[ScienceisforFools]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

-One hears that the Bible is God's Word.
-One reads the Bible and finds that it says it is God's Word.
-One comes to experience the Bible and receives the Holy Spirit and confirms that it is God's Word.

How is that a circular argument?

We could change this...

-One hears that the Qur’an is Allah's Word.
-One reads the Qur’an and finds that it says it is Allah’s Word.
-One comes to experience the Qur’an and receives the Holy Spirit and confirms that it is Allah's Word

I'm sorry but how is "the bible is true because it says its true" not a circular argument?

You just perfectly illustrated circular logic, there. The problem is that you'll have to step outside of your own system of perceiving reality to see it, probably. First line is hearing a claim. Second line is observing where the claim comes from. Third line is a fallacious bare assertion, which cannot lead to the conclusion given, yet it does.

[Basilissa]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

Do not compare The Only Word of God with vain babbling of an illiterate camel herder.

I'm sorry but how is "the bible is true because it says its true" not a circular argument?

No, because we have no reason to doubt our Merciful Lord. I'ts not circular reasoning, it's simply faith in our Lord.

[ScienceisforFools]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

No, because we have no reason to doubt our Merciful Lord. I'ts not circular reasoning, it's simply faith in our Lord.

I have faith that this argument is not circular, therefore it's not circular. You must be a theologian.

Actually, that is a circular argument regardless of whether you have reason to doubt whoever it is you think exists. Saying "X is true because X is true" is circular reasoning regardless of what that X is. This point is all non-Christians do doubt your "Merciful Lord", therefore, it's only your opinion that you have no reason to doubt your "Merciful God". And frankly, you'd call it circular reasoning if I said "The Book of Zoop the alien god is true because the Book of Zoop the alien god SAYS it's true."

[Basilissa]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

I have faith that this argument is not circular, therefore it's not circular. You must be a theologian.

Actually, that is a circular argument regardless of whether you have reason to doubt whoever it is you think exists. Saying "X is true because X is true" is circular reasoning regardless of what that X is. This point is all non-Christians do doubt your "Merciful Lord", therefore, it's only your opinion that you have no reason to doubt your "Merciful God".

No, it's not just my opinion, I have an actual piece of evidence - the Holy Bible.

And frankly, you'd call it circular reasoning if I said "The Book of Zoop the alien god is true because the Book of Zoop the alien god SAYS it's true."

You could, but it would be a lie (for which you would go to Hell; e.g., Proverbs 6:16-19, Revelation 21:8), because there is no such a thing, it would be made up.

Why would anybody follow something made up?

[Jack O'fagan]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

Atheists always make me laugh. They say that Noah never built an ark but if that was the case then no animals would have survived the flood. They just don't think things through.

YIC

Jack

[Scientist!]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

Atheists always make me laugh. They say that Noah never built an ark but if that was the case then no animals would have survived the flood. They just don't think things through.

There was no great flood in the first place. Christians just don't think things through.

[Dr Laurence Niles]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

There was no great flood in the first place. Christians just don't think things through.

Nice assertion. Care to back that up with evidence?

God bless.

[Scientist!]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

Care to back that up with evidence?

No valid or sound evidence that it did literally happen. You'd think that you if there was a literal global flood, there would be OBVIOUS evidence which all scientists, particularly geologists, would agree upon. But there is no evidence to support the literal interpretation of the Noah's Ark story.

[Gospel of Truth]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

No valid or sound evidence that it did literally happen. You'd think that you if there was a literal global flood, there would be OBVIOUS evidence which all scientists, particularly geologists, would agree upon. But there is no evidence to support the literal interpretation of the Noah's Ark story.

Look, I don't know much about this either as I have come here to learn. However, I guess that someone must have found some letters or story books written ages ago that mention some kind of giant flood happening. Maybe God hid all the actual evidence of this flood as a way of testing our faith.

[Mary Etheldreda]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

No valid or sound evidence that it did literally happen. You'd think that you if there was a literal global flood, there would be OBVIOUS evidence which all scientists, particularly geologists, would agree upon. But there is no evidence to support the literal interpretation of the Noah's Ark story.

Did you think the OP littered a desert floor with whale bones just so he could post this thread?

That's ridiculous.

[Redeemed Papist]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

GLORY AND ALLELUIA, FRIENDS. THIS IS A GREAT DAY!

My witnessing about the whales has borne fruit. The scientards were busy spreading their millions of years tosh once again in this link.

https://www.facebook.com/whales.org/posts/10152746630049632

Apparently some whale was found 459 miles from the ocean but will the scientists concede defeat and accept this is the work of Noah's flood? No!

But straight away some prayer warriors have launched an attack on these scientifical fools and told them straight how wrong they are.

Praise Jesus! Not long now until He comes again.

[god lover jim]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

it offends me greatly that the liberals and the homers could teach our chilren that the great flood never happenbut i know these naysayers will burn in hell

[MitzaLizalor]

Re: Flood confirmed! Whale graveyard in desert! How else could it be so?

I'm sorry but how is "the bible is true because it says its true" not a circular argument?

You just perfectly illustrated circular logic, there. The problem is that you'll have to step outside of your own system of perceiving reality to see it, probably. First line is hearing a claim. Second line is observing where the claim comes from. Third line is a fallacious bare assertion, which cannot lead to the conclusion given, yet it does.

We are not following that paradigm at all. Now admittedly we have a claim. And as a next step, sure! Who wouldn't want to know where the claim originated?

Attempting to stay on topic, let's take the claim of mountains being covered with water. When exploring other claims, the laws of motion, say, what do investigators actually do? I'm thinking of my sewing machine but any other example would do and it's quite an old machine but hasn't worn out despite several owners. The wheel spins around and the needle goes up and down and the thread gets fed in but the needle doesn't continue in motion at the top of its stroke and fly through the ceiling. The reason is because whoever designed the thing could check Isaac Newton's work and I guess do some sums and come up with a sufficiently robust thingy to constrain the needle's trajectory towards the ceiling and reverse its motion. I could go and read Newton but that is superfluous because the design works very well. There are similarities between Newton and Archimedes but any sewing machines back then would have come from Heron, the Alexandrian, some of whose designs are still in use.

When we consider the flood, there are a number of factors to include and multiple sources, so rather than filibustering within our own system of perceiving reality we indeed do the same as when investigating the sewing machine from a scientific perspective. For doubters I could trace the path of knowledge and experience from Archimedes to Heron to Newton and on to Isaac Singer and in the same way, stepping outside one's own system of perceiving reality and comparing the witness and experience and learning and knowledge of others is imperative. This has already been done, with a similar time frame covered leading up to Heron's era and addressing even more authors' contributions than from Heron to Singer.

Peter was writing during the life of Heron and had investigated many false claims. He was able to determine from his study and from his instruction that the earth existed in water and that there was sufficient available historically for by the world that then was to be overflowed and to perish.

One of his sources was Jesus Nazareth. The same information is available to us, indeed more information as the discovery of whale bones verifies what Peter confirmed and what Jesus taught. In His lectures the testimony was consistent and recorded for us to investigate. We don't just have to take Peter's word for it! Luke was a doctor, an educated man, a fluent writer, an eyewitness and collator of evidence in two published works we have available to investigate. He recorded Jesus’ information about the period in question. Humans at the time ate and drank, produced offspring, but did so in an ill-considered way. Jesus confirmed that during the time of Lot similar activities were underway. But we don't need to stop there either.

Moses recorded events from an earlier period and just as Newton could have read up on Archimedes had his work been available at the time, so could Jesus or Luke or Peter refer to Moses. We can do that too. What we find is a consistent description exactly matching the archaeological record, for those interested, with ruins around the Dead Sea just as described from the time of Lot, massive sedimentary layers from the time of Noah and water creatures that had swum to mountain tops but become stranded. That would need a fairly rapid abating of the water, just as recorded by Moses and confirmed by Jesus centuries later.

These multiple sources, published works, teachings and even archaeology all concur. The flood is confirmed. When considering how many cubic miles of water are involved here it's possible to glean the magnitude of the turmoil. Perhaps the bones of sea creatures remaining on mountains suggest how dire the turbulence was deeper down! But to claim that scoffers, identified by Peter, should carry the day after so disparate a legacy as they've produced between them contradicting one another, proposing theories and fancies such as their phlogiston malarky not so long ago or the idea that alkyl nitrites engendered AIDS (both debunked now) not to mention a motherlode of nonsense in the "pending" basket – well, you might as well have said my sewing machine would never work due to the momentum of its needle!

And yet it does.