent design road. Also all atheists are not; gay, drug addicts, porn loving who scrounge money and housing off the society. If that were the case then how do you explain the windows program on your laptop designed by Bill Gates, and 90% of the scientific community who give you your medicines, mobile phones, perform surgeries, advanced computer programming, flat screen TV's, micro wave ovens, satalite TV, cars. Everything you touch reeks of science, yet you choose to ignore it rather than embrace it. It is a fact that everything you have in the modern world today is tangible and down to science, yet only a few choose to understand the science behind it. Is that not just plain ignorant?

3. Many comments I have seen here are tantamount to religious fanaticism. Even the cartoon you have in the smiles dropping a bomb on what looks like arabs and jews. come on people, wake up please. You are being cruel beyond belief. Even your religious leader, the pope, condemns many of your actions here such as your homophobic insults.

4. Much of what needs to be said here is in point 2 about the scientific aspects of your lives. We are not out to destroy your religion, feel free to practice your faith but please don't believe everything that is in a 2000 year old book that has been badly translated. And please don't judge others because you are the ones that look bad with racist slurs.

5. Not all atheists are gay, drug taking heathens. I seen one comment claiming atheists are atheists so they can have anal sex. Please! Do you know how ridiculous you sound. Yes you get cheers off your peers here, but they are just as bad.

6. Pretty much self explanatory.

7. Ah, morality. God intervened many times in many stories to stop human sacrifice, the more prominent and most read is Abraham sacrificing his son. But God didn't see fit to intervene when Jephthah BBQ'd his daughter after his slaughter of the Ammonites. This would strike a modern moralist as far from good moral behavior. What about Moses, when he came down from mount Sinai? He is very upset that people are worshiping the golden bull-calf. He instructed his own people to kill each other to purify them selves for worshiping a false idol. The truth of the matter is that the golden bull, is Taurus; the bull from the zodiac (who's age ran from 4300 B.C - 2150 B.C) And Moses represents the age of the ram - Aries - 2150 to 1 A.D This is why Jews today still blow the ram's horn. Now Jesus is the figure that ushers in another new age of the zodiac, pisces - the 2 fish. 1A.D to 2150 A.D. Which we are still in today, I'm sure many of you are familiar with the pisces sign as a fish on the back of your car. Fish, or more precisely 2 fish are abundant in the new testament as I'm sure I don't need explain as it will be tantamount to telling your grandfather about WW1 &2. The 2 Pisces are a pagan astronomical symbol for the sun's kingdom during the age of Pisces (yes sun not son).

At Luke 22:10 when jesus is asked by his disciples, where the last pass over will be. Jesus replies; Behold when ye are entered into the city, there shall a man meet you bearing a pitch of water. Follow him into the house he entereth in. Another revealing astrological event referring to the zodiac, the man is aquarius, the water barer. The age following Pisces through the equinoxes.

Sorry, that was a bit of a ramble then! And my take on things with the available evidence that I have read.

Many apologies to anyone that I have offended during this comment, but after reading the numerous comments on 'what is it like to be an atheist' I felt that I should comment on some of the obscenities that have been produced by 'moderate' Christians and show you the path to enlightenment. For some of you surly live in the dark ages and would probably prosper in the age of the Spanish inquisition.

Atheism is not an attack on any religion, nor is it a religion or faith in it's self. It is simply a modern perspective of the world around us as understood by the peer reviewed and tested evidence that is available. Yes I will agree that there are many atheists out there which are horrid people, there are equally the same amount of horrid people in religion, so you can not draw a line of distinction for morality, good nor bad there. I do not believe that there are many atheists out there that can truly say with 100% accuracy that there is no God, the late great Christopher Hitchens was one of those. But the fact of the matter, as a scientist I can not 100% disprove the existence of any God although I must say that in my eyes it is very improbable. Equally you can not 100% prove that there is a God. Simply quoting scripture is not proof. That was written (and re-written) many times by a human being. And if you don't understand something, simply stating that God done it is not a valid answer either!

My 10 commandments would feature;

1. Do not do to others what you would not want them to do to you.
2. In all things, strive to cause no harm.
3. Treat your fellow human beings, your fellow living things, and the world in general with love, honesty, faithfulness and respect.
4. Do not overlook evil or shrink from administering justice, but always be ready to forgive wrong doing freely admitted and honestly regretted.
5. live life with a sense of joy and wonder.
6. Always seek to be learning something new.
7. Test all things, always check your ideas against the facts, and be ready to discard even a cherished belief if it does not conform to them.
8. Never seek to censor or cut yourself off from dissent; always respect the right of others to disagree with you ( many of you will not see this as valid)
9. Form independent opinions on the basis of your own reason and experience; do not allow yourself to be led blindly by others.
10. Question everything.

An extra four;

11. Enjoy your own sex life (so long as it damages nobody else) and leave others to enjoy theirs in private whatever inclinations, which are none of your business.

12. Do not discriminate or oppress on the basis of sex, race or as far as possible; species.

13. Do not indoctrinate your children. Teach them how to think for themselves, how to evaluate evidence, and how to disagree with you.

14. Value the future on a timescale longer than your own!

I have not come here to 'convert' you, neither will you convert me. But I am simply showing you some of the reasons why I choose not to follow you!

To paraphrase Richard Dawkins (which I'm sure you all want to see burn in hell - very un-Christian of you!)

I can enjoy the wonders and beauty of my garden without believing fairies live at the bottom of it.

I will now sit back and wait for the hate-mail, name calling and other non essential, unproductive idiotic abuse that is surly to follow by the lesser 'Christians' among you on here. And I'm pretty sure the majority won't have read this far before ensuing with their childish jibes. I'm pretty sure that since this is an American forum that someone is likely to call me a fag, which will go to show the mentality of some of the less educated people of this world....

< ---- not very christian!

[Didymus Much]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

...6. Over-riding of the infallible pope's authority/judgement on topics such as homosexuality...

These people aren't Catholics, and Catholics aren't Christians, anyway.

...the Christian church and its followers...

Which Christian church would that be? You do know that there are over 30,000 different ones?

...All I read here is pure hatred for anyone that does not believe the same as you and/or does not live by the code that your bible says to live by...

Guess what the Bible says to do? Read it and find out.

... Even though most of the bible is demorolizing to women, cruel, genocidal and oppressive....

Wait, you have read it? Why are you bitching then?

...2. The majority of atheists are not out to destroy your religion...

Wimps.

..., although I personally do believe scripture to be human kinds first attempt at understanding the world around them, which, at that time was fine. But, now I see it as an outdated model which needs modernising to move with the zeitgest of the times...

Eternal truths can't be eternal?

... (but I must stress that I have no problem with people believing what they want)...

THEN WHY ARE YOU BITCHING AT THESE PEOPLE???

... < ---- not very christian!

You don't know what "Christian" means.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

THEN WHY ARE YOU BITCHING AT THESE PEOPLE???



You don't know what "Christian" means.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: What is it like to be an atheist?

I see a lot of under lying topics cropping up here, time and time again....

Son, throughout all the rambling, did you actually answer my question?