[Nobar King]

Re: Goodbye

Innocent until proven guilty.

I hope you realize that this is a church forum and not a legal forum.

[WrongGwendolyn]

Re: Goodbye

He asked how I knew the executed people in the witch trials were innocent and I told him. Besides, I'm sure people held court in Biblical times whenever someone was accused of a crime. If not, wow... I want to go back in time and yell 'murder' at someone just to see them get hung without a trial.

[Redeemed Papist]

Re: Goodbye

But wait! She read The Crucible which is a work of fiction at school and therefore knows all there is to know about the subject. We must bow to the knowledge of a person who bases her ideas about the world on words in a book written by someone who made it all up.

[Jack O'fagan]

Re: Goodbye

He asked how I knew the executed people in the witch trials were innocent and I told him. Besides, I'm sure people held court in Biblical times whenever someone was accused of a crime. If not, wow... I want to go back in time and yell 'murder' at someone just to see them get hung without a trial.

No. God has said that two or three have to shout 'murder'.

Deuteronomy 17:6 At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.

YIC

Jack

[WrongGwendolyn]

Re: Goodbye

The man who wrote the Crucible did his research beforehand. Really, look it up... He exaggerated a bit, made an entertaining story out of it, but 19 people were hung and there was no evidence they were ever witches.
As for the part with the girls... I'm pretty sir that's historically true too, but it was only two of them. Their names were Betty and Mary, two cousins.
Hold on, let me make sure... Since the Bible was written way before the witchhunt happened, I'm afraid I can't cite it. This must be terribly disappointing for you all, but I would if I could.
Okay, yes. It was two girls who started throwing huge, unexplainable fits that were beyond anything doctors of the time had seen. Coincidentally, other women of the village start doing the same. It just devolved into total madness... but that's religion for you.
There, I went and researched it instead of relying just on what I read in the book and saw in the movie. But from what I can gather... they were hung on an 'I'm pretty sure they're witches'.
Fun fact, the first three accused were a female begger, a black woman, and a woman who rarely attended church. I love theocracies and their sexism.

[Redeemed Papist]

Re: Goodbye

The man who wrote the Crucible did his research beforehand. Really, look it up... He exaggerated a bit, made an entertaining story out of it, but 19 people were hung and there was no evidence they were ever witches.
As for the part with the girls... I'm pretty sir that's historically true too, but it was only two of them. Their names were Betty and Mary, two cousins.
Hold on, let me make sure... Since the Bible was written way before the witchhunt happened, I'm afraid I can't cite it. This must be terribly disappointing for you all, but I would if I could.
Okay, yes. It was two girls who started throwing huge, unexplainable fits that were beyond anything doctors of the time had seen. Coincidentally, other women of the village start doing the same. It just devolved into total madness... but that's religion for you.
There, I went and researched it instead of relying just on what I read in the book and saw in the movie. But from what I can gather... they were hung on an 'I'm pretty sure they're witches'.
Fun fact, the first three accused were a female begger, a black woman, and a woman who rarely attended church. I love theocracies and their sexism.

Right... so you have faith in this fiction book as a reliable witness to past events? That's the oddest thing I ever heard.

[Billy Bob Jenkins]

Re: Goodbye

they were hung on an 'I'm pretty sure they're witches'.

That is more than enough. The Bible says "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live." That means if you cannot prove that they are not a witch, then you have to execute them, as you cannot allow even a single witch to slip past you.

Exodus 22:18

King James Version (KJV)

18Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

It does NOT say, "when in doubt, let the witch go, because it is better to let a guilty witch go than to execute an innocent person." It says "thou shalt not suffer A witch to live." That means not even one witch can survive.

[Faith_Machine]

Re: Goodbye

This must be terribly disappointing for you all...

The only thing I'm disappointed about is the fact that you've been a member of this forum since February 19, yet still haven't accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior.

What is the holdup? I would have thought you'd have been saved by now.

[WrongGwendolyn]

Re: Goodbye

Right... so you have faith in this fiction book as a reliable witness to past events? That's the oddest thing I ever heard.

I went and researched it as well, or did you not read that part? I didn't rely just on the book. I love history, it is really fascinating. We should all learn from our past mistakes.
While we're on the subject of history, does anyone have any interesting tidbits they'd like to share, or shall we just move on to something else now? I vote that we all start imagining what sort of punishment God has in store for me. The more creative, the better.
I think it'll have something to do with a really sharp pitchfork... some shackles... and an endless loop of Rick Astley singing 'Never Gonna Give You Up' while I beg for it to end.
Ideas?

[Bill R. Briscoe]

Re: Goodbye

I think it'll have something to do with a really sharp pitchfork... some shackles... and an endless loop of Rick Astley singing 'Never Gonna Give You Up' while I beg for it to end.
Ideas?

Why would we want to indulge your lurid fantasies about eternal damnation if we're the ones trying to avoid it? Revel in your own future on your own time.

Also, the Salem Witch Trials were just that ...trials. I'm not sure why you seem to be convinced they were innocent. This was before the constitution was even written, so innocent until proven guilty doesn't even apply (not that it does anyway, since it's nowhere in the constitution). A moot point at this juncture, but one I felt needed to be made nonetheless.

[Redeemed Papist]

Re: Goodbye

I went and researched it as well, or did you not read that part? I didn't rely just on the book. I love history, it is really fascinating. We should all learn from our past mistakes.
While we're on the subject of history, does anyone have any interesting tidbits they'd like to share, or shall we just move on to something else now? I vote that we all start imagining what sort of punishment God has in store for me. The more creative, the better.
I think it'll have something to do with a really sharp pitchfork... some shackles... and an endless loop of Rick Astley singing 'Never Gonna Give You Up' while I beg for it to end.
Ideas?

You're trying to be funny about something that is deeply horrifying. The vast majority of people alive today or that have ever lived are burning/going to burn in Hell. How is this a laughing matter?

This atheist brainwashing leads people to be very nasty indeed!

That's quite sick.

[WrongGwendolyn]

Re: Goodbye

The only thing I'm disappointed about is the fact that you've been a member of this forum since February 19, yet still haven't accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior.

What is the holdup? I would have thought you'd have been saved by now.

I guess you just aren't doing a good job of convincing me. Your only reasoning comes from the Bible. And your only argument of the Bible being true comes from... none other than the Bible itself. Not very convincing to me.
Say I were to write a book. A book that explains in full detail how the Earth was created and what the creator has in mind for the things there, and then sets very precise laws and morals for them. And multiple times, this book says that those that believe in it will be saved, and those who do not will be condemned, from some eternal punishment after death.
My book says it's true, right? I guess that would make it true, by your logic.
What exactly is in the Bible that convinces you it's true? Not trying to flat-out say you're wrong, but I just want to know why you follow it. There may be hope for me yet, it may be good for you to test out all your best converting techniques.

Oh, and Bill... I dunno, it's just that you all seem to love talking about the tortures waiting for people, and I wanted to keep conversation flowing. Very well, I will revel in my future. Hmm... I see a nice ranchette with plenty of space, a decent income, and a pasture with a horse in it. Okay, I'm done, moving on, it shall never be mentioned again.

[Pastor William Nathaniel Sampson]

Re: Goodbye

I guess you just aren't doing a good job of convincing me. Your only reasoning comes from the Bible. And your only argument of the Bible being true comes from... none other than the Bible itself. Not very convincing to me.
Say I were to write a book. A book that explains in full detail how the Earth was created and what the creator has in mind for the things there, and then sets very precise laws and morals for them. And multiple times, this book says that those that believe in it will be saved, and those who do not will be condemned, from some eternal punishment after death.
My book says it's true, right? I guess that would make it true, by your logic.

The Bible has 40 different authors written over the course of thousands of years. Your metaphor fails.

[Capt. Aaron Portway]

Re: Goodbye

FIVE WHOLE PAGES OF BLAH BLAH BLAH . . .

I thought you were leaving . . .

[WrongGwendolyn]

Re: Goodbye

I thought you were leaving . . .

I changed my mind, the conversation here is quite engaging and I couldn't bear the thought of leaving you all behind.
Pastor, allow me to add onto what you have said, then. The Bible was written by forty people, huh? When? A very long time ago, in a language you do not even speak, yet you believe that you know exactly what it means? You must be a master of Hebrew, then.
And it has been altered so many times over the years... how do we know what was changed, added, removed, or left alone?