[Pastor Ed Lowman]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Because I'm trying to understand why you so fervently believe in it. There must be a better reason than "because it says so."

I have no question in the quality of your faith in your religion, it is outstanding and remarkable - I just want to understand why.

I'll be happy to tell you why I believe. I was taught to believe in God, the God of the Bible, and this God says we are all sinners and worthless in his sight unless we do everything He says when He says it. We are all born sinners and can do nothing good of our own, which means we have no self-confidence or self-esteem or self-worth without this Almighty Lord and Master telling us we are good and accepting us on HIS terms alone.

The Bible teaches these things, friend. If you'd read it, you, too, would know that...

"Without me, ye can do nothing." (John 15:5)

I came here asking about your religion and all I really got back was "You're a fag, Satanist scum." which to me is incredibly closed minded. Obviously that's paraphrased somewhat but you get the idea. If someone else came up to you asking about your faith, in general terms, you instantly rebuke them? I introduced myself and what I believe in right now and the majority of you just lash out with no consideration that your fine examples so far have any relevance on the outcome of whether my faith may change or not.

The reason for that is that you are stepping back and judging us (without Biblical authority - John 7:24) and acting like some homer, just "reflecting" and "observing" and doing other gay things. You act like you are better than us, and what's more, better than God. This is what has welcomed rebukings. We are trying to let you know that you are nothing special. Hell awaits unless you submit yourself to the Law of God.

"For there is no respect of persons with God" (Romans 2:11)

Pastor Ed

[gareth the fool]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

I'll be happy to tell you why I believe. I was taught to believe in God, the God of the Bible, and this God says we are all sinners and worthless in his sight unless we do everything He says when He says it. We are all born sinners and can do nothing good of our own, which means we have no self-confidence or self-esteem or self-worth without this Almighty Lord and Master telling us we are good and accepting us on HIS terms alone.

The Bible teaches these things, friend. If you'd read it, you, too, would know that...

"Without me, ye can do nothing." (John 15:5)

And you never once doubted?

I'm not question you or your religion here. I'm asking about your personal experience.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Because I'm trying to understand why you so fervently believe in it. There must be a better reason than "because it says so."

I have no question in the quality of your faith in your religion, it is outstanding and remarkable - I just want to understand why. I came here asking about your religion and all I really got back was "You're a fag, Satanist scum." which to me is incredibly closed minded. Obviously that's paraphrased somewhat but you get the idea. If someone else came up to you asking about your faith, in general terms, you instantly rebuke them? I introduced myself and what I believe in right now and the majority of you just lash out with no consideration that your fine examples so far have any relevance on the outcome of whether my faith may change or not.

No one has said such things, and no one has treated you badly. You are a liar.

This is a Private Christian forum, and you waltzed in here unsaved, uninvited and unwelcome, claiming that you just want to "understand" True Christianity(tm), and arguing all the time. I have posted links designed for new posters to gain that understanding, and I have explained to you on several occasons that you should USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION before posting questions, because most likely some other heathen has started a thread on the same subject.

You are the one being rude. Shape up or ship out, fool.

[Pastor Ed Lowman]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

And you never once doubted?

I'm not question you or your religion here. I'm asking about your personal experience.

Jesus leaves no room for doubt. Damnation for disbelief is a very Biblical doctrine (Mark 16:15-16). When you serve God our Father who must get his way all the time, you learn to quench any doubt by reading the bible miracles (Mark 9:24).

God made an ax-head float (2 Kings 6:1-7) and dry bones come to life (Ezekiel 37:1-14). These and the many other Biblical miracles should convince any skeptic of God's pure and undefiled Truth(tm).

Pastor Ed

[gareth the fool]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Shove it heathen, we don't need your kind here. Go sell your craziness somewhere else, we have the Lord to comfort us. What do you have?

Who cares?

You sound like a False Christian fool. You have been buggered before haven't you (voluntarily?)

Your lies are so poorly disguised, I wouldn't even call you a false prophet. A false prophet at least outwardly resembles a prophet. You are just a delusional liar.

I think we've got a troll on our hands, folks. Nobody is this stupid for real.

You mean to say all of that was said for fun? I have not once lied about anything I have said. In summation of EVERYTHING I have said:

I believe in God and Jesus.
I do not believe in the words of Men.
Men are capable of being selfish and teaching what only THEY think SHOULD be taught.

And here is what I have learnt from everything you collectively have said:
I can apparently never be a Christian and believe in the bible, because it's what you think.
I am apparently gay.
People can be malicious because they choose to read what I have written as offensive. You. Have. Chosen. So. I did not say anything out of turn, or argue against anything you have said. I have questioned why you have said them.

I have also learnt that some of you here are capable of reasoning out a good argument with me, without resorting to just insulting me. I have learnt some of you are kind regardless of others.





And I did read your posts and guidelines, and have followed them. If you wish to find me specific examples of where I have violated any of them please inform me so - without being harsh about it. If I've made a genuine mistake then I apologise, but I believe most reactions here are because what people have read has been influenced by others posts and their interpretations or by other peoples interpretations.

[gareth the fool]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

More to the point, I am not the kind of person to just be told things and accept them. I need to know why. Some things can't just be done that way. There has to be reasons.

And yes, I did just turn up here uninvited by any of you. None of you know me. But I am unwelcome? Scroll up to the top of your screen for the forums and read what it says in your header. That is the view of your church. What you have written is your personal view. If you don't like what I write, then don't read them.


Pastor Ed Lowman, thank you for replying honestly. I appreciate what you've said and it does connect with me, but just to clarify something - as I'm just as susceptible to misinterpretation - part of your faith is derived from fear of God? Again I'm not looking to incite argument with you - but the wording of what you wrote implies fear of God's wrath, which I can understand truth be told, but I don't understand how God can be considered wholly good when you can be afraid of him.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Scroll up to the top of your screen for the forums and read what it says in your header. That is the view of your church.

Yes, scroll up and read what it says at the very top of the page.

UNSAVED UNWELCOME

[Zechariah Smyth]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

It says "Unsaved Unwelcome" at the top of the screen.

It's common for Jesus-haters to read what they WANT to read.

Yours in Christ,

Z. Smyth

[gareth the fool]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

It says "Unsaved Unwelcome" at the top of the screen.

It's common for Jesus-haters to read what they WANT to read.

Yours in Christ,

Z. Smyth

Well that is rather odd, I'm rather certain it originally said welcome, not UNwelcome. Oh well, I guess I shall be on my way out then. I enjoyed the discussion while it lasted however, truly.

Still, I guess it is time to come clean. I'm actually black, a woman and a lesbian. And I am a Satanist too.



Regardless of such, those of you that took the time to write formal replies I do have the utmost respect of you, and my arguments made here were sincere and written without malice. As of such I have respect for you and your patience.

For the rest of you however, I think I'll be seeing you in hell, regardless of your beliefs.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Well that is rather odd, I'm rather certain it originally said welcome, not UNwelcome. Oh well, I guess I shall be on my way out then. I enjoyed the discussion while it lasted however, truly.

Still, I guess it is time to come clean. I'm actually black, a woman and a lesbian. And I am a Satanist too.



Regardless of such, those of you that took the time to write formal replies I do have the utmost respect of you, and my arguments made here were sincere and written without malice. As of such I have respect for you and your patience.

For the rest of you however, I think I'll be seeing you in hell, regardless of your beliefs.

A lying troll. I rest my case.

[Zechariah Smyth]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.



Another rugmunching atheist negress...there must be a factory somewhere.



Yours in Christ,

Z. Smyth

[Didymus Much]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

...I believe in God and Jesus.
I do not believe in the words of Men...

By "the words of Men", I understand you mean the Bible.

If you discount the Bible, how do you even know of the existence of God and/or Jesus, let alone Their wills/wishes/requirements?

...Men are capable of being selfish and teaching what only THEY think SHOULD be taught...

Oooh, right back at ya.

[Christianzionist]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Well in all actuality I suppose the God depicted in the Torah is most similar unto my perceived God. However even there, the strictures of Judaism are binding much like other religions.

I suppose what I take to heart most from Judaism is YHWH, in that god is "one". If I look at most modern day religions and cut out the scripture placed by Men, all that is left is the word of God and there are surprising similarities in what he has directly said throughout multiple samples of religious cultures. So the implication of YHWH to me is that no matter what religion you follow, God is God, universally the same just interpreted by different people at different times in different cultures. This is why I don't support a particular recognised faith of today, too much is muddied by the words of Men that the messages of God are often forgotten, belittled or manipulated in their interpretation amongst the myriad number of other articles of faith. I shall have to work up a summary of God's direct teachings from multiple religions to compare them for scrutiny's sake.

You shouldn't praise jooz so much, they are polytheists: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shekhinah#Sabbath_Bride

Clearly, God is three in one, like a six pack cut down the middle.

How is this difficult to understand?

[Ezekiel Bathfire]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Well in all actuality I suppose the God depicted in the Torah is most similar unto my perceived God.

Are you a Jew? They are weird - they refuse to accept Christ as God and commit the final unforgivable sin of denying the Holy Spirit. Personally, I think it is because they can't get their thick heads around the simple concept of The Holy Trinity being Three-In-One.

However even there, the strictures of Judaism are binding much like other religions.

Are the strictures of man or Of God?

I suppose what I take to heart most from Judaism is YHWH, in that god is "one".

Yes, that's right, The Trinity is One... I said that.

If I look at most modern day religions and cut out the scripture placed by Men, all that is left is the word of God

God uses His Servants (mankind) to do His Most Perfect Writing - He very rarely writes himself (you must have relatives like that) He did write the Commandments and on the Wall of Nebuchadnezzar's palace though.

As a consequence, you know that the 10 Commandments (all 613 of them) are actually God's Word. You say it is important to follow God's and not men's Word. If you follow the 10 Commandments, then you obey God and thus worship Him: so what's this crap about rejecting the parts of the Bible that you don't like?

and there are surprising similarities in what he has directly said throughout multiple samples of religious cultures.

Proof of God! It's just that savages are unable to grasp the whole message. Are you a savage?

So the implication of YHWH to me is that no matter what religion you follow, God is God, universally the same just interpreted by different people at different times in different cultures.

But Yahweh is the One True God? Yes? And He has a Son, Jesus? Yes?

This is why I don't support a particular recognised faith of today, too much is muddied by the words of Men that the messages of God are often forgotten, belittled or manipulated in their interpretation amongst the myriad number of other articles of faith.

But if everyone agreed with you, they would be following your faith. Your faith is the Word of Man (i.e. you!). So you are following the Word of Man that you say you should not follow????

I shall have to work up a summary of God's direct teachings from multiple religions to compare them for scrutiny's sake.

Don't bother with that, instead, tell me what you don't believe about God's Direct Words - The 10 Commandments.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Re: Hello, I am Tempered.

Reverend Rodimer, thank you for taking the time to write an insightful reply, it is very much appreciated. I'm writing this off of my phone as we speak, so I can't use some of the forum features like the quote button. Still, bear with me:

You said in reply to me that if god did not want to torment me forever, he could just as easily find another way to deal with me (paraphrased) but if that is true then God can't be wholly good? To wish suffering on others is bad enough, but to damn them to eternal torment when he know's some will not follow him regardless seems a far throw from Good.

Omnibenevolence is not a Biblical concept. It is an invention of lying false-christian pastors who want to tell people happy lies so they will come back each week and give money.

I do believe in a God, and I suppose he does not have any defined rules because none have been established. This is in context to the bible which has stricture defining what you can and can not do. However that doesn't mean God has no play in my life. What I mean is that because I believe there is a greater power in the universe, it motivates me to do good and be the best that I can be.

Then don't call your imaginary "greater power" "God". That's the name of a specific deity, the Christian god is called "God". That's why it's capitalized; it's a proper noun.

Call the figment of your imagination something else. "Conscience", maybe. "Snuffleupagus" would work, as he's supposed to be imaginary.

I don't disagree with the bible . . . I wholeheartedly follow Jesus' writings, and I guess this sentiment arose when I took all of Jesus' sayings, just what he said, and then read them.

So when He said that the entirety of the [Old Testament] Law was still in effect, and that someone guilty in one point was guilty of all, you believe Him?

When He said not to fear those with the power to kill, but rather to fear God who has power to kill and cast into Hell, you believe Him?

Your words in other posts conflict with your assertion that you "wholeheartedly follow" Jesus' teachings.

And friend, Jesus has no writings. The earliest Gospel was written several decades after His Resurrection.

Jesus was just a man, with the true spirit of God. If he was not, then he would not have died.

So you also do not believe His teaching that He and God are one, and that He would (and did) return.

How does that work with "wholeheartedly following" His teachings?