[James Hutchins]

Originally Posted by bethany356

No, I'm not taking satan's side... I don't know... That's why I'm here... because I don't know... Though I do know that I am filled with saddness...

Bethany, from what I know of the details of the story, the little heathen was actually trying to hide out in Church, knowing full well God's position on video games. The little niglet then had the audacity to play the game WHILE IN CHURCH!!!!!!!!!!!
I am surprised God made a miracle bullet pierce the Church roof instead of shooting lightning bolts from eyes of the statute of Jesus but then I am not in management and so can only speculate.

[Noah Dint]

Originally Posted by objectivist

See, I'm just an atheist, so I might be wrong here... but isn't that completely incorrect? I've read a lot of material, including scripture, that suggests humans (including children) don't become angels when they die.

If you are an atheist then you are wrong. Period.

May I suggest you find a different internet playground. We don't play well with your type.

-ND

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Jeb Thurmond

Guns fired in the air don't kill people, God kills people.

Does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers, since by that logic nobody is killed by anybody since it is Gods will that kills anybody? "I didn't suffocate the person, God did, my hands just happened to be around their throat at the time."

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

Does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers, since by that logic nobody is killed by anybody since it is Gods will that kills anybody? "I didn't suffocate the person, God did, my hands just happened to be around their throat at the time."

You're confusing God's laws with man's laws.

Have you ever actually read the Bible?

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Pastor Ezekiel

You're confusing God's laws with man's laws.

Have you ever actually read the Bible?

I fully admit to not reading the entire Bible, only parts of it. But when you follow the Bible so closely and to the letter I was wondering if you believe we should no longer arrest those people who do murderous actions because despite who engaged in the action to murder, it was still Gods will that killed them. Since this post is about a child dying because somebody shot a bullet into the air, should we not try to find out who and take action against them. Unless I am somehow misunderstanding this in which case I apologize in advance for needing further explanation.

[Bobby-Joe]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

I fully admit to not reading the entire Bible, only parts of it.

You expect to have any understand of God's will, how?

You can't intuitively understand it yourself. Just like every other human being, including me, you are utterly depraved and only think of yourself.

Jeremiah 13:23: Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.

Only God knows what is wrong or right and the only source we mortals have to His wisdom is The Bible.

[Cranky Old Man]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

it was still Gods will that killed them.

It is a bit more complicated than that. We are not just God's great puppet show. God does indeed interfere in our afairs, Haiti being a recent example, but we also have free will so a lot of evil is caused by man and not by God.

Life isn't that important anyway. Life is just a test to see if we are allowed in Heaven. Most people fail that test.

[Ezekiel Bathfire]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

Does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers, since by that logic nobody is killed by anybody since it is Gods will that kills anybody? "I didn't suffocate the person, God did, my hands just happened to be around their throat at the time."

Le:24:17: And he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death.

OK?

[Jeb Stuart Thurmond]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

Does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers,

If you can't tell the difference between murderers, and patriots celebrating their Second Amendment rights, you are a sick boy alright.

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Jeb Thurmond

If you can't tell the difference between murderers, and patriots celebrating their Second Amendment rights, you are a sick boy alright.

Now now, watch the childish name calling and lets keep this civil my friend.
But are you saying that as long as somebody accidentally kills another person despite knowing the dangers of what they are doing then it is ok? A person fires a gun in the air because of celebration and a child dies in result. Any person that is allowed to own a gun should know the very basic truth that what goes up must come down, and a bullet is one of these things that can come down and cause harm. So should that person take responsibility or not? Your post states that God killed the child but it was the irresponsible gun owner that actually did, doesn't that mean he killed somebody? Judging by your answer can I assume that you have irresponsibly shot a gun in the air without thinking that there might be a consequence?

And I can only guess that your response or somebody else's could include saying that God guided the bullet, but I am going to state right now that you CANNOT tell me when God does or does intervene with anything like that without also admitting that man needs not take responsibility over their actions.

[Malott]

There is a thin line between a keen eye and a wicked soul.

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Jeb Thurmond

If you can't tell the difference between murderers, and patriots celebrating their Second Amendment rights, you are a sick boy alright.

I am restating this because it proves a very valuable point that I think everybody should know about with the Bible. Here is what I said in response to this.

Now now, watch the childish name calling and lets keep this civil my friend.
But are you saying that as long as somebody accidentally kills another person despite knowing the dangers of what they are doing then it is ok? A person fires a gun in the air because of celebration and a child dies in result. Any person that is allowed to own a gun should know the very basic truth that what goes up must come down, and a bullet is one of these things that can come down and cause harm. So should that person take responsibility or not? Your post states that God killed the child but it was the irresponsible gun owner that actually did, doesn't that mean he killed somebody? Judging by your answer can I assume that you have irresponsibly shot a gun in the air without thinking that there might be a consequence?

And I can only guess that your response or somebody else's could include saying that God guided the bullet, but I am going to state right now that you CANNOT tell me when God does or does intervene with anything like that without also admitting that man needs not take responsibility over their actions.

Now if you could please answer the question directly without insulting me, changing the subject, bringing up something that has already been settled, or sidesteping the question, I would (and so would your followers I am sure) really appreciate it.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

Now if you could please answer the question directly without insulting me, changing the subject, bringing up something that has already been settled, or sidesteping the question, I would (and so would your followers I am sure) really appreciate it.

You're an idiot, and that's not an insult it's the truth.

When really bad things happen (like you get eaten by wild beasts, get killed in war, get sick and die, etc.), then you'll know that it was God that did it to you.

Ezekiel 14:13 Son of man, when the land sinneth against me by trespassing grievously, then will I stretch out mine hand upon it, and will break the staff of the bread thereof, and will send famine upon it, and will cut off man and beast from it:

14:15 If I cause noisome beasts to pass through the land, and they spoil it, so that it be desolate, that no man may pass through because of the beasts:

14:17 Or if I bring a sword upon that land, and say, Sword, go through the land; so that I cut off man and beast from it:

14:19 Or if I send a pestilence into that land, and pour out my fury upon it in blood, to cut off from it man and beast:

14:21 For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my four sore judgments upon Jerusalem, the sword, and the famine, and the noisome beast, and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast?

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Pastor Ezekiel

You're an idiot, and that's not an insult it's the truth.

When really bad things happen (like you get eaten by wild beasts, get killed in war, get sick and die, etc.), then you'll know that it was God that did it to you.

That does not answer the questions that I asked. Nice sidestep though.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

That does not answer the questions that I asked. Nice sidestep though.

Nonsense, the Scripture I quoted answers your stupid question perfectly. God does it all, period, end of story. There is no "chance" or "luck" or "destiny" outside of God's munificence. If you think otherwise you are being deluded by satan, and now you are sowing seeds of discord through your endless prattle and childish attempts to debate God's Divine Plan. Take it elsewhere, butterscotch.

GOD DOES IT ALL. The sooner you swallow that load the better.

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Pastor Ezekiel

Nonsense, the Scripture I quoted answers your stupid question perfectly. God does it all, period, end of story. There is no "chance" or "luck" or "destiny" outside of God's munificence. If you think otherwise you are being deluded by satan, and now you are sowing seeds of discord through your endless prattle and childish attempts to debate God's Divine Plan. Take it elsewhere, butterscotch.

GOD DOES IT ALL. The sooner you swallow that load the better.

You are acting as if I have ever said that God didn't do it all, I was asking you about it.

So, for clarification purposes since as we both know I am a bit slow does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers, since by that logic nobody is killed by anybody since it is Gods will that kills anybody? "I didn't suffocate the person, God did, my hands just happened to be around their throat at the time."

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by ThrustingBoy

You are acting as if I have ever said that God didn't do it all, I was asking you about it.

So, for clarification purposes since as we both know I am a bit slow does that mean that we should no longer arrest murderers, since by that logic nobody is killed by anybody since it is Gods will that kills anybody? "I didn't suffocate the person, God did, my hands just happened to be around their throat at the time."

I've already answered that question. You are being willfully vexatious again, boy.

If God causes a man to murder another in a land that outlaws such behavior, then isn't it obvious that God wants that man to be punished according the secular law? ALL things eminate from God. No exceptions. That doesn't get murderers off the hook.

Unless God wants that to happen.

Unfortunately, secular law does not recognize God omnipresence. Take it up with the God-hating liberals. That's why we're trying to get the U.S. constitution scrapped and the Holy Bible put in it's place.

Now shut up and go read your Bible.

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Pastor Ezekiel

I've already answered that question. You are being willfully vexatious again, boy.

If God causes a man to murder another in a land that outlaws such behavior, then isn't it obvious that God wants that man to be punished according the secular law? ALL things eminate from God. No exceptions. That doesn't get murderers off the hook.

Unless God wants that to happen.

Unfortunately, secular law does not recognize God omnipresence. Take it up with the God-hating liberals. That's why we're trying to get the U.S. constitution scrapped and the Holy Bible put in it's place.

Thank you for this answer I am glad to have gotten somewhere and able to move forward, now a serious question that is obviously raised that I do not believe I am the only that needs this to be explained is the whole "Though shalt not kill" thing. I understand your point on them being arrested and that being Gods will but what about in the afterlife. Since it is Gods will that killed the person is that person (aka everybody who has ever murdered) still sent to Hell?
And yes, I am truly interested in what the answers to my questions are but I hope you understand when I feel that my questions are either changed or avoided.

[Cranky Old Man]

Your reasoning seems to be that if God makes you murder someone you should somehow get a "get out of hell for free" card in exchange. That is not how it works you will still go to hell.

"Hey but that is not fair" I hear you say. And again you would be wrong. There is a reason we keep saying to everyone visiting this forum they should start reading the Holy Bible and start praying to Jesus Christ. It is very important to make sure you are on Gods good side as soon as possible. And do not forget to pray to God to not to make you do something for which you will go to hell.

Amazing how it all makes sense right!

This is also why the trick many atheists come up with, live a life of sin and turn to Jesus at the end of your life, doesn't work. Every second you wait to start reading your Bible and praying to Jesus you risk eternal damnation. Just waiting another second you risk it again.

So when Pastor Ezekiel says "Now shut up and go read your Bible" he does that out of pure True Christian love for you. Our tough love is needed because we know every second counts and we have to save your soul as soon as possible because otherwise it could be too late and you would face eternal damnation. It is a tough job and most visitors of this forum do not appreciate us doing this. But it is all for a good cause and that is what counts.

Now shut up and go read your Bible idiot, otherwise you will burn in hell . You now know why.

[ThrustingBoy]

Originally Posted by Cranky Old Man

Your reasoning seems to be that if God makes you murder someone you should somehow get a "get out of hell for free" card in exchange. That is not how it works you will still go to hell.

"Hey but that is not fair" I hear you say. And again you would be wrong. There is a reason we keep saying to everyone visiting this forum they should start reading the Holy Bible and start praying to Jesus Christ. It is very important to make sure you are on Gods good side as soon as possible. And do not forget to pray to God to not to make you do something for which you will go to hell.

Amazing how it all makes sense right!

This is also why the trick many atheists come up with, live a life of sin and turn to Jesus at the end of your life, doesn't work. Every second you wait to start reading your Bible and praying to Jesus you risk eternal damnation. Just waiting another second you risk it again.

So when Pastor Ezekiel says "Now shut up and go read your Bible" he does that out of pure True Christian love for you. Our tough love is needed because we know every second counts and we have to save your soul as soon as possible because otherwise it could be too late and you would face eternal damnation. It is a tough job and most visitors of this forum do not appreciate us doing this. But it is all for a good cause and that is what counts.

Now shut up and go read your Bible idiot, otherwise you will burn in hell . You now know why.

Thank you, you Cranky Old Man, I once again am starting to like you.
The only thing I have left to say on this subject I think is that maybe you should realize that being mean with this "tough love" and trying to scare people into reading the Bible will only turn people off that much more from reading the Bible. It seems that is all that someone like me sees is "Do as I say or BURN" as soon as we lay eyes on these forums, rather hostile. Just something to keep in mind, that when trying to spread the word, scare tactics only work on people who already believe but has a very very little chance on converting somebody who doesn't.

AAANNNDDDD since I have you in a good mood, and I see you have already been to the Are you and Atheist thread, can you please head back over to the Cucumber thread please and reply to my post, I can't seem to post on there anymore (by either computer error, Pastors hating me, or divine intervention) . I think my question (or at least my point) on there is very clear in my last post. And if you could bring the whole "YOU ARE GOING TO BURN IN HELL" thing to a halt I would appreciate it, that sort of talk just makes me want to go do something else since it does not help answer any questions, I think it is safe to say that I understand you think, or know, or whatever word you wish to use, that I am going to burn.